VAR thread 2022/23

[bluenova]

This, coupled with the “clear and obvious error” threshold, is arguably the biggest issue with VAR.

It means referees can just wait for VAR to review incidents instead of making a decision on the field when the incident occurs and then VAR can say that there isn’t enough evidence to say it was a clear and obvious error by the referee to not make a decision (and vice versa, as we saw last night).

It’s a farce, made real by Madley every week.

I wonder if there's much research into whether less penalties are given by the onfield ref post-VAR?

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

I wonder if there's much research into whether less penalties are given by the onfield ref post-VAR?

The number of penalties as a stand-alone statistic is largely irrelevant. But if you were to analyse percentage of game time in possession in the opposition penalty area against the number of penalties awarded there might be something in it.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Conspiracy brigade? All we are doing is trying to find credible explanations from the evidence before us.

1. The corner taker wasn't offside at any point. Any competent referee's assistant will know that being in an offside position isn't the same as being offside. He was in an offside position for the first header (unsurprising really, as he had just taken the corner). But he was at least 30 yards away from the ball, and the ball stayed in front of the goal.

2. He was in an onside position when the second header was made.

3. He was not offside at any point during that attack.

4. Given he wasn't offside, why was he flagged offside? Why is nobody asking the linesman why he interpreted this as offside? He should be punished for making such basic errors.

5. What was the signal from Madley to his linesman?

6. Why didn't the linesman signal for offside until after Madley gave this gesture with his hand.

7. Why did the linesman appear to go towards the centre of the pitch, and change his mind after he saw the signal from Madley.

8. Can we hear the conversations between officials, if they have nothing to hide.

These are all genuine concerns, that PGMOL and other governing bodies are ignoring. It screams BENT.

All we have from them is that there wasn't enough video evidence to overturn the original decision, as if the offside decision in itself was marginal. It wasn't. As I said above, no competent assistant referee would have deemed that as offside.

there's some explanation and what seems pretty balanced on here

VAR Review: Explaining the offside drama in Liverpool vs. Wolves

Liverpool and Wolverhampton Wanderers played out a 2-2 draw in the third round of the FA Cup at Anfield. This is what happened with VAR.

www.espn.co.uk

1-4 is basically saying why did the official make the wrong decision - because they do... every weekend pre VAR officials were making wrong/bad decisions and they still do now - how many times has a lino flagged wrong and VAR over turned because it was clearly onside - it happens on a weekly basis. is it corruption every time a official makes a bad judgment ?

point 5-6 - there's just not conclusive proof Madley is definitely telling the lino to stick his flag up, it's a 1 second clip or blurry image that doesn't prove anything

point 8 - I've agreed with this, i'd be happy for that to happen - but will it really resolve those who believe it's all a conspiracy ? imagine the dissection for every conversation between the officials during a controversial grey area decision - people/social media would have a field day questioning every word that was said during the convo.

also I do agree all stadiums should have sufficient set ups to calibrate offsides - Liverpool had a goal against them given v Arsenal for the same reasoning - that really needs to be addressed going forward.

 

[SebastianBlue]

point 5-6 - there's just not conclusive proof Madley is definitely telling the lino to stick his flag up, it's a 1 second clip or blurry image that doesn't prove anything

People at the game said that the linesman was walking back to the centre circle until Madley jestured toward him, he then raised his flag, and Madley blew the whistle. That all happened after the ball was in the back of the net. Are we meant to ignore what people (that it saw with their own eyes) are saying now?

Only then did the commentators on the TV broadcast say the flag was up — I posted highlights earlier in the thread that shows this.

I am sure fan captured video will pop up showing this (given the highlights conspicuously leave out when the linesman raises his flag, despite several angles obviously capturing it, just as fan captured video showed the “blind spot” position of Nunes when he became active in play).

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

there's some explanation and what seems pretty balanced on here

VAR Review: Explaining the offside drama in Liverpool vs. Wolves

Liverpool and Wolverhampton Wanderers played out a 2-2 draw in the third round of the FA Cup at Anfield. This is what happened with VAR.

www.espn.co.uk

1-4 is basically saying why did the official make the wrong decision - because they do... every weekend pre VAR officials were making wrong/bad decisions and they still do now - how many times has a lino flagged wrong and VAR over turned because it was clearly onside - it happens on a weekly basis. is it corruption every time a official makes a bad judgment ?

point 5-6 - there's just not conclusive proof Madley is definitely telling the lino to stick his flag up, it's a 1 second clip or blurry image that doesn't prove anything

point 8 - I've agreed with this, i'd be happy for that to happen - but will it really resolve those who believe it's all a conspiracy ? imagine the dissection for every conversation between the officials during a controversial grey area decision - people/social media would have a field day questioning every word that was said during the convo.

also I do agree all stadiums should have sufficient set ups to calibrate offsides - Liverpool had a goal against them given v Arsenal for the same reasoning - that really needs to be addressed going forward.

The linesman is walking back towards the halfway line until the interaction with the referee, at which point he abruptly turns and puts his flag up.

There is 'no conclusive proof' because the PL/FA/PGMOL refuse to release the communications, which leaves them WIDE OPEN to calls of skulduggery. They could quash that in a single stroke. The fact that they won't speaks VOLUMES.

 

[BlueHammer85]

If it was clear and obvious…

clear and obvious on tv review but during the match fans and players didn't appeal it

if there is a agenda against City why would the refs have gave that without VAR ?

 

[Blue Mist]

The spammers on, time to go.

 

[SebastianBlue]

The linesman is walking back towards the halfway line until the interaction with the referee, at which point he abruptly turns and puts his flag up.

There is 'no conclusive proof' because the PL/FA/PGMOL refuse to release the communications, which leaves them WIDE OPEN to calls of skulduggery. They could quash that in a single stroke. The fact that they won't speaks VOLUMES.

It’s amazing the mental gymnastics some fans go through to explain away completely unnecessary inconsistencies in the application of rules and supporting systems and refusal by the PL/FA/PGMOL to implement simple, practically no cost changes to substantially improve transparency and confidence in the integrity of the game.

With any other industry it would be obvious to every observer why companies were refusing to do it, but with football, many fans just create elaborate and nonsensical reasoning for it.

 

[BlueHammer85]

I am sure fan captured video will pop up showing this (given the highlights conspicuously leave out when the linesman raises his flag, despite several angles obviously capturing it, just as fan captured video showed the “blind spot” position of Nunes when he became active in play).

honestly I'm opened to be swayed. if there's a clip which definitely shows the ref telling the lino to stick his flag up - then I'll happily concede this point

for me the lino thought he saw a offside in the phase of play and like they are doing nowadays frustratingly delays the moment he sticks his flag up - he got it wrong - VAR couldn't overturn because they didn't have the angle in place - I totally get the anger over this

 

[SebastianBlue]

I wasn’t necessarily including you as being in the conspiracy brigade. To be honestly I rarely pay much attention to who I’m replying to.

But some people are convinced that every single referee and every single organisation is involved in one huge scam to fuck City over and benefit Liverpool. Ironically normally the first people to accuse Liverpool fans of having a victim mentality. Which is all fair enough, if that’s what they think. But there’s little point in debating with them, as their answer to everything is… Because it/ he/ they are bent.

The strawman is back.