United Thread - 2022/23

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tolmie's hairdoo said:
It's not who, but when.

If I fight five journeymen boxers in succession and KO them all in the first round, it gives a warped perspective of form.

Especially so, if another opponent has already fought those same journeymen, but perhaps those bouts were interspersed with greater tests against more seasoned opponents.

All about timings. Very reason Solskjaer was installed in the caretaker job at United when he was.

Very reason most clubs sack a manager when a more favourable set of fixtures are on the horizon.
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I have a different take. Either they are exceptionally lucky or (imo) dark forces are in play to assist them in game management/key decisions whenever they take to the field.

The authorities who run the Premier League are powerful and corrupt; with an agenda in favour of the red tops - which they don’t even have to hide, thanks to an equally corrupt Media.

Winston Churchill once reportedly said that “the only statistics you can trust are the ones you have falsified yourself”. How apt!

I accept it leaves me open to being labelled a conspiracy theorist but I genuinely believe it.
 
OccupiedPalestineBlues said:
So you think that they’ve had a ‘ridiculously kind‘ run of fixtures - you’ve got me baffled mate because they’re 17 games into the season, they’ve played almost exactly the same teams that we’ve played / had almost exactly the same run of fixtures that we’ve had.

We’re one of only 2 PL teams they’ve not played.
They play us next weekend and if they beat us they’re only one point behind us.
You putting it down to them having had preferable league opposition to date is weird as fuck if you don’t mind me saying ;-)
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Pretty sure we played them once ..6-3 springs to mind
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
It's not who, but when.

If I fight five journeymen boxers in succession and KO them all in the first round, it gives a warped perspective of form.

Especially so, if another opponent has already fought those same journeymen, but perhaps those bouts were interspersed with greater tests against more seasoned opponents.

All about timings. Very reason Solskjaer was installed in the caretaker job at United when he was.

Very reason most clubs sack a manager when a more favourable set of fixtures are on the horizon.
Click to expand...

Ah right then. So, at the end of the season when every team has played every other team twice, the winners might not truly be the winners because they played the same teams that every other team played in a different order?

No of course not, that would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it?

On the same basis, halfway through the season the points gained by each team represents their positioning / their worth as a footballing side in the context of half a season gone.
You can wrap that up anyway you like but it will always remain an indisputable fact.

Also, if you apply your twisted logic to this straightforward issue and persist with the delusion that the rags are absolute shite because they’ve only lost one of their last 10 games but ‘they were favourable fixtures’ then what must you think of us having dropped more points than them in that period.
And keep in mind that we dropped them to Brentford and Everton (surely ’favourable fixtures’) at our own ground.
According to your logic that make the rags shit and us shitter - which really isn’t so is it?
 
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blue by birth said:
Pretty sure we played them once ..6-3 springs to mind
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Yep, I’m glad to confirm that I watched the game and we beat them soundly (so not news to me) but that’s not a point of conjecture.
The point at issue is that we’re just about halfway through the season, having played almost exactly the same teams as them, but a nob end on here is spouting on about them being shite because they’ve had ‘favourable fixtures.
He added to that by claiming that it was their last x number of fixtures, or something of that nature, a period in which they’ve lost only 1 game and we ourselves have dropped points at home to Everton and got beaten at home by Brentford (points dropped at home in so called ‘favourable’ fixtures).

I must say that I’m surprised at how some of our support have become so ridiculously arrogant since we’ve had success - many behaving as up their own deluded arses as the dippers are now or as the rags were back in the day when they had their golden moment.
I thought City supporters were above that, I thought we were fair minded realists but this forum is, sadly and embarrassingly, getting more and more like rawk nowadays.
 
OccupiedPalestineBlues said:
Ah right then. So, at the end of the season when every team has played every other team twice, the winners might not truly be the winners because they played the same teams that every other team played in a different order?

No of course not, that would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it?

