Var debate 2019/20

I think it has been clearly established that it should have been disallowed, I'm not sure what either of you are missing here?

The debate is about why the referee wasn't shown the footage that clearly showed it hitting his arm - corruption or incompetence?

As far as UEFA and the media are concerned, it seems that the right result was achieved (us going out), so VAR did its job admirably.
Perhaps you missed in my post that he may have accepted ball and hand made contact?
My post questioned whether he was looking for arm movement to indicate deliberate handball.

I know its a strange thing to do, particularly on the City Forum, but I always try to look at things from the other persons point of view (not to necessarily agree with them) then compare it with alternatives.

I may very well come round to your opinion but not just yet if you don't mind.
 
Aguero offside was a good call? It was a terrible call. He was coming back on and not seeking to gain an advantage. He gained no advantage whatsoever. Absolutely ridiculous call.
I don't agree.

I have seen a lot of offsides called for the same situation without VAR. A player, offside at the moment of the pass, who is tracking back (and don't really benefit from his offside position) is still considered offside when he receives the ball.
 
I don't agree.

I have seen a lot of offsides called for the same situation without VAR. A player, offside at the moment of the pass, who is tracking back (and don't really benefit from his offside position) is still considered offside when he receives the ball.
But he shouldn’t be considered offside as ‘he wasn’t seeking to gain an advantage’. When I was playing (retired 30 yrs ago), that was written as the offside law. ‘If in the opinion of the referee, a player is seeking to gain an advantage’. Agüero wasn’t; and actually gained no advantage. Because he has fat calves or a fat arse should not be the determining factor in offside calls. It doesn’t matter how many you’ve seen, it is a technicality and needs revising, especially when coming back on.
 
But he shouldn’t be considered offside as ‘he wasn’t seeking to gain an advantage’. When I was playing (retired 30 yrs ago), that was written as the offside law. ‘If in the opinion of the referee, a player is seeking to gain an advantage’. Agüero wasn’t; and actually gained no advantage. Because he has fat calves or a fat arse should not be the determining factor in offside calls. It doesn’t matter how many you’ve seen, it is a technicality and needs revising, especially when coming back on.
I'm just tellling you it is how any referee will judge it nowadays.

Maybe it is wrong in your book but it is not a mistake if it is judged the same way for everyone. This call is consistent with other similar situations.

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/lawsandrules/laws/football-11-11/law-11---offside
IFAB Laws of the Game 2018-19
Offside offence
A player in an offside position at the moment the ball is played or touched* by a team-mate is only penalised on becoming involved in active play by: interfering with play by playing or touching a ball passed or touched by a team-mate
 
This is Rosetti in February this year.

So when exactly and how does the VAR team intervene and communicate with the referee?

The protocol on when and how to use VAR has been defined by the International Football Association Board, which also defines the Laws of the Game. Our guidelines for UEFA matches on how to apply this protocol are very clear: the Video Assistant Referee will only intervene when he has the evidence for a clear and obvious mistake in four match-changing situations – goals and offences leading up to a goal, penalty decisions and offences leading up to a penalty, direct red-card incidents, and mistaken identity.

This includes goals scored after a foul during the attacking phase, or from an offside position. The latest 3D technology will help the Video Assistant Referee to determine whether an offside position has occurred.

The Video Assistant Referee will also intervene when there is evidence of serious foul play, which must be sanctioned with a direct red card in line with the Laws of the Game.

When does VAR intervene during penalty area incidents?

Again, the Video Assistant Referee intervenes only if there is clear evidence: clear foul play in the penalty area to give a penalty or clear evidence there was no infringement to rule out a penalty award. For example, in the case of handball, the Video Assistant Referee must intervene when there is clear evidence of a deliberate act of a player making contact with the ball with the hand or arm. The movement, distance, and position of the arm or hand are taken into consideration by the VAR team to judge if the contact was punishable, and an on-field review should be made by the referee.
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So more ambiguity. The bit in italics...does it mean goals scored from an offside position or goals scored after an offside offence has occurred in the attacking phase? His words are absolutely clear to me. In my English book, it means the former and Sterling's goal is good to go, as they say. Otherwise, he should have said, ...goals scored after a foul or an offside offence during the attacking phase. But he didn't, he expressly says ...goals..... scored from an offside position. How many versions of the truth will we get? It's almost fascinating. They used to call this sort of shit Byzantine.

All the doubters can have Llorente's goal (but not Otamendi's penalty!) but Sterling's goal, by the words of the BIG UEFA REF, was good because Aguero's offside was not within the remit of the video assistant referee because Aguero didn't score the goal, the onside Sterling did.

Or don't words mean what they mean anymore?
 
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They're making this shit up as they go along. To cover fuckups and coincidences that they didn't foresee. And cheating that would be obvious even to armchair casual watchers.
 
I don't agree.

I have seen a lot of offsides called for the same situation without VAR. A player, offside at the moment of the pass, who is tracking back (and don't really benefit from his offside position) is still considered offside when he receives the ball.


Hi Pidge/frank ?
 
Who called for Llorenetes goal to be looked at? If it was the VAR ref then he must have seen the angle where it hit his arm, if he did then why wasn’t that shown to the ref? If he didn’t then why would he tell the ref to look At It? If it was the ref who called it was it because of the City protests? If that’s the case he is been led by the players.
 
One thing that occurred to me today.

How many times does the linesman flag for offside in open play, and then the cameras prove that he was wrong?
Usually the game has already stopped, but what would happen if the striker (Sterling today on the half way line from an Ederson clearance) just carried on and shot past the keeper, before asking the referee to check with VAR?
 
Anyone else think the PL table next season will look so different to the normal mix of 6? VAR going to have a big say in top and bottom places
 
Who called for Llorenetes goal to be looked at? If it was the VAR ref then he must have seen the angle where it hit his arm, if he did then why wasn’t that shown to the ref? If he didn’t then why would he tell the ref to look At It? If it was the ref who called it was it because of the City protests? If that’s the case he is been led by the players.
We were saying today
There must have been some doubt by the VAR ref as this was the only VAR incident the match ref reviewed
 
One thing that occurred to me today.

How many times does the linesman flag for offside in open play, and then the cameras prove that he was wrong?
Usually the game has already stopped, but what would happen if the striker (Sterling today on the half way line from an Ederson clearance) just carried on and shot past the keeper, before asking the referee to check with VAR?

I think the point is more that the linesman's flag only makes a difference if the ref blows his whistle.
Until then, it's play on.

At the moment, the ref will usually blow when he sees the flag, although occasionally he will overrule, e.g. if he thinks it came off a defending player and the linesman is wrong.
 

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