Spurs (A) - Post-Match Thread

[jimmygrimblesboots]

Ive got a good idea , why dont we play a right winger on the right wing and a left winger on the left wing , and a left full back on the the left side , it might be a start ,play the f*cking players in the positions we bought them for.

 

[Keeper!]

Stale is the word. Imagine stepping onto the training pitch in preparation for the next game and knowing you’re going to approach it the same way that hasn’t been working for months. Equally, imagine how easy it is for the opposition to prepare. We’re making it easy for them.

As for Kev, I’ve seen it before, where the best player ends up being a scapegoat for wider failings. Same happened with Kinkkadze. I see it’s starting now with him, at least he won’t have the boo boys to put up with, but hopefully he doesn’t get pissed off with the football.

As you say, if Pep comes through this it could pave the way for a dynasty, whatever doesn’t kill you etc., but if he persists, it’ll end in tears.

The backroom staff is stale, time to freshen that up, someone with the balls and ability to challenge Pep.

 

[Keeper!]

Any team missing their top striker for over 6 months is going to struggle to score goals and that’s our primary problem.
Jesus has also been missing but one striker alone is not enough to sustain the schedule we have anyway.
Not scoring first means teams can afford to park the bus and hit us on the break.
We need to get back to inflicting the first goal and we will then see us scoring more freely as the opponents have to take the handbrake off the bus and open up spaces for our forwards to do their stuff.
Hopefully with Kun coming back we will get our mojo going again.
Another top quality striker is now a huge priority.

We had our best player (KDB) out for most of the formidables season, we did not miss him, we should not be missing a 33 yr old striker coming to the end of his top flight career.

We are one of the biggest and best run football clubs in the world, injuries are part of the game and going into this season with only 2 strikers was crazy.

 

[NoApologiesForBeingSpurs]

Any team missing their top striker for over 6 months is going to struggle to score goals and that’s our primary problem.
Jesus has also been missing but one striker alone is not enough to sustain the schedule we have anyway.
Not scoring first means teams can afford to park the bus and hit us on the break.
We need to get back to inflicting the first goal and we will then see us scoring more freely as the opponents have to take the handbrake off the bus and open up spaces for our forwards to do their stuff.
Hopefully with Kun coming back we will get our mojo going again.
Another top quality striker is now a huge priority.

Hope you don't mind me commenting but from what I have seen of City this is your biggest problem going forwards. Aguero can do everything you want from a striker so he scares defenders, that means that every time he moves they have to worry which in turn drags the defence out of shape and makes the spaces for others.

Exactly the same with Kane where our first yesterday was created by Kane going towards the ball and both of your CBs going with him because they didn't want to give him the time to turn and run at them/pick a pass. The second was the opposite where they held their position, possibly because of the 1st, which gave him space.

Jesus just doesn't worry defenders in that way as he doesn't have the strength of Aguero to hold it up, the shooting ability from the edge of the box or the range/weight of passing to play others in. He's good at what he does well but Jesus isn't the panic inducing focal point that would allow everyone else to do the damage so defences retain their shape.

If you had a fit Aguero or a Kane/Lewandoski/Haaland yesterday you would have scored and probably won comfortably. Without that you have trouble breaking teams down so you commit more players to attack which leaves you open to the counter that Pep's tactics leave you vulnerable to. Our ridiculous conversion rate against you lately is because the kind of chances that we get are the kind that players like Son, Kane and Vardy are expected to convert 9 times out of 10.

I obviously don't watch as much of City as most of you but that's an outsiders view if any of you are interested.

 

[GoatersLeftShin]

Over the years I've always ignored the league table until teams have played 10 games. By that time they have generally played some good, some bad teams. It's pretty clear we are far short of where we should be. Top 4 this season is not going to be easy and I just don't see this team going on a long winning streak.

I would be very concerned if I had just handed Pep with a contract as I would expect a bounce from the players. We got lots of passing and no penetration at all. This is the same problem we've had for at least a year now and we look no closer to solving it.

