Strike

[BoyBlue_1985]

Wait a minute - so if you don't strike but are happy to take the benefits that a strike may acheive then you are in the wrong.

So therefore you are advocating people in a union striking and winning getting more pay/benefits than those not in a union arent you. So people in the same workplace would be getting better pay and benefits whilst doing the same job purely because they were in the union.

Doesnt that go against the ethos of a union?

100%.

The whole concept of unions is that you stand together.
Lets give medals to deserter's, they were doing the same job but would not do the dirty work, and fucked off when the going gets tough.

The thing that confuses me is you call people not in the union scabs? I can understand if they are in the union but if not what unofficial union law are they breaking?

 

[bluejon]

Wait a minute - so if you don't strike but are happy to take the benefits that a strike may acheive then you are in the wrong.

So therefore you are advocating people in a union striking and winning getting more pay/benefits than those not in a union arent you. So people in the same workplace would be getting better pay and benefits whilst doing the same job purely because they were in the union.

Doesnt that go against the ethos of a union?

100%.

The whole concept of unions is that you stand together.
Lets give medals to deserter's, they were doing the same job but would not do the dirty work, and fucked off when the going gets tough.

aye, but who in the unions is going to benefit from these strikes? no one, except the union leadership, who are on salaries well above virtually all of the people they claim to represent, so they can well afford a few days off, we can't. the strikes are making no difference to tory policy, and I believe are helping to spread propaganda about the supposed "leftie" public sector who get paid a fortune for doing nothing. the fact these strikes have been called is the disgrace

 

[johnmc]

So Pominoz, you think everyone should be in a union whether they want to be or not otherwise they are scabs, shirkers, take all the benefits that others have sacraficed for etc

 

[Matty]

Scab.

I take you will refuse any benefit that those on strike may gain/retain?

i thought a scab was a union member who crossed the picket line? I'm not in the union so therefore can't be classed as a scab.

Not that being called a scab bothers anyone, maybe it did in the 70's and 80's?

I respect the decision of my colleagues and friends who choose to join a union and strike so how about you respect peoples decision not join or strike? I'm happy in my job, happy with my pay and conditions and have no reason to join a union or take part in any action.

Of course i'm not thrilled by further years of a pay freeze but we're paying the price for the failures of a Labour government so things have to be done to put things right.

A scab is anyone that breaks a strike.

Again, will you let your boss's know that you do not want anything gained/retained by the strike action?

If you're not in the Union you can't officially strike. Yes, you can refuse to work on the day of the official strike, but unlike a union member you can be disciplined for that refusal. It's entirely possible, depending on the employer, and on your employment history, that you could be sacked for refusal to work.

 

[pominoz]

no, they are not. my missus crossed a picket line for the first time in her life yesterday, and tore the head of some stupid woman who tried that line. the reason she crossed the picket line? the union agreed to go on strike when only roughly 20% of the membership had cast a vote, and 60% of that voted to go on strike, meaning that the union decided 5 days of strike action based on around 13% of the membership voting yes, disgraceful. in addition, these strikes are playing into the hands of the tory scum, and they are making no difference. the only people they are hurting is families like us who can't afford to lose the cash, hence her crossing the picket line. this is not the 1970's, we need new and effective ways to mark our discontent, strikes (in offices) are a total waste of time

You can dress it up anyway you like, but she is a scab. For shame!

no dressing up, its facts. she is as angry as anyone about the fact that her pension contributions have gone up, she's been on a pay freeze for 3 years, and she is vilified as being another spoilt lazy public sector worker, when the truth is, she could easily earn 4/5 times as much if she switched sides and worked for one of the big four accountants (she works for HMRC), but she believes in her job, and what she is trying to do, stop tax avoidance from large corporations. but... this strike, agreed to by not even 1 in 5 of the union membership is pure politics on behalf of the unions, and is not representative of the union membership. there is no shame in having a brain and not mindlessly following whichever herd happens to be braying the loudest

About 60% of eligible voters turn out to vote in UK general elections,about than half of them voted for the current government, so not even 1 in 3 voted this lot in.
Do they have a mandate to govern?<br /><br />-- Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:58 pm --<br /><br />

So Pominoz, you think everyone should be in a union whether they want to be or not otherwise they are scabs, shirkers, take all the benefits that others have sacraficed for etc

That is what i believe, yes. Comrade.

 

[bluejon]

You can dress it up anyway you like, but she is a scab. For shame!

no dressing up, its facts. she is as angry as anyone about the fact that her pension contributions have gone up, she's been on a pay freeze for 3 years, and she is vilified as being another spoilt lazy public sector worker, when the truth is, she could easily earn 4/5 times as much if she switched sides and worked for one of the big four accountants (she works for HMRC), but she believes in her job, and what she is trying to do, stop tax avoidance from large corporations. but... this strike, agreed to by not even 1 in 5 of the union membership is pure politics on behalf of the unions, and is not representative of the union membership. there is no shame in having a brain and not mindlessly following whichever herd happens to be braying the loudest

About 60% of eligible voters turn out to vote in UK general elections,about than half of them voted for the current government, so not even 1 in 3 voted this lot in.
Do they have a mandate to govern?

