The Pro Road Cycling Thread

[Jazzman]

Pogacar you beauty.
You can stick your pasty faced skeletal grand tour winner, this fella really is the greatest rider out there.
Those scenes on the last climb in Bergamo were truly fabulous.
A sheer pleasure to watch that today.

I don't get that Vingegaard hate. You are probably right that Pogacar is the most multitalented rider out there. All the more respect I think is due to Vingegaard, who is honing his main talent as a 3 week rider to be good enough to beat that Slovenian superman. Vingegaard can't do what Pogacar can do in the 1 day races, but he has made himself the better Grand Tour rider in the last 2 years. He is surely not a sunny boy or a show man like Pogacar, just a simple and earnest guy from a small town in Jutland making the most of his talent. Not much to hate there in my book. Mind I am also a guy from a small town in Jutland so maybe I get Vingegaard.

 

[chesterbells]

I don't get that Vingegaard hate. You are probably right that Pogacar is the most multitalented rider out there. All the more respect I think is due to Vingegaard, who is honing his main talent as a 3 week rider to be good enough to beat that Slovenian superman. Vingegaard can't do what Pogacar can do in the 1 day races, but he has made himself the better Grand Tour rider in the last 2 years. He is surely not a sunny boy or a show man like Pogacar, just a simple and earnest guy from a small town in Jutland making the most of his talent. Not much to hate there in my book. Mind I am also a guy from a small town in Jutland so maybe I get Vingegaard.

That’s fair comment and I apologise if I’ve been unduly abusive about your countryman.
I suppose it just boils down to me being sceptical about his performances and his rise to the worlds No1 GT rider at the moment, but I was too personal in what I posted about him.

If you follow pro cycling long enough, which I guess we both do, you really have to have these thoughts in the back of your mind somewhere, deep down, every time you watch a race.

I remember when Wiggins looked super thin in the year he won his Tour and I found that hard to believe. And now, looking at JV I just find the watts and speeds he’s been delivering on some of these mountains to be beyond comprehension. I of course don’t have anything concrete to base it on, other than a gut feeling, that is doesn’t seem quite right.

Maybe the problem is mine, but I’m afraid years of watching pro-cycling had done that to me.

 

[Jazzman]

That’s fair comment and I apologise if I’ve been unduly abusive about your countryman.
I suppose it just boils down to me being sceptical about his performances and his rise to the worlds No1 GT rider at the moment, but I was too personal in what I posted about him.

If you follow pro cycling long enough, which I guess we both do, you really have to have these thoughts in the back of your mind somewhere, deep down, every time you watch a race.

I remember when Wiggins looked super thin in the year he won his Tour and I found that hard to believe. And now, looking at JV I just find the watts and speeds he’s been delivering on some of these mountains to be beyond comprehension. I of course don’t have anything concrete to base it on, other than a gut feeling, that is doesn’t seem quite right.

Maybe the problem is mine, but I’m afraid years of watching pro-cycling had done that to me.

Thanks for this reply. I was answering to you but also to others who I have seen having similar views about Vingegaard. Clearly my opinion is colored being a fellow Dane.
I think your scepticism is understandable. Like you I am "harmed" by the past events in cycling, and unfortunately nobody can ever give us any guarantees against doping. But the same scepticism is valid towards Pog I think. He also won the Tour in the first try quite surprisingly.
I have decided to believe they do not cheat until it is proven otherwise. It is the only way I can enjoy that great sport.
I understand anyone who like Pog more than Vingegaard. Pog is easier to like, and Jonas is a quiet guy from the same place as me, who will never have the same star appeal. I think they both deserve the utmost respect for what they do, and I look forward to the next duel in France 2024.
Probably my longest ever post :-)

 

[chesterbells]

Thanks for this reply. I was answering to you but also to others who I have seen having similar views about Vingegaard. Clearly my opinion is colored being a fellow Dane.
I think your scepticism is understandable. Like you I am "harmed" by the past events in cycling, and unfortunately nobody can ever give us any guarantees against doping. But the same scepticism is valid towards Pog I think. He also won the Tour in the first try quite surprisingly.
I have decided to believe they do not cheat until it is proven otherwise. It is the only way I can enjoy that great sport.
I understand anyone who like Pog more than Vingegaard. Pog is easier to like, and Jonas is a quiet guy from the same place as me, who will never have the same star appeal. I think they both deserve the utmost respect for what they do, and I look forward to the next duel in France 2024.
Probably my longest ever post :-)

Thanks likewise for your reply, and your passion for your countryman is understandable; I’ve found it hard to get my head around the idea not all British riders might to totally clean.

