The Labour Government

bluenova said:
Obviously if they're solely British citizens, there isn't anywhere to deport them to.

However, thousands of people are deported every year due to criminal convictions. As far as I can see, the Home Office stats suggest that the majority of those who meet the criteria end up being deported.

Are you talking about specific cases?
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I'm talking about these two.
www.theguardian.com

Rochdale grooming gang members to be deported to Pakistan

Adil Khan and Qari Abdul Rauf lose appeal as judges say ‘very strong public interest’ to deport them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
hampshireblue said:
Interestingly the Times reporter who exposed the latest cases has doen an interview on the podcast " The News Agents". During that interview he is adamant that Starmer was instrumental in changing the rules to allow proper investigations and charges to be brought. So far from being a blocker. the opposite seems to be the case. The reporter is not a known Starmer fan but at least has been accurate on the matter.
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That doesn't even seem to be up for debate, even with minimal knowledge.

It does seem odd we're in a situation where we've got people like Jess Phillips and Starmer being given grief, when they can easily point to what they've done. At the same time, Badenoch and Jenrick have to bluff there way out of any questions about their inaction as ministers.
 
Really_here said:
I'm talking about these two.
www.theguardian.com

Rochdale grooming gang members to be deported to Pakistan

Adil Khan and Qari Abdul Rauf lose appeal as judges say ‘very strong public interest’ to deport them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...

From what I can see, that's an unusual case.

I genuinely have no idea what would happen if they are dual citizens (or now citizens of nowhere), and Pakistan won't take them.

What would you suggest? If we stick them on a plane, and Pakistan doesn't accept it, then they just get put on a plane back, surely?
 
There's an interesting article in the Guardian (I know) by Jonathan Portes. It sets out the economic challenges the country is facing over the next few years and states (inter alia) that upward pressures on interest rates are likely. So for everyone with mortgages, a fixed-term might be a good idea. The pressure seems to have more to do with US policy than anything we do here.

The article also mentions in passing that immigration is 'falling sharply'. That's interesting. Will people be appeased by this fact? Will Labour get any credit for it? Somehow, I doubt it.
 
BrianW said:
There's an interesting article in the Guardian (I know) by Jonathan Portes. It sets out the economic challenges the country is facing over the next few years and states (inter alia) that upward pressures on interest rates are likely. So for everyone with mortgages, a fixed-term might be a good idea. The pressure seems to have more to do with US policy than anything we do here.

The article also mentions in passing that immigration is 'falling sharply'. That's interesting. Will people be appeased by this fact? Will Labour get any credit for it? Somehow, I doubt it.
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Already under upward pressure. Markets are showing signs of a lack of confidence in the UK now. We’ve got 30 year yields at prices not seen since 1998 and 10 year rates at levels not seen since 2008 - normally you’d shrug and say it’s global headwinds but add in a weakening pound (which should be strengthening with higher yields) and you start to get a picture of reeves loosing the confidence of the markets in her ability to drive growth - not truss levels of loss but we last saw this trend of weakling pound and raising rates during that disastrous budget so not something to ignore. A blip it may yet prove but with £270bn up for auction this year the treasury are going to be a little concerned.
 
Really_here said:
I'm talking about these two.
www.theguardian.com

Rochdale grooming gang members to be deported to Pakistan

Adil Khan and Qari Abdul Rauf lose appeal as judges say ‘very strong public interest’ to deport them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...
It's actuallly very difficult to deport people against their will. This is a problem for many coountries not just the UK.
I suspect most criminals who are deported are deported whilst still incarcerated and serve out their sentence in their home country. Once released it becomes exponentially more diffuicult to enforce a deportation of someone with settled status in a country. Although countries have extradition treaties, none, that I know of, have deportation treaties for non-prisoners.
It is actually a bit of a fallicy to say deportation is an actionabe punishment. Very often countries refuse to accept unwilling criminals (why wouldn't you).

In the case of the two individuals from Rochdale they voluntarily gave up their Pakistani citizenship. Pakistan has accepted their decision (again, why not). The UK ever returning them to Pakistan has become unlikely.
What is needed is:
1) a re-negotiation so that there are extradition and deportation treaties. You can't have one without the other, and
2) deportation being an alternative to part of the sentence - you serve 8 years and agree to be deported, from prison direct to the airport, or you serve 16 years.
 
metalblue said:
Already under upward pressure. Markets are showing signs of a lack of confidence in the UK now. We’ve got 30 year yields at prices not seen since 1998 and 10 year rates at levels not seen since 2008 - normally you’d shrug and say it’s global headwinds but add in a weakening pound (which should be strengthening with higher yields) and you start to get a picture of reeves loosing the confidence of the markets in her ability to drive growth - not truss levels of loss but we last saw this trend of weakling pound and raising rates during that disastrous budget so not something to ignore. A blip it may yet prove but with £270bn up for auction this year the treasury are going to be a little concerned.
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The yield rates not seen since 1998 is a bit of a red herring.

They were under 1% as recently as the start of 2022, and were already over 5% in the last month of the Tory government. To be jumping to 5.3%, considering how much was done in the budget is a total nothing stat.
 
metalblue said:
With a weakening pound?
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Which was also lower earlier in 2024, and significantly lower a couple of years ago.

Look at the longer term graphs and the change since Labour came into power is minimal.

I doubt she's pleased, but it's hardly more than normal fluctuations.
 
bluenova said:
Which was also lower earlier in 2024, and significantly lower a couple of years ago.

Look at the longer term graphs and the change since Labour came into power is minimal.

I doubt she's pleased, but it's hardly more than normal fluctuations.
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It’s nothing to do with the individual parts but rather the divergence between rising rates and a falling pound. That’s not really normal - interest rates are used to weaken or strengthen a currency. Rising rates = strengthening of currency is the general principle. Although a blip it may yet prove to be - and if it was fairly shallow divergence it wouldn’t really raise much of an eyebrow but in this case it isn’t shallow nor showing signs of abating - some economists are saying it’s overdone as they think the UK economy will grow better than forecast but it’s hard to fight market sentiment.
 
Fordyboy46 said:
Starmer the harmer is an absolute clown. He'll be out at the next election
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He won't be, if him and Reeves grow the economy. Everything rests on that essentially. If people are feeling better off why would they vote Labour out. You could say the same with the Conservatives, but other factors came into play with them. Lots of stupid mistakes and a split vote with Reform eating into their voting share did for them.
 
Vic said:
The bottom line is that people would rather not pay tax - and gamble that it's not their relative's care cost eating away their inherited wealth.
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Disagree, most would happily pay a specific tax if it was ring fenced and went solely to providing non means tested high quality care in old age. You don’t pay NI when drawing a pension why not replace it with a care tax.
 
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