In January we need to bring in a striker with height. Someone like Giroud who can head the ball for a start. We also need to shake the squad up and bring in some players who are strong and fast. I'd also be tempted to put 10 men behind the ball at places like Spurs to see what they do. Maybe even give them the ball in places to draw them out!!

This won't be a popular opinion at all but this season's title winners will be Spurs. Many people have written Mourinho off but there's no better manager when you have good but not great players. He knows the league and with Son, Kane and Bale has a strike force to match Liverpool.

 

[Keeper!]

Hope you don't mind me commenting but from what I have seen of City this is your biggest problem going forwards. Aguero can do everything you want from a striker so he scares defenders, that means that every time he moves they have to worry which in turn drags the defence out of shape and makes the spaces for others.

Exactly the same with Kane where our first yesterday was created by Kane going towards the ball and both of your CBs going with him because they didn't want to give him the time to turn and run at them/pick a pass. The second was the opposite where they held their position, possibly because of the 1st, which gave him space.

Jesus just doesn't worry defenders in that way as he doesn't have the strength of Aguero to hold it up, the shooting ability from the edge of the box or the range/weight of passing to play others in. He's good at what he does well but Jesus isn't the panic inducing focal point that would allow everyone else to do the damage so defences retain their shape.

If you had a fit Aguero or a Kane/Lewandoski/Haaland yesterday you would have scored and probably won comfortably. Without that you have trouble breaking teams down so you commit more players to attack which leaves you open to the counter that Pep's tactics leave you vulnerable to. Our ridiculous conversion rate against you lately is because the kind of chances that we get are the kind that players like Son, Kane and Vardy are expected to convert 9 times out of 10.

I obviously don't watch as much of City as most of you but that's an outsiders view if any of you are interested.

Our issues run a lot deeper than Aguero.

We have no pace, energy or enthusiasm in this team.

This present team is done.

 

[Burtonblue]

Hope you don't mind me commenting but from what I have seen of City this is your biggest problem going forwards. Aguero can do everything you want from a striker so he scares defenders, that means that every time he moves they have to worry which in turn drags the defence out of shape and makes the spaces for others.

Exactly the same with Kane where our first yesterday was created by Kane going towards the ball and both of your CBs going with him because they didn't want to give him the time to turn and run at them/pick a pass. The second was the opposite where they held their position, possibly because of the 1st, which gave him space.

Jesus just doesn't worry defenders in that way as he doesn't have the strength of Aguero to hold it up, the shooting ability from the edge of the box or the range/weight of passing to play others in. He's good at what he does well but Jesus isn't the panic inducing focal point that would allow everyone else to do the damage so defences retain their shape.

If you had a fit Aguero or a Kane/Lewandoski/Haaland yesterday you would have scored and probably won comfortably. Without that you have trouble breaking teams down so you commit more players to attack which leaves you open to the counter that Pep's tactics leave you vulnerable to. Our ridiculous conversion rate against you lately is because the kind of chances that we get are the kind that players like Son, Kane and Vardy are expected to convert 9 times out of 10.

I obviously don't watch as much of City as most of you but that's an outsiders view if any of you are interested.

Don’t mind you commenting whatsoever especially as you speak the truth.
Kun frightens defenders.
Jesus just worries them. He’s an excellent player but can’t do it all on his own.

 

[give it to gordon]

Hope you don't mind me commenting but from what I have seen of City this is your biggest problem going forwards. Aguero can do everything you want from a striker so he scares defenders, that means that every time he moves they have to worry which in turn drags the defence out of shape and makes the spaces for others.

Exactly the same with Kane where our first yesterday was created by Kane going towards the ball and both of your CBs going with him because they didn't want to give him the time to turn and run at them/pick a pass. The second was the opposite where they held their position, possibly because of the 1st, which gave him space.

