The Boxing thread

I'm arguing semantics? No pal, you were just plain wrong to claim it's the same thing as juicing, it's not. It's not juicing plain and simple it's nowhere near as bad as steroids as a help for building muscle. It's used to keep weight down while your training from what I gather which can help in building muscle as you can eat more but it's not the same as what steroids do.

I'm going to take a wild guess here that you didn't know what was in his system and have googled frantically to save face which is why it took you an age to reply. Which is no big deal but try not to do that after having claimed everyone who doesn't agree with your position is casual and definitely don't try and side step you were claiming he was caught juicing when he wasn't that's not semantics that's just plain wrong.

Are you this needy in real life.... Christ on a bike, your matter of fact response had ‘from what I can gather’ meshed in there.

As surprising as it may come to you, I don’t regulate my life around bluenoon, shocking as it may seem. In debate, which is obviously lost on you, a person can concede to those who are unable to hear.....

Anyway, from what I can gather, you’re the champ....
 
Are you this needy in real life.... Christ on a bike, your matter of fact response had ‘from what I can gather’ meshed in there.

As surprising as it may come to you, I don’t regulate my life around bluenoon, shocking as it may seem. In debate, which is obviously lost on you, a person can concede to those who are unable to hear.....

Anyway, from what I can gather, you’re the champ....
Yes gather from what I've read on how people use it themselves, since I've never used anything like that you know? Also I love your defence of "you must be matter of fact" when you were the one claiming everyone's a casual that doesn't hate Canelo or agree with you that Canelo's a juicer and still juicing "probably".

What is matter of fact is juicing is in reference to the use of anabolic steroids(the reason why I wondered if you knew what was in his system), the common use of which is because it's a huge cheat in building muscle. This is in no way "the same thing" as what was found in Canelo's system. I'm sorry if it upsets you so much for someone to have a different view from you but this is a discussion board and it's normal that people wont always agree.

Shall we leave it there or do you want to go in circles?
 
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Yes gather from what I've read on how people use it themselves? Also you can't be all "you must be matter of fact" when you were the one claiming everyone a casual that doesn't agree with you that Canelo's a juicer and still juicing "probably".

What is matter of fact is juicing is in reference to the use of anabolic steroids(the reason why I wondered if you knew what was in his system), the common use of which is because it's a huge cheat in building muscle. This is in no way "the same thing" as what was found in Canelo's system. I'm sorry if it upsets you so much for someone to have a different view from you but this is a discussion board and it's normal that people wont always agree.

Shall we leave it there or do you want to go in circles?

That is fine, however, you took it upon yourself to fight his literal corner and I can see why due to what I said originally, as the terminology was wrong. What you fail to recognise however is that in terms of the drug itself, it’s a become a common denominator within the sport, due to its ability to transfer through the system so quickly and avoidance from would be authorities.

The contaminated meat theory ffs, did he eat the whole horse???

Dosage levels, for those body building for example, is around 100mg per day, I’d love to know what the levels were found, it kind of would put this to bed....

PEDs are evolving, it doesn’t have to be anabolic to have the same impact, at least not on the surface!

Just to add, I’ve found the results, wasn’t aware they were released, I must be casual... anyway, the 0,6-0.8mg, over two separate samples in 3 days, which came out the same, with the margin of 0.10 either way, is consistent with foul play, in my eyes....
 
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That is fine, however, you took it upon yourself to fight his literal corner and I can see why due to what I said originally, as the terminology was wrong. What you fail to recognise however is that in terms of the drug itself, it’s a become a common denominator within the sport, due to its ability to transfer through the system so quickly and avoidance from would be authorities.

The contaminated meat theory ffs, did he eat the whole horse???

Dosage levels, for those body building for example, is around 100mg per day, I’d love to know, as Golovkin requested, what the levels were found, it kind of would put this to bed....

PEDs are evolving, it doesn’t have to be anabolic to have the same impact, at least not on the surface!
I didn't originally know what it was when news came out about the failed tests, like most didn't if they were honest but I did research it at the time because I wanted to know, unlike a lot did who instead immediately spouted off about juicing and Caneloids.

