United thread 2013/14

[Blue Haze]

You have to love the Glazers

I do. Some of the best owners in football.

Hope they never sell. #moyesforever #chosenone

 

[EricBrooksGhost]

It's not their view as to its likelihood that marks their bitterness, but rather (although not exclusively) a widespread sense of injustice that it's even possible. They were perfectly content with the way football finances were organised after they'd carved it up to meet their own ends. Now the pieces on the board have moved, due in no small part to their naked avarice, it's "boo-hoo it's all so fucking unfair".

I've said it before but it bears repeating. In 1981 five clubs (them, Liverpool, Everton, Arsenal & Spurs) threatened to form a breakaway league unless the other clubs agreed to their proposal to stop sharing gate receipts and allow the home team to keep them all.

From that moment, the financial dynamic was changed in football and only Leeds managed to briefly break the stranglehold that these five clubs had on the league and that eventually bankrupted them.

In 1992, the same five clubs pushed for the formation of the Premier League and took the TV money (which had previously been shared with the lower divisions) all for themselves.

In the 32 years since 1981 only 4 teams outside that group of 5 have won the title, with only Chelsea winning it more than once so far. The "gang of 5" have won the title on 25 occasions. In the 30 years prior to 1981/2, something like 14 different teams won the league.

It's really not that bad though to want the money from the gate receipts through your stadium paid for by 95% of your fans. It's like Tesco complaining they don't get half of the profit Asda makes when they sell a can of beans. It's also not really difficult to understand that the 5 clubs with the biggest attendances will be the ones fighting for it.

And after around 100 years or so of playing against each other there's a sudden "road to Damascus moment "; let's keep the home receipts. Cartel building and consolidation of power, nothing more.

 

[pirate]

You have to love the Glazers

I do. Some of the best owners in football.

Hope they never sell. #moyesforever #chosenone

is that chose none or chosen one? both work when talking about moyes

 

[laserblue]

Shit analogy & you've missed the point. If someone bought a smaller supermarket group like Booths & poured money into until it rivalled Tesco, Asda and Sainsburys then there could and would be no complaint. Tesco wouldn't be whining that they'd built their business up over many years and Booths had no right to have outside investment. That's business.

The system of revenue sharing prior to 1981 was designed to ensure a relatively level playing field financially. That's what happens in the NFL, NBA and MLB and no one dominates. Only Liverpool & Everton, with the wealth of the Moores family, had a little bit more money in those days. There was very little TV money and therefore not much prize money in those days so gate money was the main revenue stream. So taking money off the smaller clubs was inherently unfair as that tipped the balance financially. Those 5 clubs went on to dominate the landscape as they then had more money (and the clubs with the most money usually win more things) while the other clubs had less. At least we've not 'stolen' money off other clubs to get where we are.

It's not a shit analogy at all and I've not missed the point. No-one can seriously have a problem with clubs wanting to keep the money that they have earned through their own supporters and due to the product that they supply. If you didn't like my previous analogy then perhaps it would be better to use an entertainment one, as that is what football is; it would be like Peter Kay giving half of his ticket sales to Jason Manford.

And comparing it to American sport does you no favours when their entire system is setup up for equality. If you want to follow the American way then there shall be no relegations and the team that finishes last gets to choose the best of the upcoming talent the following year.

Where your argument falls down is that the system of sharing gate receipts continues in the domestic cup competitions. I take it you wouldn't agree with the rags if they drew a non-league club at home in the FA Cup (which they not infrequently do) and tell them they can only have say 10% of the gate receipts because they are small and unworthy and most of the fans in the ground are rags and if they don't like it they can fuck off.

What happened with the league gate receipts was the result of the playground bullies ganging up on the other kids. Once they got their way all league clubs had to follow suit, making smaller clubs particularly vulnerable if they have a run of away games, especially long distance, as a result of the shake up of the fixtures or a couple of home game postponements. Not that the rag 5 ever gave a toss.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

I've said it before but it bears repeating. In 1981 five clubs (them, Liverpool, Everton, Arsenal & Spurs) threatened to form a breakaway league unless the other clubs agreed to their proposal to stop sharing gate receipts and allow the home team to keep them all.

From that moment, the financial dynamic was changed in football and only Leeds managed to briefly break the stranglehold that these five clubs had on the league and that eventually bankrupted them.

In 1992, the same five clubs pushed for the formation of the Premier League and took the TV money (which had previously been shared with the lower divisions) all for themselves.

In the 32 years since 1981 only 4 teams outside that group of 5 have won the title, with only Chelsea winning it more than once so far. The "gang of 5" have won the title on 25 occasions. In the 30 years prior to 1981/2, something like 14 different teams won the league.

