General Election - December 12th, 2019

[blueinsa]

Unfortunately your only choice is Tory in order to attempt to get rid of Corbyn. I fear though this might just get rid of Corbyn and open the door to a lunatic like Mcdonnell.

The Labour Party is not about the leader anymore, it has been overtaken by a rabid and totally intolerant minority membership who have molded Labour to their narrow vision.

The main thing that hard left militants fear though is centrism which is why they have purged all traces of it from Labour under the Blairite smeared banner.

Labour is no longer the party of choice for the vast majority who are cracking on and doing alright.

Agree.

This Labour isn't anywhere near left enough for its membership and when Corbyn is gone which a defeat will see to they really will go left imo.

 

[Tb1981]

Unfortunately your only choice is Tory in order to attempt to get rid of Corbyn. I fear though this might just get rid of Corbyn and open the door to a lunatic like Mcdonnell.

The Labour Party is not about the leader anymore, it has been overtaken by a rabid and totally intolerant hard left who will replace at will to keep it alive.

The main thing that hard left militants fear though is centrism which is why they have purged all traces of it from Labour under the Blairite smeared banner.

Labour is no longer the party of choice for the vast majority who are cracking on and doing alright.

Can’t quite bring myself to vote Tory yet
It’s almost like I gotta vote brexit party then hope labour sorts itself out
But none of it sits comfortably with me
I personally feel labour has lost touch with the north of England
I think they have a political vision that isn’t based on the feelings of half their typical voters

 

[Ancient Citizen]

love hearing this argument - on what planet do people really believe that the next Labour leader WHOEVER it was wouldn’t get the same level of abuse given to Corbyn, it’s an age old tactic to constantly say ‘if the opposition had a different leader they’d be a serious threat’ - it’s bollox, if you are anti Labour, you always will be - this works both ways of course - No entrenched Labour supporter will give credit to a Tory leader, will dig up anything to smear the opposition. This is Politics and always will be. Not a hope nowadays with social media, fake memes and open forums. No PM will satisfy.

Wrong, on every level, plenty of people, including myself, have voted Labour, (I regretted it afterwards but that's another story),
I have never seen MP's, not only standing down because of him, but actually urging people to vote for the Tories,
yes, whoever it is will get stick, that's part of the job, but this bloke, I believe, will set Labour back years.
He is propounding mass nationalisations, borrowing billions,and is still a CND supporter with a ludicrous policy that involves
paying for and keeping nuclear weapons, but announcing to the world that he'd never use them.
Then getting a deal from the EU which involves staying in, and then offering a referendum offering this,
or really, really staying in.
These are crackpot student fantasy policies which most folk can see through, no wonder he wants kids voting.

 

[George Hannah]

Agree. This Labour isn't anywhere near left enough for its membership and when Corbyn is gone which a defeat will see to they really will go left imo.

The achievement of McCluskey's & Co's Labour Party is to have created a new membership in its own image. They aim only to satisfy appetites of their own creation and conceal the true nature of the beast from the rest.

 

[blueinsa]

The achievement of McCluskey's & Co's Labour Party is to have created a new membership in its own image. They aim only to satisfy appetites of their own creation.

A country run by and for the benefit of the unions and its members.

 

[TheRemainsOfTheDave]

Again, without the photo, which very much implies a moment and a current one, you'd have a point. the tweet does very much stipulate that, no matter how much you dissect and deconstruct it.

Either way, completely pointless argument so i'll excuse myself.

It's not really a pointless argument, it's about how people are interpreting communications from politicians and making accusations without full information or with their bias applied - and that goes for all sides. I think it's part of what's driving mistrust in the political system.

This was an unimportant and pretty dull tweet and the initial response was an accusation of something sinister.

 

[Metal Biker]

Can’t quite bring myself to vote Tory yet
It’s almost like I gotta vote brexit party then hope labour sorts itself out
But none of it sits comfortably with me
I personally feel labour has lost touch with the north of England
I think they have a political vision that isn’t based on the feelings of half their typical voters

Labour is all about the south of England now, whilst pandering to the student vote. They sort of "expect" people in the North to vote for them, so they see it as guarenteed votes.

In a way, they're correct to assume that, but then people in the North shouldn't be surprised when Labour does little for us, our communities, towns etc. Labour don't need to focus on the North of England or make pledges oin their favour, as they know they'll get their vote regardless. I'm hoping that the voters in the North show Labour that is not the case and our votes don't come lightly.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

you might think that this election is purely about Brexit ..... a lot of us don't.

