Shamima Begum

[Metal Biker]

It’s the same on other threads, we’re arguing with the fringe elements of society, which is our fault really.
Still, not much longer being banged up, and the pubs are getting nearer by the hour;)

Leicester just lost, hopefully the scum do too, the sun is out, it's warm and if the rumours that Amber Heard has lost her role in Aquaman 2, today will be a satisfying day. :)

 

[Ancient Citizen]

No need for the courts or M15 if we have a majority public opinion. Debate closed I suppose

Well, that’s the public, the Supreme Court, the Home Secretary and MI5 all onside, so I think detractors may have an uphill battle.

 

[Metal Biker]

No need for the courts or M15 if we have a majority public opinion. Debate closed I suppose

Not closed, just needs more convincing evidence from the opposing view to be considered.

So far there's none*.

*or rather none that is credible enough to reverse the view of MI5 and the Home Office's view

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Leicester just lost, hopefully the scum do too, the sun is out, it's warm and if the rumours that Amber Heard has lost her role in Aquaman 2, today will be a satisfying day. :)

Aye, “Come on the Chavs!”

 

[domalino]

Lol, if it was in dispute I’d agree.
Do you really, really believe you’re in the majority here?
It matters not mate, carry on.

I don't really base my opinions and beliefs on whether I think they're in the majority, I find that a bizarre way to live your life.

I really don't care what the majority of people think in a snap poll - especially when it's on a complex issue where what I deem the right answer is something I don't want to do, but think we are obliged to do.

 

[Metal Biker]

I don't really base my opinions and beliefs on whether I think they're in the majority, I find that a bizarre way to live your life.

I really don't care what the majority of people think in a snap poll - especially when it's on a complex issue where what I deem the right answer is something I don't want to do, but think we are obliged to do.

Your opinion is correct and everyone else is including the Home Office and MI5 is... wrong?

Did... did you not read the context of the meme!?

 

[jaseirai]

On the subject of under age rape Macron shagging his teacher at 15 opens up the possibility of a great topic.

Must be the source of his mental instabilities.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

I don't really base my opinions and beliefs on whether I think they're in the majority, I find that a bizarre way to live your life.

I really don't care what the majority of people think in a snap poll - especially when it's on a complex issue where what I deem the right answer is something I don't want to do, but think we are obliged to do.

Neither do I, but I’m happy with all the choices they’ve made so far.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Must be the source of his mental instabilities.

Have you seen the size of him?
Someone must have put him up to it.

 

[domalino]

Your opinion is correct and everyone else is including the Home Office and MI5 is... wrong?

Did... did you not read the context of the meme!?

The picture you posted doesn't show up for me, don't know if it does for anyone else.

Also I never said my opinion was the correct one and everyone else must be wrong, that's just another example of you inventing things, like how everyone who disagrees with you is morally vacuous or "promoting agendas" or motivated solely on objecting to the right.

 

[Metal Biker]

The picture you posted doesn't show up for me, don't know if it does for anyone else.

Also I never said my opinion was right, that's just another example of you inventing things, like how everyone who disagrees with you is morally vacuous or "promoting agendas" or motivated solely on objecting to the right.

The 'morally vacuous' are not 'those who disagree with me'. It is those who use terms like 'right-wing' in a negative slant without the slightest consideration that someone with right-wing views can be anything other than 'evil'. Read. and. interpret. the. comments. properly.
(Magic roundabout, in case you 'can't see it')

 

[domalino]

The 'morally vacuous' are not 'those who disagree with me'. It is those who use terms like 'right-wing' in a negative slant without the slightest consideration that someone with right-wing views can't be anything other than 'evil'. Read. and. interpret. the. comments. properly.
(Magic roundabout, in case you 'can't see it')

No one used the term right wing with either positive nor negative slant before you referred to the opposite as morally vacuous. No one said the right wing was evil.

These are just strawmen you put up to justify your arguments even when they fall apart.

Do you remember how this interaction started? You jumped in on a comment I made to have a go at me for stating Shamima Begum was a victim of child sex trafficking.

An hour later, after your arguments were pulled apart, you'd accepted she was a victim of child sex trafficking, and that was quite impressive, it's rare that someone actually changes their mind on a forum, but since then you've abandoned actual arguments for/against Begum and the surrounding extremists/citizenship topics and just retreated to bizarre comments about "them" and people promoting agendas and being "closed minded" for disagreeing with you and odd appeals to the authority of a poll, trying to force broader left/right political battle.

 

[Metal Biker]

No one used the term right wing with either positive nor negative slant before you referred to the opposite as morally vacuous. No one said the right wing was evil.

These are just strawmen you put up to justify your arguments when they fall apart.

Do you remember how this interaction started? You jumped in on a comment I made to have a go at me for pointing out Shamima Begum was a victim of child sex trafficking.

An hour later, after your arguments were pulled apart, you'd accepted she was a victim of child sex trafficking, and that was quite impressive, it's rare that someone actually changes their mind on a forum, but since then you've abandoned actual arguments and just retreated to bizarre comments about "them" and people promoting agendas and being "closed minded" for disagreeing with you and odd appeals to the authority of a poll, trying to force the Shamima Begum issue into a broader left/right political battle.