Jesus just doesn't worry defenders in that way as he doesn't have the strength of Aguero to hold it up, the shooting ability from the edge of the box or the range/weight of passing to play others in. He's good at what he does well but Jesus isn't the panic inducing focal point that would allow everyone else to do the damage so defences retain their shape.

If you had a fit Aguero or a Kane/Lewandoski/Haaland yesterday you would have scored and probably won comfortably. Without that you have trouble breaking teams down so you commit more players to attack which leaves you open to the counter that Pep's tactics leave you vulnerable to. Our ridiculous conversion rate against you lately is because the kind of chances that we get are the kind that players like Son, Kane and Vardy are expected to convert 9 times out of 10.

I obviously don't watch as much of City as most of you but that's an outsiders view if any of you are interested.

cant argue with any of that !

 

[OB1]

Agreed, those stats are a shocker. The chances /shots one I tend to pay less regard to now, just because not all chances or shots are ‘equal’ are they?

Aa team with players of our ability should be scoring at least once from 22 shots even when it is not a parade of clear cut chances but the quality of the strikes was not good enough.

Not for the first time, I think a lot of the problem is mental. Our lack of league goals I'm sure means the players are not relaxed enough when the strike the ball.

The problem is exacerbated by conceding early to a team sitting deep with something to hold onto.

Of course the shot that presumably isn't on those stats is the one that did go in and got chalked off, wrongly in my view but I'm not sure if that is down to my eyesight or the state of the current handball rule; anyway, it didn't look like a clear and obvious handball offence to me.

The goal first goal conceded was all about what was going on in the players' heads. They made a series of errors. Bernie sold himself unnecessarily, Laporte vacated his space unnecessarily, Cancelo was unnecessarily slow to react but was I think making up ground, and, worst of all from my point of view, Ederson unnecessarily darted off his line. had Eddie stayed home and Son produced the same shot, it would have been a back pass.

Ederson then made the same mistake for the second goal. The second goal started from an error by Mahrez, who made a poor pass to unnecessarily concede possession.

No doubt this thread if full of people telling Pep how to do his job but when you produce stats like that, time and again, and then lose because, whichever set of players you choose, they make too many crucial errors, it must be very difficult to be convinced they won't make those errors if you change your tactics.

 

[NoApologiesForBeingSpurs]

Our issues run a lot deeper than Aguero.

We have no pace, energy or enthusiasm in this team.

This present team is done.

I think your lack of pace, energy and enthusiasm is a result of the issue I outlined. Yesterday you started off brightly but because we could comfortably keep our shape you couldn't get into our box or get in good shooting positions around it and there is no point in crossing to Jesus from wide against a busy box.

The longer the game went on the more your pace, energy and enthusiasm waned because nothing was changing.

Whenever I have watched Aguero pull defences around you create good chances, even when you don't score the more chances you create the more enthusiasm there is because it is working. The goals then become almost inevitable

 

[give it to gordon]

I think your lack of pace, energy and enthusiasm is a result of the issue I outlined. Yesterday you started off brightly but because we could comfortably keep our shape you couldn't get into our box or get in good shooting positions around it and there is no point in crossing to Jesus from wide against a busy box.

The longer the game went on the more your pace, energy and enthusiasm waned because nothing was changing.

Whenever I have watched Aguero pull defences around you create good chances, even when you don't score the more chances you create the more enthusiasm there is because it is working. The goals then become almost inevitable

personally i think once we saw you were parking the bus City should have done the same. You are at home so should be the attacking team ! Maureen wouldnt have know what to do, but we didnt and played into your hands. Plus you are one hell of a boogie team for us !!

 

[Tugay One Cup]

Even though it is happening time & again, and I keep seeing it with my own eyes, and even after all the discussions on here about Pep's tactics etc ... I'm still not really sure how we keep losing (or drawing) games like this:

Spurs - City yesterday:

Possession: 34-66%
Shots: 4-22
Corners: 0-10
Goals: 2-0

Spurs go top of the league with an "impressive display" and pundits say they could be Champions this year if they keep playing like that.

