Shay Given to Arsenal (merged)

[levets]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

I disagree. Given has only one thing over Hart and that's experience. There's only one way to get that. Hart is 3" taller and therefore has a longer reach so technically and physically Hart is superior. Hart matches Given in all areas but wipes the floor with him when it comes to collecting crosses. He's also been at the club longer than Given so if you're talking about loyalty and giving players a chance then it really is a no-brainer. But that doesn't make him a bad keeper either which is why he would walk into almost any team in the PL. He's just not Joe Hart.

What City and Given do about it is another thing...

Personally I think it's a bit rich of Given to be kicking up such a stink after, or even before the first game. He has a contract with us so should at least give it until January and see what happens... It's only because it's Arsenal that he wants away. And it's precisely for that reason that we shouldn't let it happen, cheaply.

Basically he wants to go to Arsenal more than he wants to stay and fight for his place. V poor.

Given is proven and a much better shot stopper than Hart, Hart is disorganised, inexperienced and mush weaker shot stopper than Given. You know, it seems Given, being "not a bad keeper" didn't do us too badly for the last 2 seasons. But fuck it what does that matter.

As for size? It doesn't help Green, James..etc. Hell, Roy Keane was told that he was too small to ever make it in football.
Hart kicked up much more of a fuss than Given mentionining once that he'd have to think about what would happen if he didn't start. But it seems to have slipped your mind.
Given can't change the reason he's not being picked, he's not a 23 year old English player. So why should he waste his time.

He's just not Joe Hart. You mean he's not English, Hart has had one good season and played well enough in the game on Saturday and suddenly, he's "Joe Hart" the messiah, "God" suddenly he's an all time great, and done more in his 5 mins at the club as no. 1 than Given did, who played a major role in getting us 5th last season.

Why should he stay when he can't change the reason he's being benched. He's not English, thank God, if he was, or if Hart was French or Spanish..etc. We wouldn't be having this conversation. Hart is nothing but potentional, and no other club serious about competing for the top would have a 23 year old in goal.

Why should Given stay, Mancini is obviously pleasing the English lads, which means screwing Shay over, so why should he stay, especially when clearly he isn't valued here.

Drop the nationalism.... Then people will have a debate with you.

 

[C_T_I_D]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

Good luck Shay.

 

[DontLookBackInAnger]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

Given is proven and a much better shot stopper than Hart, Hart is disorganised, inexperienced and mush weaker shot stopper than Given. You know, it seems Given, being "not a bad keeper" didn't do us too badly for the last 2 seasons. But fuck it what does that matter.

As for size? It doesn't help Green, James..etc. Hell, Roy Keane was told that he was too small to ever make it in football.
Hart kicked up much more of a fuss than Given mentionining once that he'd have to think about what would happen if he didn't start. But it seems to have slipped your mind.
Given can't change the reason he's not being picked, he's not a 23 year old English player. So why should he waste his time.

He's just not Joe Hart. You mean he's not English, Hart has had one good season and played well enough in the game on Saturday and suddenly, he's "Joe Hart" the messiah, "God" suddenly he's an all time great, and done more in his 5 mins at the club as no. 1 than Given did, who played a major role in getting us 5th last season.

Why should he stay when he can't change the reason he's being benched. He's not English, thank God, if he was, or if Hart was French or Spanish..etc. We wouldn't be having this conversation. Hart is nothing but potentional, and no other club serious about competing for the top would have a 23 year old in goal.

Why should Given stay, Mancini is obviously pleasing the English lads, which means screwing Shay over, so why should he stay, especially when clearly he isn't valued here.

Drop the nationalism.... Then people will have a debate with you.

Given is a great shot stopper, better than Hart, but his command of his area is poor and his distribution is so bad it cost us a number of games last year(Stoke at home in the cup being the prime example). The bottom-line is that, I'm not sure that many would say Hart is a much better keeper, but he has 15 years at the top level, Given a handful, it has nothing to do with his nationality.

 

[adamgregory]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

The way I see it is;

is Shay contracted for the next few years...yes
do we need to sell him... no
can we stick him on the bench as cover for Hart to avoid the cock up that lost us 4th place last season...YES.

end of discussion.

 

[levets]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

Drop the nationalism.... Then people will have a debate with you.