On the same basis, halfway through the season the points gained by each team represents their positioning / their worth as a footballing side in the context of half a season gone.
You can wrap that up anyway you like but it will always remain an indisputable fact.

Also, if you apply your twisted logic to this straightforward issue and persist with the delusion that the rags are absolute shite because they’ve only lost one of their last 10 games but ‘they were favourable fixtures’ then what must you think of us having dropped more points than them in that period.
And keep in mind that we dropped them to Brentford and Everton (surely ’favourable fixtures’) at our own ground.
According to your logic that make the rags shit and us shitter - which really isn’t so is it?

And I’m not in the least peeved that you’ve jumped in to support a deluded tool - you love your moment in the limelight don’t you eh? I’m only disappointed that you didn’t do it by way of an Abba song so that you could choose to select any one of a dozen readings from it after the outcome’s clear to all.
;-D
Click to expand...

I think something is clear to all...
 
OccupiedPalestineBlues said:
Ah right then. So, at the end of the season when every team has played every other team twice, the winners might not truly be the winners because they played the same teams that every other team played in a different order?

No of course not, that would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it?

On the same basis, halfway through the season the points gained by each team represents their positioning / their worth as a footballing side in the context of half a season gone.
You can wrap that up anyway you like but it will always remain an indisputable fact.

Also, if you apply your twisted logic to this straightforward issue and persist with the delusion that the rags are absolute shite because they’ve only lost one of their last 10 games but ‘they were favourable fixtures’ then what must you think of us having dropped more points than them in that period.
And keep in mind that we dropped them to Brentford and Everton (surely ’favourable fixtures’) at our own ground.
According to your logic that make the rags shit and us shitter - which really isn’t so is it?

And I’m not in the least peeved that you’ve jumped in to support a deluded tool - you love your moment in the limelight don’t you eh? I’m only disappointed that you didn’t do it by way of an Abba song so that you could choose to select any one of a dozen readings from it after the outcome’s clear to all.
;-D
Click to expand...
Calling somebody out for enjoying the limelight? Fucking irony.
 
OccupiedPalestineBlues said:
Ah right then. So, at the end of the season when every team has played every other team twice, the winners might not truly be the winners because they played the same teams that every other team played in a different order?

No of course not, that would be ridiculous, wouldn’t it?

On the same basis, halfway through the season the points gained by each team represents their positioning / their worth as a footballing side in the context of half a season gone.
You can wrap that up anyway you like but it will always remain an indisputable fact.

Also, if you apply your twisted logic to this straightforward issue and persist with the delusion that the rags are absolute shite because they’ve only lost one of their last 10 games but ‘they were favourable fixtures’ then what must you think of us having dropped more points than them in that period.
And keep in mind that we dropped them to Brentford and Everton (surely ’favourable fixtures’) at our own ground.
According to your logic that make the rags shit and us shitter - which really isn’t so is it?

And I’m not in the least peeved that you’ve jumped in to support a deluded tool - you love your moment in the limelight don’t you eh? I’m only disappointed that you didn’t do it by way of an Abba song so that you could choose to select any one of a dozen readings from it after the outcome’s clear to all.
;-D
Click to expand...
Is everything ok?
 
tolmie's hairdoo said:
I think something is clear to all...
Click to expand...

Ok, if you still think that the rags are only 4 points behind us because they’ve had “favourable fixtures”.

Consider this; the teams that we’ve played and they haven’t are Leeds & Crystal Palace, the teams that they’ve played and we haven’t are Arsenal & Spurs.

I think that it plain to all that Arsenal and Spurs (currently 1st & 5th in the PL) are more fearsome opponents than Crystal Palace & Leeds (currently 12th & 14th in the PL).
This clearly demonstrates that the rags have actually had more difficult fixtures than we have.

We still need to play Arsenal & Spurs twice and the rags need to play Crystal Palace & Leeds twice. Thus, we have a more difficult set of forward fixtures than the rags, which is to their forward advantage.

