Thatcher dead

[hilts]

I dont remember the media making much of a fuss when Harold Wilson died.Never liked her and i enjoyed the day she lost her job as the leader of are country.

In fairness the media coverage you get is down to your impact, John Major wont get much either

I thought the media coverage you get was down to Rupert Murdoch

So the media not owned by Murdoch have not mentioned her passing then?

 

[jma]

Her biggest problem (and it alluded to by quite a few) is that she was a very high achiever, and this was her blind spot, she thought that if she could do it everyone could! Unfortunately not everyone is as motivated to the degree she was.

The other, rather obvious, problem with that is there can, by definition, only be a few very high achievers.

Under Thatcher, the gains of the few came at the cost of the many. The notion that any one of that 'many' could theoretically climb to the same heights doesn't detract from the fact that the majority never could.

The simple fact that also gets missed is that even though we had high unemployment, there were far more people in work than out of work (which is still the case today) I am not sure that many actually paid a high price, I would say that many did very well out of her time in office.

And like I said it would have happened anyway, there is no escaping it

Perhaps I am having some sort of seizure here and getting a mental blind sport, but that bizarre sentence above suggests to me that, by the same rule, an unemployment rate of 40% would be ok as far more people would be employed than unemployed.

And that's before you even begin to talk about wages, types of jobs, hours, working conditions or opportunities made available.

Almost as bizarre a view of such issues as "most people I went to school to have generally had a job so economic and social policies must have been correct, right and proper."

 

[hilts]

In that case you might have learnt something if you had worked in an Unemployment Benefit Office in the early 80's.

I guess all those working class lads around me must have just been been lucky then eh, although in fairness a couple did get gcse's in geography, must have been head hunted by ICL

Perhaps they WERE lucky. I dealt with many in their mid 40's/ early 50's who never worked again. Many with specific skills where the industry had been decimated. There was no training for other jobs, they were just left on the scrapheap.

That's right hundreds of working class northern blokes were lucky and by sheer luck i never met an unlucky one either, you have swung me and i shall ignore my own experiences for someone who who uses cliche's such as left on the scrapheap

Jobs for life? not many of those about i'm afraid

 

[mancityvstoke]

I am fairly sure that it's been said quite often that some did very well and some did not do very well during that period.

Some people survived well in the 80's by doing credit fraud (buy now pay never), catalogue fraud, benefit fraud (loads were doing the single parent hubby left home stuff but he actually hadn't) buying and selling houses which doubled in price in Rusholme at one point in a year. The South did very well and London probably did benefit the most. (Parts of London)

Mates of mine were opening second hand shops selling cookers and fridges doing really well (before fire and leccy regs)

Benefit fraud probably started under the Tories actually for some people to do as well as the ones drinking champagne and driving Porsches whilst seemingly doing fuck all for it.

HOWEVER many did not do well and some got kicked in the knackers that much they gave up.

Some areas never really recovered and are still fucked now.

Hence divisive.

If you did well.....good for you. I did ok too as it happens but know many who didnt and many who fucked off overseas.

 

[Mike D]

Does anybody think that its coincidense that my first response to this post was a youtube of Ding Dong the Witch is Dead that its heading for number 1 in the charts.

 

[mackenzie]

I guess all those working class lads around me must have just been been lucky then eh, although in fairness a couple did get gcse's in geography, must have been head hunted by ICL

Perhaps they WERE lucky. I dealt with many in their mid 40's/ early 50's who never worked again. Many with specific skills where the industry had been decimated. There was no training for other jobs, they were just left on the scrapheap.

That's right hundreds of working class northern blokes were lucky and by sheer luck i never met an unlucky one either, you have swung me and i shall ignore my own experiences for someone who who uses cliche's such as left on the scrapheap

Jobs for life? not many of those about i'm afraid

It may offend you but yes there were people left on the scrapheap.
None of them expected a job for life but they certainly expected something for their achievements in the skills they had built up over the course of 20 or 30 years.
A wasteland of opportunity wasn't one of them.