Then you've not been reading the thread, or have selected which posts to ignore.

None of my arguments have fallen apart. The Home Office stated Begum poses a risk, MI5 backed it, the Supreme Courts decision was influenced by that recommendation and I support all three conclusions. Begum should not return. No international or UK laws have been broken in doing so.

You've basically said she's not guilty of a crime, but she should return to the UK, but have not given a single argument that refutes the conclusion of all three UK insitutions as to Begum's situation other than your own personal feelings and your belief in a sense of 'obligation' which is a vague statement to make in light of the HO's findings and Home Secretary's judgement about how she poses a security risk. Her circumstance is more important than the safety of others?

What you are doing now is trying to save face on an internet forum. You're not even talking about Begum anymore, your issue is me and my opinions. You're obviously still sore about me pointing out your hypocrisy. I'd like to say it's been entertaining, but...

 

[SWP's back]

There is no doubt we are less forgiving as a society than we were a generation ago; and we are discernibly poorer for it.

And far more forgiving then we were 2 generations ago when she’s be allowed back and hanged...

 

[lust overlord]

And far more forgiving then we were 2 generations ago when she’s be allowed back and hanged...

Indeed.

Maybe if we still had capital punishment more people would have the appetite to see this woman returned to the country to face justice.

 

[domalino]

Then you've not been reading the thread, or have selected which posts to ignore.

None of my arguments have fallen apart. The Home Office stated Begum poses a risk, MI5 backed it, the Supreme Courts decision was influenced by that recommendation and I support all three conclusions. Begum should not return. No international or UK laws have been broken in doing so.

You've basically said she's not guilty of a crime, but she should return to the UK, but have not given a single argument that refutes the conclusion of all three UK insitutions as to Begum's situation other than your own personal feelings and your belief in a sense of 'obligation' which is a vague statement to make in light of the HO's findings and Home Secretary's judgement about how she poses a security risk. Her circumstance is more important than the safety of others?

What you are doing now is trying to save face on an internet forum. You're not even talking about Begum anymore, your issue is me and my opinions. You're obviously still sore about me pointing out your hypocrisy. I'd like to say it's been entertaining, but...

This is like some bizarre "im rubber you're glue" strategy.

I point out your clown act and you turn around and say "no, u". Before declaring some sort of victory.

I dont need to save any face here, You started this interaction denying she was a victim of child sex trafficking and ended it admitting she was.

Since then all you've done is say, "well the home secretary can never be wrong" before going off and attacking strawman.

 

[Metal Biker]

This is like some bizarre "im rubber you're glue" strategy.

I point out your clown act and you turn around and say "no, u". Before declaring some sort of victory.

I dont need to save any face here, You started this interaction denying she was a victim of child sex trafficking and ended it admitting she was.

Since then all you've done is say, "well the home secretary can never be wrong" before going off and attacking strawman.

Correction, this started when you assumed that's what I said, and when I clarified it wasn't and even provided the quote to provide clarity, you squirmed and you're now claiming you changed my mind because it matched your own opinion. It was like saying "do you think rape is a crime" "Yes, I do" "AHA, you've changed your mind!"

Hard to change an opinion that I never had in the first place, but as I say, this is no longer about Begum for you, it's just about me. Nobody cares. You want to discuss it, go to PM's.

 

[Kazzydeyna]

I can sense the erections of some posters on this thread as they type out feverishly how much they want to punish this vulnerable young rape victim.

Shamima needs our love,succour, and support. Yes, she should face up to her crimes and also be allowed to present full mitigation. But then when the gammon-y pound of flesh has been extracted a broken young woman remains and as a society that formed her, we need to take responsibility for her welfare.

 

[domalino]

Correction, this started when you assumed that's what I said, and when I clarified it wasn't and even provided the quote to provide clarity, you squirmed and you're now claiming you changed my mind because it matched your own opinion. It was like saying "do you think rape is a crime" "Yes, I do" "AHA, you've changed your mind!"

Hard to change an opinion that I never had in the first place, but as I say, this is no longer about Begum for you, it's just about me. Nobody cares. You want to discuss it, go to PM's.

Sorry but you've lost it now.

You replied to my comment by saying "FFS" she wasn't trafficked and it was an insult to people who were.

Theres no incorrect assumption there. I said she was a child sex trafficking victim, you jumped in to categorically state she wasn't.

You now pretending you didn't say that is pathetic and I've got no interest in going back over it in private messages.

 

[Metal Biker]

Sorry but you've lost it now.

You replied to my comment by saying "FFS" she wasn't trafficked and it was an insult to people who were.

Theres no incorrect assumption there. I said she was a child sex trafficking victim, you jumped in to categorically state she wasn't.

You now pretending you didn't say that is pathetic and I've got no interest in going back over it in private messages.

(because she wasn't trafficked...)
Well over PM is the only way I will continue this conversation as it has nothing to do with the thread topic. You are more than welcome to join me. I've already set one up for you :)