The facts in the fixture lists make your theory that ‘the rags are only 4 points behind us because they’ve had favourable fixtures’ look a bit wide of target eh?
 
OccupiedPalestineBlues said:
Ok, if you still think that the rags are only 4 points behind us because they’ve had “favourable fixtures”.

Consider this; the teams that we’ve played and they haven’t are Leeds & Crystal Palace, the teams that they’ve played and we haven’t are Arsenal & Spurs.

I think that it plain to all that Arsenal and Spurs (currently 1st & 5th in the PL) are more fearsome opponents than Crystal Palace & Leeds (currently 12th & 14th in the PL).
This clearly demonstrates that the rags have actually had more difficult fixtures than we have.

We still need to play Arsenal & Spurs twice and the rags need to play Crystal Palace & Leeds twice. Thus, we have a more difficult set of forward fixtures than the rags, which is to their forward advantage.

The facts in the fixture lists make your theory that ‘the rags are only 4 points behind us because they’ve had favourable fixtures’ look a bit wide of target eh?
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As I understand it, the point that is being discussed is the rags' run of fixtures since the derby.

The media are trumpeting their "one defeat in 17", or whatever it is.

The point that’s being made is that in those games, they have played supposedly "inferior" opponents, especially in their Thursday night cup games and against Burnley in the League Cup.

Even you can’t deny this to be true.
 
until last week utd had +4 GD.....were 4th in the table. +3 at the weekend and now look a better side.

after 16 games to be top 4 with +4 GD is ridiculous. with ten 1 nil wins?? they ll implode at the weekend.

Bench haaland and they will have squeeky bums at k.o. FACT.
 
Vienna_70 said:
As I understand it, the point that is being discussed is the rags' run of fixtures since the derby.

The media are trumpeting their "one defeat in 17", or whatever it is.

The point that’s being made is that in those games, they have played supposedly "inferior" opponents, especially in their Thursday night cup games and against Burnley in the League Cup.

Even you can’t deny this to be true.
Click to expand...

The subject is the Premier League, that’s what this discussion has been about. Comparing league and domestic cup fixtures / Europa league etc is is comparing apples with oranges and the fact is that the rags have demonstrably had tougher fixtures than we have, so far this season.
Taking into account the games since the derby, well it’s undeniable that they can only beat the team that they’re facing. Regardless of what those fixtures were, the rags had to beat those teams and they did in all but 1 instance. Which isn’t to be sniffed at.

We ourselves have dropped points at home to Brentford and Everton this season, any team can drop points against teams that they ‘should’ beat. The rags doing well in that run doesn’t diminish the fact that they have had more difficult fixtures than us overall, that they’re only 4 points behind us and we have more difficult fixtures than they do going forward . . possibly 4 points more difficult?

You could even make the reasoned argument that; If the rags take 12 points from their 2 games against Palace and 2 games against Leeds, and if we get say 2 wins and 2 draws in our corresponding 2 games against Arsenal and 2 games against Spurs then they’re level pegging with us (except goal difference) if everything else is equal.
IMO The big differentiator is next weekend when we play them at the swamp. They’ll have home advantage and we desperately need to beat them to give us a cushion between us and them as we enter the more difficult part of our season and they enter the more favourable part of theirs.

We’re having a good season so far, we’re only 2 points behind where we were at this stage last season, so not far off the trajectory we needed to win the league. The difference this year is that the Arse have been exceptional, Newcastle are risen from the ashes and the rags have finally started to play like a serious football team, as proven by their performance to date.

My point is that they really are proper opposition and all this puffing out of chests and saying that “they’ve had easier fixtures” bollox and stupid whataboutery, (comparing how the premier league fixtures work to how prize fighting matches work!), doesn’t detract from them being opposition to take seriously, as their league position demonstrates.

Me? Well personally, I hope we stuff them. I think that if we play at our best we could cane them and, if that happens, I’ll celebrate it in full knowledge that those 3 points go some way towards nullifying their favourable fixtures advantage going forward.
 
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