Oh, I know you don't, if I were of your persuasion neither would I.
I think an election that has been called because of it, may indicate that it may be a teensy weensy bit important.
But accusing the Conservatives of selling the NHS to the Yanks for no benefit to us whatsoever, appears to be Labour's main strategy.
Best to crack on with that one.

 

[1.618034]

Its about the failure to tackle flooding though..... it's about the failure to pass legislation to provide adequate flood defences.

Its about turning a responsibility of DEFRA into a charitable organisation (Canals and Rivers Trust ) so it cant draw funds from the Government (done in 2012)

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/over-1-billion-investment-secures-future-of-new-waterways-charity

Its about the failure to tackle the cladding issue though

A report pointing out the dangers of HPL cladding sat on a Tory Ministers desk (Pickles & Barwells) for years. They were written to on numerous occasions but failed to do anything

https://insidecroydon.com/2019/06/13/barwell-and-the-ignored-warnings-that-led-to-grenfell-tragedy/

Its about the lies that they tell about the NHS trying to convince everyone that everything is fine .... whilst all the evidence says its not and at the same time the Royal College of Nursing are running radio ads asking people to petition their MP about staff shortages.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/11/14/ae-waiting-times-now-worst-since-records-began/

https://www.rcn.org.uk

Its about the mudslinging that they do about free broadband , when it will bring benefit to the poorer paid allowing children at home to complete proper research for their homework, allow people to search for jobs at home rather than have to go down to the library (which the Tories are closing at an ever increasing rate) allow people to claim welfare (which in the case of universal credit can only be done online) Order groceries to be delivered (which goes towards a reduction in Carbon emissions)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/dec/15/tories-libraries-social-mobility-conservative

I would also point out that the Governments own report called 'Frontier Economics' published in 2018 is the basis of the numbers used by the Labour Party... in the report it confirms that using one provider would work out £12 billion cheaper than using multiple. The infrastructure is all provided by Openreach (with the exception of Virgin) anyway. But for some reason the Conservatives expect the British public to pick up the £12 billion cost - hardly acting for our benefit are they?

It's the fraud they committed when they bribed the DUP with yours and mine tax £ so they could stay in power. And now we have further evidence of electoral fraud & malpractice being investigated by the Met Police regarding offers made to the Brexit Party Candidates to incentivise them to stand down.



It's the lies they told about the need for austerity ... and now all of a sudden the Magic Money tree is in full bloom and we have been through a decade of pain and what is reckoned to be 120,000 attributable deaths because of it.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...e-social-care-government-policy-a8057306.html

Its the lies they told in 2014 when they established the Military Covenant which made the promise that those and their families who serve or have served will be treated fairly and yet its believed that there are close on 14000 homeless veterans in the UK at todays date.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/least-13000-hero-soldiers-left-11847000

Its the lies they are telling that this General Election is all about Brexit when they have no policies to put forward other than to try and repair the damage of the last 10 years.

None of this is going unnoticed by the British public... you might think that this election is purely about Brexit ..... a lot of us don't.

Great post.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Corbyn does not even reach the dizzy heights of halfwittery, he's a failed A level student perpetual protester that's never had a job
in his life. You're obsession with class is also a dredged up grievance from the 19th century.
Anyway, I wouldn't put your wealth on Corbyn's charm sweeping him into number 10.

If you think class isn't a factor in British politics, I'd stick to the footy forums if I were you, as you clearly know fuck all about sweet Fanny Adams.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Agree.

This Labour isn't anywhere near left enough for its membership and when Corbyn is gone which a defeat will see to they really will go left imo.

You get dafter by the day.

 

[blueinsa]

You get dafter by the day.

The wife thinks so.

Labour loses to a Tory majority and Corbyn goes.

Who is elected leader?

Do you go back to the centre, a formula that led to the most successful labour governments under Blair with stonking majorities or do you go left again, this time even more so?

Who do the likes of McCluskey crown next?

 

[Ancient Citizen]

Yes - you are aware of the failed WA from Mayday post 2017 - the failure to get any meaningful legislation passed whilst they argued over Brexit - the rise of the ERG and them stabbing the PM in the back - Johnsons WA resulting in the DUP abandoning them and then Johnson further increasing his minority by kicking MP's out - his inability to govern at all and having to grovel to get a GE through Parliament?

Or are those just some of the signs of a party under tight control in your view?

The latest WA has past the first hurdle, if the Tories win, it passes the rest. All these 'Failures' you state are the
result of a remain dominated parliament, hence the election, the PM has changed, now you must try and get your lad to
pass the biggest test, he failed last time.