From what I did learn, this idea that Clenbuterol is an evolution in PEDs(isn't it over a decade old anyway?) and it can replace steroids and be just as effective at building muscle is overstating it's effectiveness in that area(a nice way of putting it) from what I've read myself about it. As I said bodybuilders may use it but it's main use is in the category of a "cutting" substance which bodybuilders do all the time(as in "cutting weight", normally the last part in their cycle before a show). If they can do that and retain more muscle than normal, then it's obvious why it's a popular choice. Even if some use it for the other side effects, bodybuilders use all sorts of supplements and enhancers to gain even the slightest edge, so them using it doesn't say as much as you seem to think it does, such as it suddenly being a replacement for steroids.

Rather than listen solely to forum posts or even adverts selling the "wonder drug" to bodybuilders, I thought it better to stick with articles based on scientific studies. The adverts will tell you all sorts about "enhancing the function of your parasympathetic nervous system" by expanding your lungs and increasing heart rate but to say these adverts for the latest pills, supplements and diets make everything sound like magic is an understatement. They overstate the effectiveness drastically more often than not, which is what I feel you have bought into. The articles I read suggested gains in skeletal muscle where said to be slight, along with the other positive side effects such as muscle retention and so on and the dosage wouldn't have led to trace amounts even for those sorts of slight gains. So it may well be that it's being used more in sport because it's harder to detect/faster to flush but that doesn't mean it's "as big a help as steroids" as you're trying to suggest. It may also be that it can "help" you train harder but many things can, like what BJS got caught out with and even some supplements(isn't creatine sold on that basis?) but that's not the same as what steroids do.

Didn't the official press release state "trace amounts", I read the same rumours which quote all sorts of lofty amounts but none of the fanboys pushing it had anything to back up their claims unsurprisingly, another common pattern.

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2018/3/...-steroids-ng-ml-ggg-vada-wada-ped-failed-test

Both samples tested positive for clenbuterol. ESPN posted the letter sent by VADA, which stated Canelo’s Feb 17th sample came back with 0.6-0.8 ng/ml of clenbuterol, and the Feb 20th sample came back with 0.06-0.08 ng/ml of clenbuterol
...
Results below 1 ng/ml, like Canelo’s, are commonly caused by contaminated meat. WADA itself said the following about samples from the Beijing 2008 Olympics: “All of the values were below 1ng/ml and therefore in the range of potential meat contamination cases.”

Also I don't see what's wrong with me disagreeing with you and making my own mind up about Canelo based on watching him fight for years and the information we do have at hand about his supposed cheating. Everything from the wraps, injection marks, buying off judges, I've heard it all and covered my thoughts on them. Some of the shouts such as Golden Boy buying judges don't seem so far fetched(though they've never changed a correct result if that is the case thankfully) but for most of it not only can none of them ever back up their claims(or the claim itself is weird like the wraps which Sanchez oversaw being done himself... but waited a year to point out, hmm?) it's clear people have an axe to grind and GGG's name is never far away. Rather than fighting his corner I'm simply expressing my right to disagree and make my own mind up because I've been watching the sport long enough to do that. He's almost like the Raheem Sterling of boxing the way people are with him: "he's a **** his hairs ginger and his fingernails are dirty, so he's no good and you're not allowed to like him in the slightest" and the way they go after people who simply disagree is cultist in my view. He's not my favourite fighter but I'm not jumping on the bandwagon sorry.

As an aside I've noticed contrary to popular belief he's had hate from Mexicans for years too(Robert Garcia touched on this in one of his videos), there's boxing forum posts asking why so many Mexicans hate him as far back as 2010, theories ranging from how he changed to a more defensive style post Mayweather fight to the catchweight situations. I wonder what they make of Margarito now, if it is down to stuff like that? At least he's getting well paid for it I guess.

Regarding the use of the drug itself, it's clearly cheating and I was disappointed in him because he has tarnished his reputation needlessly but it's undeniable there are double standards where he is concerned. What's your view on Fury now you've learned he did worse out of interest?

I don't buy the contaminated meat theory either, it's not impossible because they do apparently use it south of the border but I'm sceptical of that excuse. I think many boxers are using PEDs is the thing, which nobody wants to hear about their favourite fighters but most of the top fighters will be in my view, I just think it's important to understand there are levels to it.
 
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Between the two cards in England and the one in NYC tomorrow, plenty of big names out to play in pre Xmas action.
Should be a top night for serious boxing fans with some good 50/50 fights as well as the 1/33 knock overs.
 
I can't recall the last time Sky and BT had a ppv on the same night. Gonna be expensive for fight fans.
Was thinking that myself mate, wish I knew of a nice relaxing environment where I could enjoy both fights.
 

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