Given is a great shot stopper, better than Hart, but his command of his area is poor and his distribution is so bad it cost us a number of games last year(Stoke at home in the cup being the prime example). The bottom-line is that, I'm not sure that many would say Hart is a much better keeper, but he has 15 years at the top level, Given a handful, it has nothing to do with his nationality.

it has nothing to do with his nationality
==============
Correct! Though macca thinks it is FFS!!!!

As if Mancini cares about their respective nationality!

 

[avoidconfusion]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

correct - Isaksson, Sun, Dunne (SO), Ball, Garrido, Ireland, Fernandes, Corluka, Petrov, Vassell, Benjani - Castillo, Elano & Hamann were used subs, Hart & Caicedo were unused.

Fucking hell, come a long way havent we?!

We have... but I still miss Corluka... better than any Right Back we have at the moment apart from Boateng.

 

[Cake]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

Given is proven and a much better shot stopper than Hart, Hart is disorganised, inexperienced and mush weaker shot stopper than Given. You know, it seems Given, being "not a bad keeper" didn't do us too badly for the last 2 seasons. But fuck it what does that matter.

As for size? It doesn't help Green, James..etc. Hell, Roy Keane was told that he was too small to ever make it in football.
Hart kicked up much more of a fuss than Given mentionining once that he'd have to think about what would happen if he didn't start. But it seems to have slipped your mind.
Given can't change the reason he's not being picked, he's not a 23 year old English player. So why should he waste his time.

He's just not Joe Hart. You mean he's not English, Hart has had one good season and played well enough in the game on Saturday and suddenly, he's "Joe Hart" the messiah, "God" suddenly he's an all time great, and done more in his 5 mins at the club as no. 1 than Given did, who played a major role in getting us 5th last season.

Why should he stay when he can't change the reason he's being benched. He's not English, thank God, if he was, or if Hart was French or Spanish..etc. We wouldn't be having this conversation. Hart is nothing but potentional, and no other club serious about competing for the top would have a 23 year old in goal.

Why should Given stay, Mancini is obviously pleasing the English lads, which means screwing Shay over, so why should he stay, especially when clearly he isn't valued here.

Casillas didn't do to badly at Real when he first played regular football for them in the 1999/2000 season at the age of 19, and has held the No 1 shirt since 2002 being all of 21 years old!

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

I know it's easy to think we shouldn't be letting players go to our competitors, but sooner or later we have to realise that us winning the league will be about what we do, not what our competitors do.

We have to assume our competitors will get the type of players they want irrespective of where they get them from. That's their business. If Arsenal didn't get Shay, then they'd get someone else just as good anyway. That's the only way you can look at it.

Our business is to run our club the best we can. To be the best team we can with the best, fittest, sharpest players. And if our team is the best, we will win things, irrespective of what any other team is doing.

I agree with this. It is a bit petty, the idea that we won't sell any players to any team in the top 4. I think the Bellamy situation is slightly different. I understand the bitterness the club may have and why they wouldn't allow him to leave for Spurs, also Spurs were our absolute direct rival last season. If we decide to let Given go, I don't see why we shouldn't sell to Arsenal. For what it's worth, I think they need a keeper who commands their area better anyway. They don't have massive defenders so I don't imagine that Given would be ideal for them.

 

[LongsightM13]

Re: we've agreed to let Shay Given join Arsenal

PMSL, it appears Irish Macca has had one of his occasional 'dark nights of the soul'.
Having been on the receiving end in the past ("apologise for insulting Roy Keane or I'll report you to the mods"), all the classic elements are there:
wild sectarian conspiracy theories, opinion stated as incontrovertible fact and the inevitable eulogy to Roy F****** Keane
Come on, Macca. If Given is half the goalkeeper and, indeed, half the man you (and for the record. I) think he is, then he should prove it by staying and fighting for his place.
If he spits the dummy and insists on leaving after being dropped for one game, when he is still on the comeback trail from a serious injury, then I'll be disappointed with the man. I thought he was made of better stuff than that

 

[J3SUS]

Re: Shay Given to Arsenal

he is 34 of course he wants first team football. He knows and so many others he is one of the top 3-4 keepers in the prem and would bes wasting the 3-4 years he has left by sitting on a bench waiting for a call up (which may never happen).

If he does go to arsenal then i could seriously see them winning the title.