Work For Dole

[nijinsky's fetlocks]

Well fucking said.

No it's not. The whole point was avoided.

The lad tried getting work and the comment I made about JJB was justified.

I'm saying the scheme is ridiculous. The reply from Ban just says how proud he is to of worked all his life. My point was completely avoided.

No it wasn't. Ban owned you.

The problem is that some people think certain work below them. I finished Uni having been to a posh school and with a degree in Economics and Geography and guess what, I had to find a shit job in a call centre. I spent two years doing shitty call centre jobs whilst I studied for industry qualifications to end up in the career I am now in. I hated it, but it was work, it enabled me to pay my bills and whilst it was well beneath my qualifications, I am fucking glad I did that rather than go on the dole, I have no gap in my cv since the age of 15 when I was a pot wash.

-- Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:23 am --

This is simply a populist, ill-conceived policy to appease the Tory right and an attempt to stop the haemorrhaging of votes to UKIP, who are actually beginning to influence the coalition by osmosis.
It is fundamentally flawed logic.
One of the criteria for claiming benefit is that you are looking for paid employment 24/7.
How the fuck are you supposed to do this if you are picking up litter 8 hours a day?
It will doubtless go down well with the blue rinse brigade in the shires, but like most kneejerk vote-salvaging exercises it won't work in practice.

Because I am sure that happens.

In many cases I'm sure it doesn't, but removing the possibility means it definitely won't for those who may make the effort if they weren't professional dog shit operatives.
So what happens to these folk?
They are not being prepared for the workforce by retraining or doing useful stuff like updating CV's, interview techniques, computer skills, etc.
Do they take a degree in Excrement Disposal after a couple of years when they are utterly de-motivated and de-skilled?
And here's me thinking that a Desmond was a shit degree.
It is just a stupid vote-winning unworkable piece of rhetoric that has as much chance of succeeding as me giving up Guinness.

 

[waterloo blue]

This should have been a separate thread but is there anyone who thinks society will ever provide full employment.
I remember my old fella saying that you could start a job in the morning and if you didn't like it start another in the afternoon,but that's nearly fifty years ago.
If we can't provide everyone who wants a job a job,then what do we do?,life on benefits would be hard going for someone used to a wage coming in,but if you've not known anything else,do you cope better?.
Work for the dole is just a headline grabber,there's so much that could go wrong,OHS wise,accidents,public liability problems, people on the sex offenders register being given access to kids,as part of this scheme.
It would be a logistical nightmare and almost impossible to police.

 

[andyblue87]

Johnsonontheleft wrote:
I've heard a lot of people are against this due to logistics etc, but is anyone actually opposed to the general notion of forcing scroungers to do work?

I must of read it wrong !

Yes, you read it wrong. You are adding the word, "all".

Here's a thought. Over here (unless it's changed) people are occasionaly required to show proof of actively seeking employment whilst collecting benefits. They need to provide a list of companys, phone numbers and the name of the person that they spoke to. If they cannot prove that they are looking for work, they get cut off.

As far as i'm aware you do have something called a jobseeker logbook or something that you need to take to the JC as evidence that you have been looking for work.

I was unemployed for a few weeks around 5 years ago and these log books are a joke. The people at the job centre barely look at the things. An issue i had was that I really wanted a job and was looking for advice/support and they just wanted to sign my book and then for me to do one, they offer very little support.
This system isnt forcing people to litter pick, they can sign on monday-friday or they can do training, this is a choice. Whilst some argue they would not be able to afford to travel there every day, your JSA is there to fund your search for work, you should be going to agencies, checking pubs/restaurants advertising in windows in your search for work, not just looking on the same sites on the internet all day. I think after two years, there are flaws to your search if you have not been able to find any employment what so ever

 

[shootmeifipost10k]

There is no doubt if a scheme such as this actually starts it will force some people who have chosen to not look for a job to get their arse into gear.

I have read quite a few saying what a great idea.

All those who say this when you have a spare few hours go down to your nearest Remploy office and stand outside or if possible go inside and take a look around at who are sat in these places looking for work.

I've seen it for myself and to put it brutally some of the people who are being placed on the work program and who this will affect because they can't get a job after 2 years I wouldn't employ to pick up litter or let them do it for free.

Also can you imagine you've been in full time employment for 40 years get made redundant and your skills are no longer in the workforce. Now late 50s and competing against people 30 years younger for the same minimum wage job.You retrain and take some courses same problem and you have little chance against the younger workforce.

Worked for 30 or 40 years and now you've got to pick up littler so you get your rightful £70 a week, does that sound right because again this is the people who it will affect.

The vast majority are not as people call them feckless scroungers they are people like you and me who most likely through no fault of their own have lost their jobs. We have been hearing in the news over the past few years on a weekly basis of big businesses failing and shutting down laying off thousands of WORKERS not laying off feckless scroungers. Should these people be labeled with the same people who haven't worked through choice because no doubt that is what is going to happen.

