Scottish independence

[KenTheLandlord]

He just happens to have a view point and opinion that differs from yours.
It doesn't automatically make him a racist a bigot or xenophobic .
That's the problem with you lefties: zero tolerance to a viewpoint or perspective that differs from yours.

no, he hates Muslims and believes he is being mistreated by whole races of people we have been in union with for hundreds of years, despite legislation and reality making this impossible. I'm more than happy to tolerate people with differing viewpoints if they can back them up with facts and not sweeping stereotypes, not the old Muslims banned Xmas crap that never happened to anyone.

absolute bollocks
I use Muslims as an example as they are the minority who are driving for English law to be change to suit their wishes.
I think all religions are ludicrous but Jews don't appear to want English law changed to suit them.
I am against any minority who wants to change this Country and its traditions Catholics don't walk around with their faces hidden.
and as far as other members of the union all I have ever said is the English should be treated EXACTLY the same as the Jocks etc, not better just the same.

I am very tolerant of anyone who wants to come to this country to improve their lot but not at the expense of our culture.
anyone who comes here should except and respect our culture Muslims seem to have a massive problem with this
a large percentage don't even speak our language

You say "I think all religions are ludicrous" yet here you say "anyone who comes here should except (i think you mean accept) and respect our culture", mmm England and the UK is traditionally Christian country, yet you think religions are ludicrous. Are you saying the traditions of England are ludicrous? in which case which flight would you liked to be booked on, for your "fuck off home if you don't like it" stance?

Also where are the English treated differently from the Scots?

 

[Metal Biker]

Can we stay on topic here and discuss Salmond's "threat" about pushing for a unilateral declaration of independence and what the connotations of that would be?

I'm sure there are plenty of other threads on Bluemoon discussing Muslims Bad/Good, immigrants Bad/Good and all the usual guff where one person demonises an entire group of people based on little or no fact and then other self-righteous people demonise them for holding those views which bores the hell out of everyone.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

First of all IF that is what the Tories are going to do then it's quite clearly wrong because major constitutional change in England should not be passed as a fag packet amendment to the Scottish devo max bill.
On Major constitutional change you must try at first to get consensus agreement from as many parties first and then put the issue to a vote. If you don't do that then each party could simply when in office reverse the constitutional changes made by it's predecessor .
The same process should have been gone through for the Scottish devo max issue, but it wasn't. It was indeed a fag packet vow signed by the three party leaders and as such they should commit to pass it without condition ,or if they can't then face the consequences.
The Tories may do what you are suggesting for electoral and political advantage but it would be wrong.
Two wrongs do not make a right.

But how would it be wrong if Labour and the Lib Dems are forced to agree with it?

I know you personally wouldn't be a huge fan as it works against your political ideals.

To answer your specific question, it would not be wrong if Labour and Lib Dems were 'forced' ( for 'political reasons', not involving coercion or foul means obviously) to agree with it. in such a situation it could only be agreed in principle - there is not a cat in hell's chance of agreeing the complex legislation before the end of this parliament, even assuming agreement in principle.
HOWEVER , Labour are not going to agree to it, so as I see it ,the Scottish Devomax will go through Parliament (Cameron cannot renege on this),and then Cameron will have to make a pledge in the Tory party manifesto regarding an English Parliament and Labour will also have to put their proposals in their manifesto. And then we the Voters can chose.

Yeah, coz they follow through their manifesto promises don't they?

 

[blueinsa]

So, Mr "will you accept the will of the sovereign people" Salmond is now making threats that goes against a will just expressed democratically I see.

The man is a bigger fucking joke than I first thought and obviously not to be taken seriously anymore.

Laughing stock!

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

So, Mr "will you accept the will of the sovereign people" Salmond is now making threats that goes against a will just expressed democratically I see.

The man is a bigger fucking joke than I first thought and obviously not to be taken seriously anymore.

Laughing stock!

Only because the people of Scotland were sold a lie about Devo Max and its timescales for implementation. That Lie (the vow made by George Brown) possibly swung the vote by the 5% needed ......no wonder he's pissed off

 

[blueinsa]

So, Mr "will you accept the will of the sovereign people" Salmond is now making threats that goes against a will just expressed democratically I see.

The man is a bigger fucking joke than I first thought and obviously not to be taken seriously anymore.

Laughing stock!

