US Politics Thread

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

They ARE capable of critical thinking -- and that's the point. They know they fucked up. They misread Trump, the threat he is/was, the insanity, the amorality -- and they look and feel incredibly stupid. They're humilated. But they can't/won't admit it, so they show up only when they have a needle for the current administration, as if they can claw back some of their dignity by criticiz(s)ing (or expressing false concern). Then they pull out the "both sides" argument -- the ones all political-cynics use -- to cover up their own mistaken tea leave readings (and, as they secretly know, moral failings).

Yes, that's right. The "both sides" argument is a moral failing. But oooooooohhhhhhh don't say that to them. How dare I, right? How can I judge? I can, will and already have.

I have a sample size of one - my brother.

He's a both-sider and is absolutely incapable of critical thinking.

He believes in God and that life begins at conception and that it's morally repugnant to have an abortion under any circumstance, yada, yada, yada.

In other words, not only can't my brother reason - he's of the unshakable opinion that he's on the moral high ground.

My sample size is one - but I'm pretty sure that many if not most both-siders are just like my brother: incapable of critical reasoning and absolutely convinced that they hold the moral high ground.

 

[TinFoilHat]

I have a sample size of one - my brother.

He's a both-sider and is absolutely incapable of critical thinking.

He believes in God and that life begins at conception and that it's morally repugnant to have an abortion under any circumstance, yada, yada, yada.

In other words, not only can't my brother reason - he's of the unshakable opinion that he's on the moral high ground.

My sample size is one - but I'm pretty sure that many if not most both-siders are just like my brother: incapable of critical reasoning and absolutely convinced that they have the moral high ground.

Heard a phrase today which chimed a cord.

"The footballication of politics"

People will let their belief in their overcome reason.

I get that.

I think I've done it in this forum a few times.

We need to break this tribalism down and realise we're being fucked. Left, right, or centre. Then do something about it.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

Heard a phrase today which chimed a cord.

"The footballication of politics"

People will let their belief in their overcome reason.

I get that.

I think I've done it in this forum a few times.

We need to break this tribalism down and realise we're being fucked. Left, right, or centre. Then do something about it.

Just so.

People are free to disagree on policy.

But it's vital for successful governance that the people agree on facts - and from there, argue about what to do.

Unfortunately, the Right has abandoned fact and many sheeple flock along, incapable of differentiating truth from falsehood. And the both-siders get caught in the herd.

 

[SWP's back]

What’s more telling is you only showing up here when he falls down.

Yeah it’s interesting the amount of people that aren’t seen for months whilst Trump gets indicted and is likely to be infighter again for espionage.

But the other guys trips up and here they all are all of a sudden.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

We need to break this tribalism down and realise we're being fucked. Left, right, or centre. Then do something about it.

Most people don't see it that way. There is one side trying to maintain rationale grown up politics. The other side trying to tear everything down to base level BS , misinformation and general shithousery.

A responsible politician would accept there are sometimes issues where there are 2 or 3 ways to go and you aren't going to please everyone. So you pick what you feel is right and advocate for it in a constructive way.

The arseholes approach is to claim there is only 1 way and lie and BS about it and everything else non stop. Changing the subject when called out and continually raking up endless BS to distract from any kind of critical thinking. It's politics in the social media age. But there is one side far far worse than the other.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

Most people don't see it that way. There is one side trying to maintain rationale grown up politics. The other side trying to tear everything down to base level BS , misinformation and general shithousery.

A responsible politician would accept there are sometimes issues where there are 2 or 3 ways to go and you aren't going to please everyone. So you pick what you feel is right and advocate for it in a constructive way.

The arseholes approach is to claim there is only 1 way and lie and BS about it and everything else non stop. Changing the subject when called out and continually racking up endless BS to distract from and kind of critical thinking. It's politics in the social media age. But there is one side far far worse than the other.

You mean they're not the same? :-)

 

[TinFoilHat]

Most people don't see it that way. There is one side trying to maintain rationale grown up politics. The other side trying to tear everything down to base level BS , misinformation and general shithousery.

A responsible politician would accept there are sometimes issues where there are 2 or 3 ways to go and you aren't going to please everyone. So you pick what you feel is right and advocate for it in a constructive way.

The arseholes approach is to claim there is only 1 way and lie and BS about it and everything else non stop. Changing the subject when called out and continually racking up endless BS to distract from and kind of critical thinking. It's politics in the social media age. But there is one side far far worse than the other.

Agreed.

And I've been guilt of it often. It's difficult shifting your head and challenging long impressed beliefs.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

What do folks make of the debt ceiling compromise reached by Congress in terms of politics on the Right?

Prior to the compromise, it was my opinion that nearly all centrist, rational Republicans had been pushed out of office by MAGA maniacs. My expectation was that no compromise could possibly be reached and that the US would default on its debt barring some sort of 14th amendment intervention by the President.

I was obviously wrong.

So... what's actually going on in the Right? Are numerous Republican officials nominally centrist but afraid to act for fear of MAGA reprisal? And/or - and I hope this is the case - is MAGA losing its grip?

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

What do folks make of the debt ceiling compromise reached by Congress in terms of politics on the Right?

Prior to the compromise, it was my opinion that nearly all centrist, rational Republicans had been pushed out of office by MAGA maniacs. My expectation was that no compromise could possibly be reached and that the US would default on its debt barring some sort of 14th amendment intervention by the President.

I was obviously wrong.

So... what's actually going on in the Right? Are numerous Republican officials nominally centrist but afraid to act for fear of MAGA reprisal? And/or - and I hope this is the case - is MAGA losing its grip?

1. Yes.
2. Yes, but slowly.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

You mean they're not the same? :-)

The whole 'Both the Same' line is itself a form of whataboutery. A defence line that actually doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

Modern politics is less about left vs right. Its liars and BSers vs the rest. Their are more decent politicians than people like to think. But the Lies and BS travel faster and a relatively small number of bad apples can do a lot of damage.