The Conservative Party

Octavian said:
Just one example, the UK government invested £16bn on future projects to help North Sea extraction companies.

Do you think Westminster just lets them keep it for the sake of good will?
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It's their oil, just like we've reclaimed our happy fish.
 
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Octavian said:
It was actually the Liberal Party who was in charge and a Welshman as Prime Minister, before, up to, during and following the War for Independence.
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I’ll try to make this brief.
The facts you state are correct but I’ll give you a little context.
As far back as 1885 when Charles Stewart Parnell was head of the most stable parliamentary party in Westminster- The Irish Parliamentary Party- Gladstone was head of the Liberals.
The Conservatives and The Libs were almost equal and dependant in Parnell for support.
Gladstone vowed to run with Home Rule and got the support of Parnell’s party.

Carson kicked up even back then about never accepting any such bill getting through parliament and Randolph Churchill went to Belfast and gave the famous speech saying ‘Ulster will fight and Ulster will be right.’
And they didn’t mean they’ll fight it in parliament and at the ballot box.

The first Home Rule bill had been defeated because Libs and Conservatives in Ulster banded together and voted against it.

However the second Home Rule bill in 1886 was passed through The Commons but the House of Lords wouldn’t pass it. You should have had a constitutional crisis right there… but no.
Parnell was scandalised over his affair with Kitty O’Shea and replaced by John Redmond as pro Parnell and John Dillon anti Parnell. The party was split and weakened. (Divide and conquer sound familiar)

There was no fight for home rule for a while.

1895 The Tories get in for the next 10 years. They side with the Unionists. Not a hope of Home Rule.

I’ll speed this up.

It’s only after Asquith took over from Bannerman in 1908 that the Libs tried to get the power of The House of Lords to stop their bills being written into law, emasculated for want of a better word.
By the January elections of 1910 Asquith needed the Irish Parliamentary Party to carry the budget. The Lords had to accept and left themselves open to a bill emasculating The Lords.
They voted it down again having got through The Commons.
This caused a dissolution of parliament and another December election which the Libs won again with the help of the IPP.
This time they could not block the bill.
In gratitude for nationalist support we were promised Home Rule within two years as The Lords could only reject a bill for three consecutive parliamentary sittings.
That was 1911. This meant Home Rule by about 1914.

Then the war happened.
Very quickly; after the war we had two All Ireland democratic votes in favour of home rule that were rejected by a Conservative Ulster Unionists combinations that would not accept it regardless.
Carson had the North armed to the teeth with Conservative backing.

So yes you are right. The Libs were in government which is why we were democratically getting anywhere.
And I would say we were blockaded at every turn by Conservative/Unionist opposition who were quite willing to use force.

I think Aguero 93:20 had a point.
 
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west didsblue said:
Have you ever wondered why the U.K. needs to put more into Scotland than it gets out?
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Octavian said:
The relevance is you’re saying the same stuff the Brexit campaign did.

“We can be (this country), we can be (that country)”

Comparing countries that haven’t had decades wrapped within a union is stupid.

Just as comparing splitting a country in two, then comparing what’s left, with countries of a similar population is.

We know the UK government gives more to Scotland in public spending than they give to the UK government in the first place.

There will be a huge black hole come independence.
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That deficit has only existed the last few years and most of it caused by debt interest applied to us from the Uk. Before that we contributed more than we took out. Not our fault that Westminster pissed the oil revenues up the wall. We will be fine thanks for caring.
 
bluethrunthru said:
How does this prick account for those EU member states with higher productivity than us whilst also having the WTD?




International comparisons of UK productivity (ICP), final estimates - Office for National Statistics

A comparison of productivity across the G7 nations, including analysis of levels and growth rates of labour productivity and multifactor productivity.
www.ons.gov.uk
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Fucking scandalous, they are literally tearing up our rights in front of our faces and saying fuck you. Labour need to stamp all over this.
 
Watching the news, the reports are the same on most of the channels with harrowing stories on how people are trying to just survive. The ITV news at 6.30 had a story about 3 or 4 people in the North East, but it could have been anywhere really.

All types of people are struggling, from young people, parents with young children, employed people and pensioners. The country is absolutely on its arse. What on earth do these Tory MP’s think when this is front and centre on all news channels-I’m alright jack so fuck you? How are they not thoroughly embarrassed by this shit?
 
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