The Japanese fired more shots at Pearl Harbour than the US did at Hiroshima.

It's about quality, not quantity.

 

[OB1]

I think your lack of pace, energy and enthusiasm is a result of the issue I outlined. Yesterday you started off brightly but because we could comfortably keep our shape you couldn't get into our box or get in good shooting positions around it and there is no point in crossing to Jesus from wide against a busy box.

The longer the game went on the more your pace, energy and enthusiasm waned because nothing was changing.

Whenever I have watched Aguero pull defences around you create good chances, even when you don't score the more chances you create the more enthusiasm there is because it is working. The goals then become almost inevitable

You talk some sense and sometimes it's useful to get an outsider's perspective if it comes with the objectivity yours seems to.

The lack of pace, energy and enthusiasm is a bit of a myth. Oh, we could do with more pace; especially in in midfield but Walker, Cancelo, Torres, Sterling, Foden, Mahrez, Jesus, KDB aren't guys that run in treacle.

As a team, we wouldn't dominate the ball as we do if the team had no energy or enthusiasm. I think opponents sometimes look like they have more of these things because they have to work so hard to deal with how we play.

 

[daztrueblue91]

I don't think the overall performance was as bad as people are making out. We dominated Spurs and had our attacking players been something other than the inconsistent clowns they've been for too long now, we'd have won comfortably.

Too much analysis of what feels like a straight forward problem for me. The 'attack' has gotten complacent since the 18/19 season. Far too many players playing within themselves or playing for themselves. Even KDB's decision making, and cutting edge has been massively blunted.

I said it back then, and it's worth repeating now. Those players (who won 198 points over two seasons) needed a BIG shake up after 18/19. They need fresh blood, competition, and new solutions. Torres was brought in a year too late. I suspect that there'll be a rebuild akin to 2017 next summer.

This season is now officially in the 'transitional' basket.

I don’t think we dominated Spurs at all. Last season when we missed chance after chance was domination.

Yesterday was keeping possession for possessions sake and doing fuck all with it. It’s no wonder we have 60+% possession as whenever we get into a dangerous attacking position, we slow down and turn backwards.

I also think the phrase ‘transition’ is a cop out. It’s a phase given to popular managers who are underperforming. In fact, substitute Pep for Ole and we’d be laughing our balls off when you consider the investment both managers have received. Pep’s first season definitely was, he had to get the right players in and implement his style. Now though none of that applies. The bulk of this squad was signed under his watch.

The reality is that serious money has been spent on this squad and it’s hugely underperforming. Either Pep’s mates have let him down by spunking huge sums on players who don’t improve the starting 11 like Mahrez, Rodri and Cancelo, or Pep is too inflexible to adapt his style to get the best from them. Either way, it doesn’t bold well for the “dream team”.

If there was a change in emphasis in this side, a formation tweak, playing youngsters, or anything that would suggest a change in approach, I could understand a potential transition phase applying. But we’re seeing none of that. All we are seeing is the same old style of play and mistakes being made, whilst Pep sticks his fingers in his ears and talks complete bollocks after the match.

The last 12 months have been very reminiscent of Pellegrini’s final season.

 

[OB1]

personally i think once we saw you were parking the bus City should have done the same. You are at home so should be the attacking team ! Maureen wouldnt have know what to do, but we didnt and played into your hands. Plus you are one hell of a boogie team for us !!

Deluded if you think Jose wouldn't know what to do. I'm not advocating it for one moment and it wouldn't happen but if you gave Jose this City team, he'd win trophies and he wouldn't do it by sitting back all the time.

If City did play by sitting back constantly, there's no guarantee that they wouldn't make crucial errors and concede goals.

 

[give it to gordon]

I think your lack of pace, energy and enthusiasm is a result of the issue I outlined. Yesterday you started off brightly but because we could comfortably keep our shape you couldn't get into our box or get in good shooting positions around it and there is no point in crossing to Jesus from wide against a busy box.