Christ no, and by the sounds of things, we probably share a similar level of hatred for the spoilt public school bastards who think they have a divine right to "lead us". they are destroying this country, but we need to start being smarter. at the best, these strikes are making no difference to tory policy, at the worst, they are being used as an excuse for yet more outsourcing of public sector work, with the inevitable clusterfuck that occurs when this happens (see atos, capgemini, g4s etc)

I believe the whole damn system is rotten to the core, and we could do with a genuine, 21st century, socialist party that represents the vast majority of the people of not just the UK, but worldwide. at this moment in time, that does not exist (and don't get me started on the SWP, bunch of cretins)

 

[cyberblue]

i thought a scab was a union member who crossed the picket line? I'm not in the union so therefore can't be classed as a scab.

Not that being called a scab bothers anyone, maybe it did in the 70's and 80's?

I respect the decision of my colleagues and friends who choose to join a union and strike so how about you respect peoples decision not join or strike? I'm happy in my job, happy with my pay and conditions and have no reason to join a union or take part in any action.

Of course i'm not thrilled by further years of a pay freeze but we're paying the price for the failures of a Labour government so things have to be done to put things right.

A scab is anyone that breaks a strike.

Again, will you let your boss's know that you do not want anything gained/retained by the strike action?

Okay, looks like i can officially call myself a scab then.

Now you surely know the answer to your question, if a pay rise was gained then of course i wouldn't turn it down - my priority is providing for myself and my family so i'll take whatever i can get no matter how it is won. That won't happen though, why would the government give us a pay rise just because 25% of the workforce stay home for a day?

My wife also works at the same office so a strike would be 2 days pay lost from the family budget over something we're not overly concerned about.

Well i hope you & your wife can hold your head up high as thousands of union members are fighting ,& losing money on your behalf (they are in the same boat as you)but you will & have done ,gladly take all pay rises & benifits such as holliday ,pay sickness benifits maternaty leave ,.reduction in the working week .personaly i think you should both be embarrased & ashamed of yourself have you no respect ?

 

[pominoz]

no dressing up, its facts. she is as angry as anyone about the fact that her pension contributions have gone up, she's been on a pay freeze for 3 years, and she is vilified as being another spoilt lazy public sector worker, when the truth is, she could easily earn 4/5 times as much if she switched sides and worked for one of the big four accountants (she works for HMRC), but she believes in her job, and what she is trying to do, stop tax avoidance from large corporations. but... this strike, agreed to by not even 1 in 5 of the union membership is pure politics on behalf of the unions, and is not representative of the union membership. there is no shame in having a brain and not mindlessly following whichever herd happens to be braying the loudest

About 60% of eligible voters turn out to vote in UK general elections,about than half of them voted for the current government, so not even 1 in 3 voted this lot in.
Do they have a mandate to govern?

Christ no, and by the sounds of things, we probably share a similar level of hatred for the spoilt public school bastards who think they have a divine right to "lead us". they are destroying this country, but we need to start being smarter. at the best, these strikes are making no difference to tory policy, at the worst, they are being used as an excuse for yet more outsourcing of public sector work, with the inevitable clusterfuck that occurs when this happens (see atos, capgemini, g4s etc)

I believe the whole damn system is rotten to the core, and we could do with a genuine, 21st century, socialist party that represents the vast majority of the people of not just the UK, but worldwide. at this moment in time, that does not exist (and don't get me started on the SWP, bunch of cretins)

The thing is if enough people think "our actions will not make a difference" or do not have the balls to make a stand and lose a days pay, these bastards (and that includes lighter shade of blue Labour) will keep bending us over and fucking us up the arse.

The original Unionist's fought like fuck to get us even the most basic of rights, and now people cannot be arsed because they may have to lose a days pay, makes me sick.

 

[bluejon]

About 60% of eligible voters turn out to vote in UK general elections,about than half of them voted for the current government, so not even 1 in 3 voted this lot in.
Do they have a mandate to govern?

Christ no, and by the sounds of things, we probably share a similar level of hatred for the spoilt public school bastards who think they have a divine right to "lead us". they are destroying this country, but we need to start being smarter. at the best, these strikes are making no difference to tory policy, at the worst, they are being used as an excuse for yet more outsourcing of public sector work, with the inevitable clusterfuck that occurs when this happens (see atos, capgemini, g4s etc)

I believe the whole damn system is rotten to the core, and we could do with a genuine, 21st century, socialist party that represents the vast majority of the people of not just the UK, but worldwide. at this moment in time, that does not exist (and don't get me started on the SWP, bunch of cretins)

The thing is if enough people think "our actions will not make a difference" or do not have the balls to make a stand and lose a days pay, these bastards (and that includes lighter shade of blue Labour) will keep bending us over and fucking us up the arse.

The original Unionist's fought like fuck to get us even the most basic of rights, and now people cannot be arsed because they may have to lose a days pay, makes me sick.

actions can make a difference, but not these actions. the original unionists knew that shutting down manufacturing could break a government, its why the tories were so clever in arranging two years worth of supply of coal during the miners strikes in the 80's. this is not the situation now. the effect of what is being done now is negligible, and a waste of time. we need to start looking at action such as blockading the London stock exchange etc, this would make a difference. these strikes will not improve anyone's conditions, just cost people money, at a time money is being taken of us all left right and centre (well, maybe not right)

a good indicator of whether a strike is of use is whether the police are turning out to crack picket line heads. if they're not, the government don't care, and it is making no difference at all

 

[pominoz]

Didn't know there were Unions back in the 1800's though

Really?

Although having read your "facts" of the day threads, it should not have come as a surprise. ;)