The Labour Government

philfodenswristsock said:
... some work place law fluffed out with some 'trans issues' or other stuff of little importance to the vast majority of the public.
Click to expand...

The work place changes are definitely not of little importance, fluffed out with trans issues.

You've got significant changes to unfair dismissal rights, sick pay, collective bargaining, zero hour contracts, union organisation, and tons more.

www.gov.uk

Employment Rights Bill: factsheets

Further details on the measures included within the Employment Rights Bill.
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk
 
For me, 16 years old is a bit too young to vote but you can start full time work at 16 so I think it is probably fair. I very much doubt that 16 year olds will vote for Labour or the Tories so probably good news for the Greens and possibly even Reform.
 
staffsblue said:
I think it's an excellent idea. Most of the 16 and 17 year olds I've conversed with recently are well informed and intelligent.

My 15 year old nephew (U15 goalkeeper for Boston United) even has his own LinkedIn page to highlight his football experience and abilities, as well as being ready to apply for further education or employment.
Click to expand...

16/17 year olds would have voted to remain, it could have swung the result and look at the disaster that's happened since that vote.
 
maxwellblue said:
if you have to ask you're as deluded as I think you are
Click to expand...

I could be facetious and point out that we've debased our political discourse to the point where a reception class could understand it.

More seriously, a typical 16 year old is cognitively developed enough to vote. In the context of our education system if they're going to develop basic critical thinking skills they'll have developed them by that point. Plenty of older adults don't have strong cognitive skills but we don't disenfranchise them. Beyond cognition what else should count? Start applying 'life experience' or 'emotional maturity' and where does that lead us in terms of who can and can't have the vote in the wider population? As for being susceptible to influence then social media has rendered half the population incapable; in fact I'd suggest a typical 16 year old has more understanding of how social media manipulates them than the average 40 year old.

If it's any consolation in places where they lowered the voting age, like Austria, the studies suggest that the younger voters are at least as engaged and informed as the older voting population if not more so and I'm not aware of any catastrophic consequences.
 
M18CTID said:
Is deluded the only word you're capable of using on these threads? It seems to be your only comeback

Why don't you fucking well enlighten us as to what's wrong with giving 16 and 17 year olds the chance to vote?
Click to expand...
It is a word that describes a large number of the posters on this thread very aptly.
 
bluenova said:
The work place changes are definitely not of little importance, fluffed out with trans issues.

You've got significant changes to unfair dismissal rights, sick pay, collective bargaining, zero hour contracts, union organisation, and tons more.

www.gov.uk

Employment Rights Bill: factsheets

Further details on the measures included within the Employment Rights Bill.
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk
Click to expand...
Yep. I agree. Its not an insignificant piece of legislation. But for the average person they won't understand or care. Sick pay rights won't be spoken about at the school gate. If they want to effect people's lives for the better, tackle bills. The Labour Party will be crying for Burnham within a year. He will be deemed as populist but within reason. The push of the centre to the Right and the push of the Right to the populist hard Right will leave a vacuum on the Left. If Labour don't find a leader who at the very least talks the language of the populist Left. Corbyn will move in. I suspect it's actually too late for them tbh
 
threespires said:
If choice A is shit and choice B is shit it doesn't automatically make sense to vote for Choice C simply because it's not A or B. I keep asking a question and no one answers me, what is it that Reform are going to do that would make things better and what gives you the confidence based on evidence to date that they would be able to do a good job?

You could equally ask, why do I think they can't do a good job? In which case I would point out that historically right-wing populist governments almost never ever deliver sustainable improvements for ordinary people. I'd also point out that some of the types of policies Reform have indicated they'd pursue will probably result in worse services for more money, for example if you think our healthcare model is inefficient per £ then go and have a look at the US one. I'd point out that the free market, low tax model Farage has always aligned himself with, has shown itself over decades to favour the rich rather than ordinary people. At which point I'd also note that Farage is a multi millionaire who hangs round with billionaires and despite his photo ops in pubs has no idea whatsoever about ordinary peoples lives. I'd point out that whilst going in hard on immigration might (in about a dozen areas of the country) provide some short term relief on housing and services pressures, pretty much every economic model out there suggests it will actually cause bigger problems than it solves. I'd point out that at least one Reform council leader is asking the government to loosen it's visa restrictions because she's realised the complexity of the issue. I'd point out that Farage personally has a long track record of using public office to enrich himself whilst doing as little as possible as part of that public service. I'd point out during Brexit he applied for and got a German passport so that any impacts other people felt, he could swerve. I'd point out the problems that exist already in the Reform controlled councils that suggest despite repeated promises over the years to built a functional political party, Farage is either unwilling or incapable of doing so. And so on.

As far as I can tell the one thing Reform has got going for it is a commitment to PR but then you can get that from other parties.

From what I can see voting Reform only makes obvious some sense if you are either a multi-millionaire or a racist or for some reason you actively want to live in a poundshop version of Trump's America. I don't believe the majority of Reform voters are those things, I think they are mostly ordinary understandably pissed off working class people. Assuming you don't fit into the three categories above, please tell what is it you expect to see happen that will improve your life? Why does it make sense ? Because I just can't see it. I can only see (very understandably) pissed off people jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire and to me that doesn't make sense at all.
Click to expand...
Cool story Bro.
 
maxwellblue said:
It is a word that describes a large number of the posters on this thread very aptly.
Click to expand...
That didn't answer my question. Clearly you're completely and utterly incapable of offering up a plausible explanation as to why 16 and 17 year olds shouldn't be given the vote. Probably because you're moaning about this government just for the sake of it and you've fuck all else to offer on the topic.
 
M18CTID said:
That didn't answer my question. Clearly you're completely and utterly incapable of offering up a plausible explanation as to why 16 and 17 year olds shouldn't be given the vote. Probably because you're moaning about this government just for the sake of it and you've fuck all else to offer on the topic.
Click to expand...
Actually trying to discuss or debate any point with the left wing snowflakes on here is pretty pointless.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
No thanks, It's part of our history and we are still paying the price.
Click to expand...
maybe if you and the other remainers hadn't blocked it or tried to overturn the vote at every opportunity and accepted the democratic vote at the outset we may have actually got the Brexit that was voted for and not the watered down waste of time we have.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top