400,000 jobs 4 million unemployed it isn't hard to figure out what the problem is.

 

[Mike D]

400,000 jobs 4 million unemployed it isn't hard to figure out what the problem is.

We need to work for less and win the global race

 

[cyberblue]

They would only be forced to do these jobs after 2 full years of unemployment.

It would be much easier if the job center could actualy match people to suitable jobs .there are so many hard working qualified people unemployed at the moment it is a national scandal .just another ill thought out publicity stunt

Absolutely CB, we had a vacancy at our place and applications were coming in from Scotland and the North east, with many over qualified for the job, I think it got to about 150 for the one job.

I t hurts so much not being able to get a job that people are going to the lengths you pointed out .Does this clown of a PM seriously believes that these people dont want to work .he is in cloud cuckoo land

 

[True_Blue69]

There is no doubt if a scheme such as this actually starts it will force some people who have chosen to not look for a job to get their arse into gear.

I have read quite a few saying what a great idea.

All those who say this when you have a spare few hours go down to your nearest Remploy office and stand outside or if possible go inside and take a look around at who are sat in these places looking for work.

I've seen it for myself and to put it brutally some of the people who are being placed on the work program and who this will affect because they can't get a job after 2 years I wouldn't employ to pick up litter or let them do it for free.

Also can you imagine you've been in full time employment for 40 years get made redundant and your skills are no longer in the workforce. Now late 50s and competing against people 30 years younger for the same minimum wage job.You retrain and take some courses same problem and you have little chance against the younger workforce.

Worked for 30 or 40 years and now you've got to pick up littler so you get your rightful £70 a week, does that sound right because again this is the people who it will affect.

The vast majority are not as people call them feckless scroungers they are people like you and me who most likely through no fault of their own have lost their jobs. We have been hearing in the news over the past few years on a weekly basis of big businesses failing and shutting down laying off thousands of WORKERS not laying off feckless scroungers. Should these people be labeled with the same people who haven't worked through choice because no doubt that is what is going to happen.

400,000 jobs 4 million unemployed it isn't hard to figure out what the problem is.

You're conveniently forgetting that if they do not want to do the menial work that is being offered they can choose the alternative of visiting the jobcentre every day and still getting their benefits. Even if you were over 60 there are still jobs out there you can get despite what some people would like to believe. The facts are that the vast majority of people who have been constantly out of work for 2 years do it by choice.

 

[Happy Feet]

lets be clear, this is aimed at people we know, the cycle of scumbags, the tracksuit wearing anti social, gap toothed fighters, the underclass, yet there are people who are genuinely out there who are just unemployable because they are ill educated but looking for work.

there are people out there who are well educated looking for work, however if after 2 years they haven't got a job i question their motivation(and aspirations)

its a big brush, with a lot of tar on.

a difficult dilemma.

Very well put.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

lets be clear, this is aimed at people we know, the cycle of scumbags, the tracksuit wearing anti social, gap toothed fighters, the underclass, yet there are people who are genuinely out there who are just unemployable because they are ill educated but looking for work.

there are people out there who are well educated looking for work, however if after 2 years they haven't got a job i question their motivation(and aspirations)

its a big brush, with a lot of tar on.

a difficult dilemma.

But how is giving them menial tasks going to solve anything.? All that will happen is that we will end up having to police / supervise them (yet another cottage industry) We should be putting them on to training and apprenticeships maybe renovating all the run down and derelict properties that infest our inner cities (whoops have we solved two major problems at the same time?) thus creating housing for the homeless , single parents and allowing people to downsize thus releasing larger properties so that their housing benefit can be reduced without pain(oh maybe its three major problems).

...............the outcome would be a trained, employed population.

Don't get me wrong I'm sure there will be some that won't work but to Tar everyone with the same brush is wrong

 

[Happy Feet]

lets be clear, this is aimed at people we know, the cycle of scumbags, the tracksuit wearing anti social, gap toothed fighters, the underclass, yet there are people who are genuinely out there who are just unemployable because they are ill educated but looking for work.

there are people out there who are well educated looking for work, however if after 2 years they haven't got a job i question their motivation(and aspirations)

its a big brush, with a lot of tar on.

a difficult dilemma.

But how is giving them menial tasks going to solve anything.? All that will happen is that we will end up having to police / supervise them (yet another cottage industry) We should be putting them on to training and apprenticeships maybe renovating all the run down and derelict properties that infest our inner cities (whoops have we solved two major problems at the same time?) thus creating housing for the homeless , single parents and allowing people to downsize thus releasing larger properties so that their housing benefit can be reduced without pain(oh maybe its three major problems).

...............the outcome would be a trained, employed population.

Don't get me wrong I'm sure there will be some that won't work but to Tar everyone with the same brush is wrong

Whats with the dislike of menial work ? Take it you think you are a cut above somebody who does a menial job.