It's really not that bad though to want the money from the gate receipts through your stadium paid for by 95% of your fans. It's like Tesco complaining they don't get half of the profit Asda makes when they sell a can of beans. It's also not really difficult to understand that the 5 clubs with the biggest attendances will be the ones fighting for it.

And after around 100 years or so of playing against each other there's a sudden "road to Damascus moment "; let's keep the home receipts. Cartel building and consolidation of power, nothing more.

It's akin to the USA lecturing China about their use of fossil fuels: "it's delivered us to where we find ourselves and we're not prepared to make any sacrifices, but you're not entitled to enjoy the same benefits."

They changed the rules of the game. Mansour and Abramovich are a natural consequence of that. Only an idiot could not understand and appreciate that fact.

They created the monster that they jealously cast their glaze upon.

It's truly beautiful when you think about it.

Watch it, drink it in.

 

[EricBrooksGhost]

It's really not that bad though to want the money from the gate receipts through your stadium paid for by 95% of your fans. It's like Tesco complaining they don't get half of the profit Asda makes when they sell a can of beans. It's also not really difficult to understand that the 5 clubs with the biggest attendances will be the ones fighting for it.

And after around 100 years or so of playing against each other there's a sudden "road to Damascus moment "; let's keep the home receipts. Cartel building and consolidation of power, nothing more.

It's akin to the USA lecturing China about their use of fossil fuels: "it's delivered us to where we find ourselves and we're not prepared to make any sacrifices, but you're not entitled to enjoy the same benefits."

They changed the rules of the game. Mansour and Abramovich are a natural consequence of that. Only an idiot could not understand and appreciate that fact.

They created the monster that they jealously cast their glaze upon.

It's truly beautiful when you think about it.

Watch it, drink it in.

So true. As to drinking it in, it's something I personally excel in. When you decide to venture skyward and sit with us gods in CBL3 I shall have some of Cuba's finest to fortify your coffee.

 

[Dave S]

And after around 100 years or so of playing against each other there's a sudden "road to Damascus moment "; let's keep the home receipts. Cartel building and consolidation of power, nothing more.

It's akin to the USA lecturing China about their use of fossil fuels: "it's delivered us to where we find ourselves and we're not prepared to make any sacrifices, but you're not entitled to enjoy the same benefits."

They changed the rules of the game. Mansour and Abramovich are a natural consequence of that. Only an idiot could not understand and appreciate that fact.

They created the monster that they jealously cast their glaze upon.

It's truly beautiful when you think about it.

Watch it, drink it in.

So true. As to drinking it in, it's something I personally excel in. When you decide to venture skyward and sit with us gods in CBL3 I shall have some of Cuba's finest to fortify your coffee.

Me too. Cheers :0)

 

[El Mago Silva]

Check out paedo #2 - typical rag haha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iqG7IhWTWU

 

[I'm With Stupid]

Check out paedo #2 - typical rag haha

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iqG7IhWTWU

LOL, that's the least convincing 15 year old girl I've ever seen.

 

[malg]

Shit analogy & you've missed the point. If someone bought a smaller supermarket group like Booths & poured money into until it rivalled Tesco, Asda and Sainsburys then there could and would be no complaint. Tesco wouldn't be whining that they'd built their business up over many years and Booths had no right to have outside investment. That's business.

The system of revenue sharing prior to 1981 was designed to ensure a relatively level playing field financially. That's what happens in the NFL, NBA and MLB and no one dominates. Only Liverpool & Everton, with the wealth of the Moores family, had a little bit more money in those days. There was very little TV money and therefore not much prize money in those days so gate money was the main revenue stream. So taking money off the smaller clubs was inherently unfair as that tipped the balance financially. Those 5 clubs went on to dominate the landscape as they then had more money (and the clubs with the most money usually win more things) while the other clubs had less. At least we've not 'stolen' money off other clubs to get where we are.

It's not a shit analogy at all and I've not missed the point. No-one can seriously have a problem with clubs wanting to keep the money that they have earned through their own supporters and due to the product that they supply. If you didn't like my previous analogy then perhaps it would be better to use an entertainment one, as that is what football is; it would be like Peter Kay giving half of his ticket sales to Jason Manford.

And comparing it to American sport does you no favours when their entire system is setup up for equality. If you want to follow the American way then there shall be no relegations and the team that finishes last gets to choose the best of the upcoming talent the following year.

If you believe that, then the next inexorable step is to share the Sky TV money out according to who is biggest. At this moment in time this would benefit us, but the Filth would outgun everyone. To be honest it would be fair, as the Filth are the biggest draw in football, and they've worked hard to make it that way, so why shouldn't they get the lions share of TV revenue?