VAR (PL introduction 2019)

[blue roo]

Virtually everyone is in agreement that for it to work and be a success their has to be 100% complete transparency and communication of decisions.

Mic the officials up, show all replays and dialogue to the crowd and tv and no one will have an issue.

They won’t though and they will use it to cheat and manipulate results and it will spell the end for many of us I fear.

I could have written exactly that.
100% correct.
I fear for the game that I / we love.

 

[wattle]

I share your concerns for sure but Rugby Union seems to have found the correct balance with complete transparency of what is said between those operating var and the referee and the incident viewed from multiple angles every instance. They also seem to have incorporated the decision making into building the tension in the ground. It certainly hasnt ruined the game. Wether the FA have the humility to copy what the RFU have done is another question.

Fingers crossed eh? I bloody hope so

 

[wattle]

Agree completely.

Can you imagine they gave us all a hand set when we entered the ground, a decision goes to VAR and you can see all the camera angles on your hand set. You are then asked to vote offside/not offside, handball/not handball, penalty/no penalty, out of play/in play, foul/no foul, yellow card/red card etc etc.

What sort of decisions would you get then, or lets go the whole hog and let the viewer decide when the match is televised.

What we all want is correct decision making which would happen if the referees and match official improved, what we are getting is the same incompetent officials looking at replays (and in some cases not every angle) and then deciding the outcome.

From what I have witnessed so far with VAR there is no improvement on the old system.

For me it’s far worse than it was before as it stands. Just hope they get it right because it’s here to stay now

 

[eyejay51]

I can see quite a few red ( 2 yellow) cards for goalkeepers this season for the feet on the line issue
#

 

[wattle]

Offside doesn't come under the 'clear and obvious' standard. Offside is offside, it is a matter of fact

And a push is a push, and encroachment is encroachment etc. If we stop for every tiny little thing then it’s not the same game and becomes basketball. We’ve also seen plenty of decisions given because of VAR that weren’t actually offside because they only go from the feet and not other goal scoring parts of the body. It’s a sham as it is atm. Just hope they eventually get it right

 

[Blue Hefner]

And a push is a push, and encroachment is encroachment etc. If we stop for every tiny little thing then it’s not the same game and becomes basketball. We’ve also seen plenty of decisions given because of VAR that weren’t actually offside because they only go from the feet and not other goal scoring parts of the body. It’s a sham as it is atm. Just hope they eventually get it right

I'm not suggesting we stop for every little thing and I am not actual sure who has. I am telling you that off-side(as per original post) does not come under 'clear and obvious' as its a fact

However, if a player pushes another, it should be given as a penalty. Why wouldn't it be. Similar with encroachment, it is against the laws of the game. I'm not sure what the issue is - there is an issue with implementation but will come as it evolves and referees get more experienced

 

[wattle]

I'm not suggesting we stop for every little thing and I am not actual sure who has. I am telling you that off-side(as per original post) does not come under 'clear and obvious' as its a fact

However, if a player pushes another, it should be given as a penalty. Why wouldn't it be. Similar with encroachment, it is against the laws of the game. I'm not sure what the issue is - there is an issue with implementation but will come as it evolves and referees get more experienced

So offside by 1mm is a clear and obvious mistake is it? If you’re happy with that then fair play but I think we’re better agreeing to disagree on this one.

 

[Blue Hefner]

So offside by 1mm is a clear and obvious mistake is it? If you’re happy with that then fair play but I think we’re better agreeing to disagree on this one.

It is not under the 'clear and obvious' remit. Offside is judged differently than other fouls

In regards to agreeing to disagree, I can't agree that implementing laws is bad but not doing so is good. Why stop oat 1mm, why not a 1cm or an inch or a yard? Maybe we could scrap it all together so we don't have to give difficult, yet correct decisions

And why stop at offside? Why not say shots almost went in so we should give a goal?

If a player is offside then he is offside and that decision should be given accordingly

 

[Eds]

Everyone should read this as it is from the FA site on the laws of the game regarding VAR.

Video match officials
A video assistant referee (VAR) is a match official who may assist the referee to make a decision using replay footage only for a 'clear and obvious error' or 'serious missed incident' relating to a goal/no goal, penalty/no penalty, direct red card (not a second caution) or a case of mistaken identity when the referee cautions or sends off the wrong player of the offending team

An assistant video assistant referee (AVAR) is a match official who helps the VAR primarily by:

• watching the television footage while the VAR is busy with a 'check' or a 'review'
• keeping a record of VAR-related incidents and any communication or technology problems
• assisting the VAR's communication with the referee, especially communicating with the referee when the VAR is undertaking a 'check'/'review' e.g. to tell the referee to 'stop play' or 'delay the restart' etc.
• recording time 'lost' when play is delayed for a 'check' or a 'review'
• communicating information about a VAR-related decision to relevant parties

There is no specific mention of offside other than using 'replay footage only for a 'clear and obvious error' or 'serious missed incident' relating to a goal/no goal'. Whilst I accept that if a player is three inches offside he is offside is this a clear and obvious error? I would say not whereas a yard offside is one. Of course a'clear and obvious error' and a 'serious missed incident' are open to interpretation and will be different each week. Take for example the case of the Cameroon player who nearly nearly connected with a Dutch player's head during this World Cup. Ref issued a yellow card obviously thinking that the player wasn't guilty of serious foul play, Yet according to the laws of the game a tackle or challenge that 'endangers the safety of an opponent or uses excessive force or brutality must be sanctioned as serious foul play. Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force or endangers the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play'.

Refs will continue to apply their own interpretations with little or no recourse throughout the season and in many cases will interpret similar fouls etc differently during a game. VAR isn't fit for purpose in its current form and if anyone thinks it is they either have a shareholding in the company that produces the technology or they seriously need to give their heads a wobble

 

[wattle]

O

It is not under the 'clear and obvious' remit. Offside is judged differently than other fouls

In regards to agreeing to disagree, I can't agree that implementing laws is bad but not doing so is good. Why stop oat 1mm, why not a 1cm or an inch or a yard? Maybe we could scrap it all together so we don't have to give difficult, yet correct decisions

And why stop at offside? Why not say shots almost went in so we should give a goal?

If a player is offside then he is offside and that decision should be given accordingly

OK