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blueinsa
Guest
Backed by the current mob? Check.
Keir Starmer
- Thread starter urban genie
- Start date
Backed by the current mob? Check.
Scottyboi
Well-Known Member
Fair play to Flint for just outing Thornberry.
George Hannah
Well-Known Member
Me too, I do care though but the rest of those being touted on here are pure McCluskey poison or utterly unsuitable.
Fame Monster
Well-Known Member
If I'm honest, I don't think there needs to be a healing between the different factions, I think things are that bad that there needs to be a gradual purge of those who've treated working class voters with contempt if Labour will ever be elected again.
Listening to Stephen Kinnock the other day, he was absolutely right. Labour needs to become more patriotic. That doesn't mean pursuing a hard brexit, stopping ethnic minorities from immigrating, or going to war every 5 years but it means not calling voters thick, racist, they didn't know what they were voting for etc.
Sadly, on the basis of the above criteria, that means a lot of Labour MPs need to be sent to the backbenches and kept out of the public spotlight. There's probably plenty who need to be deselected too. And that applies to those both on the left and right of the party in terms of how they think the economy should be.
With the way the party's run at the minute, that just isn't going to happen because so much of the membership shares these views of the electorate, especially the middle class Momentum types. So I think the purge can only happen at a very slow pace if at all.
Lisa Nandy is capable of that imo, and so is Dan Jarvis (difficult because he's also a mayor). They're also not tainted by consistently blocking Brexit and as far as I'm aware, have never sneered that the working class are thick or racist.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
DIdn't see it, but this is the point I made in the GE thread. Only those now out of politics or with no ambitions can speak their minds. Everyone apart from Marxists realise that Labour has since 2015 been treading completely the wrong path. Ed Milliband and his policies were a problem, and Corbyn has simply amplified them and made it even worse.
The problem is that Corbyn and his cronies have such a grip on the party, it's very difficult to see how anyone who is openly critical in this way, will ever win their leadership election - where ultimately a Momentum-dominated party membership will choose. Potential candidates either have to be true Cobynistas, or pretend to be one, or they have no chance.
This is why you see Caroline Flint and John Mann and Ruth Smeeth etc have been so openly critical, whereas others dare not.
Let us not forget that 3 years ago, 81% of Labour MPs voted no confidence in their leader.
Fame Monster
Well-Known Member
In the wake of the referendum result, nobody has acted with more class and dignity than Flint (especially given that she was a remainer) and if some of the Labour MPs who blocked May's deal had behaved with the same degree of class, they might have kept their jobs. I'm glad her final act was to ensure Thornberry will never be the leader of the Labour movement.
urban genie
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The progress side are pushing Nandy and Phillips already, and as I said if the members stay true to form niether would win if they both stand as they will split that vote.
The same could happen with the left if long bailey, raynor and another also stand against each other.
Thornbury has no chance from either side
Strange how women like creassy, powell and cooper haven't been muted as possible contenders
Hamann Pineapple
Well-Known Member
Let's be honest, whoever it is will be portrayed as unelectable unless it's a fucking tory
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blueinsa
Guest
Very much this.
Shaelumstash
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I honestly don’t know how a Corbyn supporter, with a straight face, can say the mid 00s cabinet was responsible for Labour’s support “starting to drop”.
It’s disingenuous at best, and out right cheeky at worst.
Labour’s support reached the highest levels in history during that period after 2 consecutive landslide victories. Support didn’t “start to drop” because people were pissed off at centre left policies.
Support started to drop because the same leader was heading in to a 3rd term, it’s inevitable support starts to wane. Also Iraq clearly (and quite rightly) had a huge impact in support falling.
Brown came in and steered the party to the left, the policies you are advocating, and guess what? Support for the party fell off a cliff and they lost the election after turning leftwards.
The last 4 elections the party has gone further to the left each time and support has dropped each time. And your explanation for Thursday’s result is because people 15 years ago were “sick of centre-left policies?” Do me a favour.
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Metal Biker
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A number of decent Labour MP's became casualties as a result of Labour's stance on important issues.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
I don't think we regarded Tony Blair as either a Tory, or as unelectable. (The loony left regarded him as a Tory of course, but look where that perspective has got them!) The hard left need to wake up and smell the coffee: We are not living in the 1970's. Put forward a manifesto which speaks only to miners and steelworkers and don't be surprised when the 3 remaining miners and steelworkers are not sufficient to win you a majority. Labour need to move with the times, and offer hope and aspiration to the upwardly mobile working and middle classes. Because that is the majority of the population.
urban genie
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Wel las I am not a corbyn of momentum acolyte I can say it with ease.
If you cannot see the ineptitude and blandness of cooper, smith, balls, milliband, milliband eagle, eagle, lewis byrne, creagh and how there complete lack of any ideas or thinking left labour as fucked then as we have been this last week.
We lost 94 seast in 2010 under thier young upcoming cabinet and 54 under them again in 2015.
If you really believe brown and milliband ean on a left wing program then we dissagree, the overton window was aligned to the right of centre for decades and the manifestos then ran wee not left wing but liberal social democratic.
Shaelumstash
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We can have a philosophical debate about where the centre is, but record investment in the NHS, shortest waiting times in history, record investment in state education, the Good Friday agreement, the minimum wage, they’re left of centre policies for me and for British politics.
I keep hearing about UK politics compared with Scandinavia and it’s absolutely ridiculous. If the last 10 years have taught us anything, it’s that UK politics is a million miles from Scandinavia.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
Someone needs to remind him - OK I'll do it - that in the GE in 2024, it will be 50 years since anyone other than Tony Blair won a GE for Labour. Let that sink in for one moment. 50. Years.
Carry on like they are and it will be 60, 70 years or never. Because the party will have broken up by then.
Shaelumstash
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Unfortunately, some Corbyn supporters would be happy to never win an election again as long as they can lord it up on the sidelines, happy in the knowledge they have the bestest morals.
Chippy_boy
Well-Known Member
Hardly surprising when that's what Corbyn thinks he's been doing for his entire political career. I don't know what changed in him to make him fleetingly imagine he might be PM - he's always been happier objecting, rather than actually doing anything.
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mat
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Murdoch not pissing about. Shame it's the members that choose and not him.
urban genie
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mat
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Phillips got a nice little 'celebrity' article in The Sunday Times.