The Conservative Party

[bluethrunthru]

This is just phoning it in. It’s virtue signalling during a pandemic with over a thousand a day dying and Brexit issues galore.

Mr Jenrick wants to stop leftwing councils from replacing street names which are linked to the Empire with more modern versions if there is not clear majority for it among people living there. The move is one of the first salvoes by the Tory government in the culture war. @telegraph

but what if a right wing council wants to rename Che' Guevara Street Douglas Bader Avenue - is that similarly frowned upon by Jenprick?

 

[blue cigar]

I defend them on certain issues, criticise on others.

The problem is, there’s no objectivity in this thread because it’s such a left wing forum, everything is hyperbole.

If you put the most competent leader to ever govern in charge of the UK, I still think there would be at least 10,000’s of deaths, whereas you blame them for every single death in a highly contagious pandemic.

Also, a significant proportion of that 90,000 are killed because of the measures themselves to stop the spread.

There was a study 4/5 months ago that said for every 3 Covid deaths, 2 more would die from lockdown measures, directly or indirectly.

Care homes, travel bans and delays to lockdown they’ve failed in, but vaccines and furlough they’ve succeeded.

Yes, there would be a lot of deaths whoever was in charge, just nowhere near as many. It's been a disaster from them, like a village council running the show. He's been behind the curve from the start and his late u turns display confusion in govt.
Don't forget the ppe shitshow, do you know that when they were quoting the amount of kit they provided they counted each glove as a number instead of a pair?
I've said it before but in my experience, Tories care more about economics than people

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

I have no idea how socialism equates to inefficiency. Compared to the US health system, the NHS is brilliantly efficient.

As can be seen from the roll out of vaccinations and vaccination centres..... see what happens when you dont use SERCO & G4s.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

This is just phoning it in. It’s virtue signalling during a pandemic with over a thousand a day dying and Brexit issues galore.

Mr Jenrick wants to stop leftwing councils from replacing street names which are linked to the Empire with more modern versions if there is not clear majority for it among people living there. The move is one of the first salvoes by the Tory government in the culture war. @telegraph

The rise of Nationalism

 

[Rascal]

I have no idea how socialism equates to inefficiency. Compared to the US health system, the NHS is brilliantly efficient.

The belief in capitalist efficiency is created because it measures cost in financial terms. Under Socialism cost is measured differently, it is measured in terms of social cost.

There is also a lot of myth surrounding this, obviously most of the myth is created by Capitalists who see everything in terms of financial cost/profit. so they create myth that encourages people in thinking social cost is unimportant,

I.E The USSR put a man in space first, but the social cost was enormous, e.g totalitarianism etc The US put a man is space and it was a triumph of capitalist ingenuity, because profit was made from the cost. e,g on items developed for the programme.

Maybe that is a poor example actually, but hopefully you get my meaning.

Railways, if run for capitalist efficiency measures cost in term of profit, Socialism would measure it in terms of jobs created and advantages for society.

Socialism being inefficient is often attributed to it being a bureaucracy and Capitalists will say that the lack of incentive i.e lack of profit makes workers less likely to work hard.

What is overlooked is how inefficient Capitalism can be, Prof Richard Wolff claims capitalism is is inefficient because it wastes resources that leads to inequality and environmental destruction. Capitalism also serves the interests of shareholders and board members as they search for profit and market share rather than the needs of society so it comes at a social cost.

 

[metalblue]

The Labour party advocated free broadband. Imagine how far that would have gone to help poor kids with their school work.

Yet they were roundly laughed at for it.

If only the Labour Leader hadn't spoke with the IRA prisoners in the Maze to see if he could get them to support the Good Friday agreement our kids would be getting help with schooling.

Corbyn wanted to nationalise broadband and give it to us for “free” (it’s not really free as someone aka the taxpayer has to pay for everything we say is free). I can’t imagine there are many countries where the state own the internet. China, Russia and North Korea are probably nailed on to. A future where Google would have been “blocked” and my new search engine would have been called ComradeCorbynKnows.com beckoned.

His biggest problem wasn’t his links or otherwise to the IRA it was because his policies were shit to the majority of the population.

 

[Rascal]

Corbyn wanted to nationalise broadband and give it to us for “free” (it’s not really free as someone aka the taxpayer has to pay for everything we say is free). I can’t imagine there are many countries where the state own the internet. China, Russia and North Korea are probably nailed on to. A future where Google would have been “blocked” and my new search engine would have been called ComradeCorbynKnows.com beckoned.

His biggest problem wasn’t his links or otherwise to the IRA it was because his policies were shit to the majority of the population.

Everybodies policies were shit according to the majority of the population.

Nothing is free, capitalists are happy to pay tax for stuff they benefit from personally, but are not happy to pay tax for stuff that benefits society. That is the inherent selfishness of capitalism.

Making broadband free is not censoring the internet, that is ridiculous and your description of Totalitarian states as being equal to Democratic Socialist states is Macarthyism on acid.

 

[urban genie]

Corbyn wanted to nationalise broadband and give it to us for “free” (it’s not really free as someone aka the taxpayer has to pay for everything we say is free). I can’t imagine there are many countries where the state own the internet. China, Russia and North Korea are probably nailed on to. A future where Google would have been “blocked” and my new search engine would have been called ComradeCorbynKnows.com beckoned.

His biggest problem wasn’t his links or otherwise to the IRA it was because his policies were shit to the majority of the population.

Everyone having broadband would be very helpfull if we ever had a nation crisis where people are stuck at home and schools and other resources are closed.

Let's hope that never happens.


Plus the original proposal was part nationalisation, much like the german model of public/private co-operation

 

[metalblue]

The belief in capitalist efficiency is created because it measures cost in financial terms. Under Socialism cost is measured differently, it is measured in terms of social cost.

There is also a lot of myth surrounding this, obviously most of the myth is created by Capitalists who see everything in terms of financial cost/profit. so they create myth that encourages people in thinking social cost is unimportant,

I.E The USSR put a man in space first, but the social cost was enormous, e.g totalitarianism etc The US put a man is space and it was a triumph of capitalist ingenuity, because profit was made from the cost. e,g on items developed for the programme.

Maybe that is a poor example actually, but hopefully you get my meaning.

Railways, if run for capitalist efficiency measures cost in term of profit, Socialism would measure it in terms of jobs created and advantages for society.

Socialism being inefficient is often attributed to it being a bureaucracy and Capitalists will say that the lack of incentive i.e lack of profit makes workers less likely to work hard.

What is overlooked is how inefficient Capitalism can be, Prof Richard Wolff claims capitalism is is inefficient because it wastes resources that leads to inequality and environmental destruction. Capitalism also serves the interests of shareholders and board members as they search for profit and market share rather than the needs of society so it comes at a social cost.

You can’t just measure something in the jobs it creates when they all need paying thou mate. That takes actual money, you know the stuff that comes from making a profit.

And if you tax people to remove all their profit to create jobs just for the sake of it people will pack their shit up and leave. As thatcher said the problem with socialism is you eventually run out of other peoples money. And she was right.

You can run companies in a more socialist way like co-ops

 

[metalblue]

Everybodies policies were shit according to the majority of the population.

Nothing is free, capitalists are happy to pay tax for stuff they benefit from personally, but are not happy to pay tax for stuff that benefits society. That is the inherent selfishness of capitalism.

Making broadband free is not censoring the internet, that is ridiculous and your description of Totalitarian states as being equal to Democratic Socialist states is Macarthyism on acid.

Why would you need to nationalise the internet to achieve your aim of “free” broadband?

You get free bus passes but they aren’t nationalised