 

[bluethrunthru]

The day after a Tommy Robinson endorsement of the Tories he gets his quid pro quo - not that its about immigration of course

 

[Blue Hefner]

Can’t quite bring myself to vote Tory yet
It’s almost like I gotta vote brexit party then hope labour sorts itself out
But none of it sits comfortably with me
I personally feel labour has lost touch with the north of England
I think they have a political vision that isn’t based on the feelings of half their typical voters

Genuine question - what would you like them to do to show they understand the ‘feelings’ of those based in the north? But please bear in mind they actually have to get in power to enact these potentially attractive polices and the only Labour leader to do that in 30 years is Tony Blair - he won 3 on the spin but people say he isn’t ‘traditional’ Labour

But even putting that to one side, what is the alternative? Tory or Brexit Party? Hand on heart can anyone say Johnson, Mogg, Farage, Mogg’s sister, Dr David Bull(he’s no longer a doctor), Widdocomme etc have the interest of the North in mind?

 

[Tb1981]

Labour is all about the south of England now, whilst pandering to the student vote. They sort of "expect" people in the North to vote for them, so they see it as guarenteed votes.

In a way, they're correct to assume that, but then people in the North shouldn't be surprised when Labour does little for us, our communities, towns etc. Labour don't need to focus on the North of England or make pledges oin their favour, as they know they'll get their vote regardless. I'm hoping that the voters in the North show Labour that is not the case and our votes don't come lightly.

I see brexit party giving Corbin a nosebleed

Yep - the system is a nonsense and means that:

a) the majority of UK citizens know that there vote is irrelevant

and

b) that elections are decided by the results in a relatively small number of marginal seats

Throughout my voting lifetime my constituency has always been Eccles - which will always be Labour or in later Life Wokingham - which will always be Conservative. If I had never cast my vote in a GE - nothing would have been affected.

I think that is why the referendum attracted such a high turnout. People say that referenda don't work in the UK - I would challenge that - it speaks to the views of the majority that when each individual knew that their vote would 'actually' count there was such a large turnout

Unfortunately while it resulted in a huge turnout of people voting on the issue it just highlighted why the main parties have zero interest in what people want

They want to peddle a “manifesto” to win votes then do whatever they deem is best for you

Load of bollocks if you ask me

 

[Ancient Citizen]

If you think class isn't a factor in British politics, I'd stick to the footy forums if I were you, as you clearly know fuck all about sweet Fanny Adams.

If you think that people are as obsessed as you are about 'Class' then you must have spent most of your life in
a Duffle coat with a Che Guevara T shirt underneath.

 

[dave_blue12]

Oh, I know you don't, if I were of your persuasion neither would I.
I think an election that has been called because of it, may indicate that it may be a teensy weensy bit important.
But accusing the Conservatives of selling the NHS to the Yanks for no benefit to us whatsoever, appears to be Labour's main strategy.
Best to crack on with that one.

You know that Labour hasn't been in Government since 2010.

Where we are as a country right now is down to the Conservative party and the stupid decisions it has taken, austerity being chief amogst these followed by the Brexit Referendum.

So many people's lives have been blighted by these self centred, entitled buffoons.

Seems to me that attacking the Labour party for all it's own stupidity, is rather missing the point.

Edit. Didn't notice who I was responding to. Stupid of me, I shouldn't have bothered

 

[The perfect fumble]

The wife thinks so.

Labour loses to a Tory majority and Corbyn goes.

Who is elected leader?

Do you go back to the centre, a formula that led to the most successful labour governments under Blair with stonking majorities or do you go left again, this time even more so?

Who do the likes of McCluskey crown next?

Labour isn't going to win this election, there might be a hung Parliament but my money is on a modest Tory win.

Corbyn will go and will be replaced with someone younger from the left of the party, but a further move to the left? No.

Excuse the pun, but there is no momentum for it, the party is presently headed by a socialist but the Labour Party is not a socialist party. Corbyn, for all the criticism is by continental standards a very modest left winger and he will be replaced by someone similar, there's very little appetite with the British electorate for a firebrand socialist, I think that's something you and I can agree on, I suspect even rascal reluctantly believes that.

 

[Ancient Citizen]

You know that Labour hasn't been in Government since 2010.

Where we are as a country right now is down to the Conservative party and the stupid decisions it has taken, austerity being chief amogst these followed by the Brexit Referendum.

So many people's lives have been blighted by these self centred, entitled buffoons.

Seems to me that attacking the Labour party for all it's own stupidity, is rather missing the point.

Edit. Didn't notice who I was responding to. Stupid of me, I shouldn't have bothered

For once I agree, yes you shouldn't have bothered.