Only because the people of Scotland were sold a lie about Devo Max and its timescales for implementation. That Lie (the vow made by George Brown) possibly swung the vote by the 5% needed ......no wonder he's pissed off

Bullshit. He had 2 fucking years to get answers to major questions and was still making it up as he went along when it came to currency etc yet he expects devo max within 24 hours of a no vote lol? He also wanted 18 months after a yes vote to get his own eggs all in one basket before going it alone.

The man is a fucking joke and a hypocritical one at that.

 

[M18CTID]

no, he hates Muslims and believes he is being mistreated by whole races of people we have been in union with for hundreds of years, despite legislation and reality making this impossible. I'm more than happy to tolerate people with differing viewpoints if they can back them up with facts and not sweeping stereotypes, not the old Muslims banned Xmas crap that never happened to anyone.

absolute bollocks
I use Muslims as an example as they are the minority who are driving for English law to be change to suit their wishes.
I think all religions are ludicrous but Jews don't appear to want English law changed to suit them.
I am against any minority who wants to change this Country and its traditions Catholics don't walk around with their faces hidden.
and as far as other members of the union all I have ever said is the English should be treated EXACTLY the same as the Jocks etc, not better just the same.

I am very tolerant of anyone who wants to come to this country to improve their lot but not at the expense of our culture.
anyone who comes here should except and respect our culture Muslims seem to have a massive problem with this
a large percentage don't even speak our language

You say "I think all religions are ludicrous" yet here you say "anyone who comes here should except (i think you mean accept) and respect our culture", mmm England and the UK is traditionally Christian country, yet you think religions are ludicrous. Are you saying the traditions of England are ludicrous? in which case which flight would you liked to be booked on, for your "fuck off home if you don't like it" stance?

Also where are the English treated differently from the Scots?

Oh, behave ffs. England and the UK may well be traditionally Christian, but most of the so-called "indigenous" population of the UK are not practising Christians. I'm quite sure when whp mentioned "respecting our culture" he wasn't specifically referring to our religious culture but moreso other aspects of UK culture. So why you're pulling him up on his view that "all religions are ludicrous" is beyond me - if anything at least he isn't discriminating against any particular religion by calling all religions "ludicrous" and he also stated in an earlier post that while he holds that view he also respects the right of people to practise whatever religion they want.

 

[NeilYoungIsBack]

Someone has started an e-petition for an English parliament...

<a class="postlink" href="http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/68744" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/68744</a>

 

[cibaman]

So, Mr "will you accept the will of the sovereign people" Salmond is now making threats that goes against a will just expressed democratically I see.

The man is a bigger fucking joke than I first thought and obviously not to be taken seriously anymore.

Laughing stock!

Only because the people of Scotland were sold a lie about Devo Max and its timescales for implementation. That Lie (the vow made by George Brown) possibly swung the vote by the 5% needed ......no wonder he's pissed off

We'll never know whether Brown's intervention swung the vote at all, its just as possible that the opinion polls were wrong. But it will always be used as a stick to beat the UK government unless they introduce devo max very quickly. There's a lot of politicking going on at the moment about the impact on England, but in the end I think they'll stick to their promise, I dont really believe that Cameron, Milliband and Clegg want to be tarred with the brush of being such bare faced liars prior to the general election. And if they do renege I fully expect to see poll tax scale riots in Scotland leading up to the general election.

 

[BigJimLittleJim]

So, Mr "will you accept the will of the sovereign people" Salmond is now making threats that goes against a will just expressed democratically I see.

The man is a bigger fucking joke than I first thought and obviously not to be taken seriously anymore.

Laughing stock!

Only because the people of Scotland were sold a lie about Devo Max and its timescales for implementation. That Lie (the vow made by George Brown) possibly swung the vote by the 5% needed ......no wonder he's pissed off

We'll never know whether Brown's intervention swung the vote at all, its just as possible that the opinion polls were wrong. But it will always be used as a stick to beat the UK government unless they introduce devo max very quickly. There's a lot of politicking going on at the moment about the impact on England, but in the end I think they'll stick to their promise, I dont really believe that Cameron, Milliband and Clegg want to be tarred with the brush of being such bare faced liars prior to the general election. And if they do renege I fully expect to see poll tax scale riots in Scotland leading up to the general election.

I would have thought protests and action such as the petrol protestors used not so long ago will be the way forward - blocking oil tankers, motorways, that sort of thing - hit the English in the pockets, especially big business - the government will soon find a quick solution.