 

[mancityvstoke]

Perhaps they WERE lucky. I dealt with many in their mid 40's/ early 50's who never worked again. Many with specific skills where the industry had been decimated. There was no training for other jobs, they were just left on the scrapheap.

That's right hundreds of working class northern blokes were lucky and by sheer luck i never met an unlucky one either, you have swung me and i shall ignore my own experiences for someone who who uses cliche's such as left on the scrapheap

Jobs for life? not many of those about i'm afraid

It may offend you but yes there were people left on the scrapheap.
None of them expected a job for life but they certainly expected something for their achievements in the skills they had built up over the course of 20 or 30 years.
A wasteland of opportunity wasn't one of them.

or a shitty TOPS training course at Windmill Lane skilllcentre

 

[hilts]

Perhaps they WERE lucky. I dealt with many in their mid 40's/ early 50's who never worked again. Many with specific skills where the industry had been decimated. There was no training for other jobs, they were just left on the scrapheap.

That's right hundreds of working class northern blokes were lucky and by sheer luck i never met an unlucky one either, you have swung me and i shall ignore my own experiences for someone who who uses cliche's such as left on the scrapheap

Jobs for life? not many of those about i'm afraid

It may offend you but yes there were people left on the scrapheap.
None of them expected a job for life but they certainly expected something for their achievements in the skills they had built up over the course of 20 or 30 years.
A wasteland of opportunity wasn't one of them.

Why would it offend me? I have heard much talk over the last few days of how Thatcher's time in office was to the detriment of the northern working classes and how she brought a shit storm on them and only southerners have any time for her

This is not the case in my experience which is all i have to go on, i have been through recessions and have always found employment as has everyone i know

The use of the word expected is key here, we didn't expect anything really, it was supposed to be so bad in the 80's we were just glad of a job and a few pints.

Just seems strange i never met anyone who was on the scapheap when there was so much of it going on<br /><br />-- Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:27 pm --<br /><br />

That's right hundreds of working class northern blokes were lucky and by sheer luck i never met an unlucky one either, you have swung me and i shall ignore my own experiences for someone who who uses cliche's such as left on the scrapheap

Jobs for life? not many of those about i'm afraid

It may offend you but yes there were people left on the scrapheap.
None of them expected a job for life but they certainly expected something for their achievements in the skills they had built up over the course of 20 or 30 years.
A wasteland of opportunity wasn't one of them.

or a shitty TOPS training course at Windmill Lane skilllcentre

My YTS paid a handsome 27.50 for 40 hours, bargain

 

[stonerblue]

Naturally some strong views from everyone on here, but what about this:

<a class="postlink-local" href="http://forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=281204" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">viewtopic.php?f=14&t=281204</a>

Whelan & Madjeski pushing for a minutes silence for Thatcher at football at the weekend?

As stated on that thread, they can fuck right off.

Would you disrupt the minutes silence if we had one?

What, you mean by talking to someone or going to the bar or whistling while i have a slash? Then yes i would.
Being forced to 'show my respect' for someone i have none for by some gimp announcer at a football match and having to pay for the privelege is not my idea of fun so i wouldn't bother going. Then i'd have something else not to like about her..

 

[TonyBook]

The other, rather obvious, problem with that is there can, by definition, only be a few very high achievers.

Under Thatcher, the gains of the few came at the cost of the many. The notion that any one of that 'many' could theoretically climb to the same heights doesn't detract from the fact that the majority never could.

The simple fact that also gets missed is that even though we had high unemployment, there were far more people in work than out of work (which is still the case today) I am not sure that many actually paid a high price, I would say that many did very well out of her time in office.

And like I said it would have happened anyway, there is no escaping it

I'm afraid that you 'saying it' doesn't make it right. Many paid a very high price indeed.
While I respect your opinion, millions disagree with you, most from what would be described as the North of the UK. Those that are truly great aren't despised by millions.....

Can you break down who paid the price and where in the North they come from?