The longer the game went on the more your pace, energy and enthusiasm waned because nothing was changing.

Whenever I have watched Aguero pull defences around you create good chances, even when you don't score the more chances you create the more enthusiasm there is because it is working. The goals then become almost inevitable

the thing about a team that puts that sort of performance in against City and i have seen it happen is you put so much effect into beating City that they than go and lose they next 2 or 3 matches. Beating City means more than winning the next 3 or 4 games ;)

I dont think spurs will lose the next 2 or 3 but will be interesting if you do.

 

[Fordyboy46]

personally i think once we saw you were parking the bus City should have done the same. You are at home so should be the attacking team ! Maureen wouldnt have know what to do, but we didnt and played into your hands. Plus you are one hell of a boogie team for us !!

Bogey mate, lol

 

[jimmygrimblesboots]

Hope you don't mind me commenting but from what I have seen of City this is your biggest problem going forwards. Aguero can do everything you want from a striker so he scares defenders, that means that every time he moves they have to worry which in turn drags the defence out of shape and makes the spaces for others.

Exactly the same with Kane where our first yesterday was created by Kane going towards the ball and both of your CBs going with him because they didn't want to give him the time to turn and run at them/pick a pass. The second was the opposite where they held their position, possibly because of the 1st, which gave him space.

Jesus just doesn't worry defenders in that way as he doesn't have the strength of Aguero to hold it up, the shooting ability from the edge of the box or the range/weight of passing to play others in. He's good at what he does well but Jesus isn't the panic inducing focal point that would allow everyone else to do the damage so defences retain their shape.

If you had a fit Aguero or a Kane/Lewandoski/Haaland yesterday you would have scored and probably won comfortably. Without that you have trouble breaking teams down so you commit more players to attack which leaves you open to the counter that Pep's tactics leave you vulnerable to. Our ridiculous conversion rate against you lately is because the kind of chances that we get are the kind that players like Son, Kane and Vardy are expected to convert 9 times out of 10.

I obviously don't watch as much of City as most of you but that's an outsiders view if any of you are interested.

Good post , always good to see sensible comments from a football fan minus the blue tinted shades.

 

[Blue Eyed Dick]

There's a lot going wrong at present, and don't get me wrong I'm not a "Get Pep out" fan, but the main thing that continues to drive me crazy is that there is never, never ever, a PLAN B.
Mourinho parks the bus and then nightmare - they get an early goal, so he continues to park the bus. Despite having 60+% possession we look toothless and go 2 down - still nothing changes. The stubbornness to continue playing the same way, not change it with any substitutes despite moaning that we cannot use 5 subs, is mighty frustrating.
Hate Mourinho, but admire him. I remember him at Chelsea making 2 subs and changing formation after 30min - acknowledging that he clearly got hi set-up wrong. However, City keep playing the same way on and on in the belief that if the game doesn't end eventually we will wear them down. When we play some of the lower Prem sides we often do wear them down and eventually score, but against clever managers in the Top 6, or dare I say in the latter stages of the Champs League we are far too easy to predict and get out smarted too often.
I love Aguero for his goals and Jesus for his workrate, but where is the third, alternative striker giving us a different option - the fast one? the tall one? Game plan of - get to the by-line, cross in in (usually low) and hope someone is there is predictable and therefore easy to stop. We have an aerial threat from corners, but not from open play - so the low ball is so predictable.
I've said enough now. PLAN B needed, different attacking option needed, Disagree?

 

[BolinCell]

Deluded if you think Jose wouldn't know what to do. I'm not advocating it for one moment and it wouldn't happen but if you gave Jose this City team, he'd win trophies and he wouldn't do it by sitting back all the time.

If City did play by sitting back constantly, there's no guarantee that they wouldn't make crucial errors and concede goals.

Moureen has made a career out of sitting back, and telling his players to use the dark arts. Pep isn't going to ruin his reputation doing that he has more class.