I think I’ve come to think more highly of riders who can perform in 1 day races too, as compared to a 3 week GT it just seems a much more human (and not superhuman!) endeavour.

And yes, you are correct, it’s also possible to be doubtful of Pog too, I do accept that, though his “all round” talent makes me less so.

I think with Jonas my turning point/breaking point might have been that TT with 7.5watts/kg for over 13 mins, which I found just beyond comprehension (link below).

Anyway, thanks for the exchange- I enjoy talking cycling on here- and I’m sure you live in a lovely part of the world - maybe I’ll get my own bike over there one day :-)

Tour de France Power: The numbers behind Vingegaard's TT and Sepp Kuss on the Col de la Loze

Literally no one expected Vingegaard to beat Tadej Pogačar by one minute and 38 seconds in stage 16’s time trial.

velo.outsideonline.com

 

[Jazzman]

Thanks likewise for your reply, and your passion for your countryman is understandable; I’ve found it hard to get my head around the idea not all British riders might to totally clean.

I think I’ve come to think more highly of riders who can perform in 1 day races too, as compared to a 3 week GT it just seems a much more human (and not superhuman!) endeavour.

And yes, you are correct, it’s also possible to be doubtful of Pog too, I do accept that, though his “all round” talent makes me less so.

I think with Jonas my turning point/breaking point might have been that TT with 7.5watts/kg for over 13 mins, which I found just beyond comprehension (link below).

Anyway, thanks for the exchange- I enjoy talking cycling on here- and I’m sure you live in a lovely part of the world - maybe I’ll get my own bike over there one day :-)

Tour de France Power: The numbers behind Vingegaard's TT and Sepp Kuss on the Col de la Loze

Literally no one expected Vingegaard to beat Tadej Pogačar by one minute and 38 seconds in stage 16’s time trial.

velo.outsideonline.com

Yes that TT was unbelievable, and possibly questionable. I am less of an expert than you I think, so I cannot argue against it. There were other days where Jonas had minor crises if that makes him less of a suspect.
One thing I really like about cycling is that it is less of a national thing. Sure I like the danish riders, but I actually like all of them no matter where they are from. Van Aert, Van der Pool, G, there are so many to like.
I have lived in South Germany for almost 30 years by the way, so I suppose that makes my half German from a practical point of view. Hasn't stopped me from having an extra eye on Danish sportsmen and women. In cycling it is a golden age for Denmark at the moment.

 

[Bob Hope]

Yes that TT was unbelievable, and possibly questionable. I am less of an expert than you I think, so I cannot argue against it. There were other days where Jonas had minor crises if that makes him less of a suspect.
One thing I really like about cycling is that it is less of a national thing. Sure I like the danish riders, but I actually like all of them no matter where they are from. Van Aert, Van der Pool, G, there are so many to like.
I have lived in South Germany for almost 30 years by the way, so I suppose that makes my half German from a practical point of view. Hasn't stopped me from having an extra eye on Danish sportsmen and women. In cycling it is a golden age for Denmark at the moment.

You think it's clean or you don't.
Which is it?

 

[Bob Hope]

Thanks likewise for your reply, and your passion for your countryman is understandable; I’ve found it hard to get my head around the idea not all British riders might to totally clean.

I think I’ve come to think more highly of riders who can perform in 1 day races too, as compared to a 3 week GT it just seems a much more human (and not superhuman!) endeavour.

And yes, you are correct, it’s also possible to be doubtful of Pog too, I do accept that, though his “all round” talent makes me less so.

I think with Jonas my turning point/breaking point might have been that TT with 7.5watts/kg for over 13 mins, which I found just beyond comprehension (link below).

Anyway, thanks for the exchange- I enjoy talking cycling on here- and I’m sure you live in a lovely part of the world - maybe I’ll get my own bike over there one day :-)

Tour de France Power: The numbers behind Vingegaard's TT and Sepp Kuss on the Col de la Loze

Literally no one expected Vingegaard to beat Tadej Pogačar by one minute and 38 seconds in stage 16’s time trial.

velo.outsideonline.com

To you as well do you think cycling is doping or is it clean?

 

[chesterbells]

To you as well do you think cycling is doping or is it clean?

There was once a famous phrase first asked many years ago in cycling about whether you really think cyclists really complete the Tour on “bread & water” alone.

The short answer for me would be “probably” there is doping in pro cycling. But then I’m a cynical sort who thinks PEDs are used in many/most sports at the top level.

 

[Jazzman]

You think it's clean or you don't.
Which is it?

I think Vingegaard is clean.

 

[Bob Hope]

I think Vingegaard is clean.

I'm not convinced, I really hope he is after the fucking disgraceful era that was Armstrong