Russian invasion of Ukraine

mosssideblue said:
Who owns the waters at the entrance to the black sea?
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The 1936 Montreux Convention provides for free passage of civilian ships between the international waters of the Black and the Mediterranean seas. However, a single country (Turkey) has complete control over the straits connecting the two seas. Military ships are categorised separately from civilian vessels and can pass through the straits only if the ship belongs to a Black Sea country. Other military ships have the right to pass through the straits if they are not in a war against Turkey and if they stay in the Black Sea basin for a limited time. The 1982 amendments to the Montreux Convention allow Turkey to close the straits at its discretion in both war and peacetime.

The Montreux Convention governs the passage of vessels between the Black, the Mediterranean and Aegean seas and the presence of military vessels belonging to non-littoral states in the Black Sea waters.

The Russian Black Sea Fleet has its official primary headquarters and facilities in the city of Sevastopol (Sevastopol Naval Base).

In December 2018, the Kerch Strait incident occurred, in which the Russian navy and coast guard took control of three Ukrainian vessels as the ships were trying to enter the Black Sea.
 
tregyblue61 said:
The 1936 Montreux Convention provides for free passage of civilian ships between the international waters of the Black and the Mediterranean seas. However, a single country (Turkey) has complete control over the straits connecting the two seas. Military ships are categorised separately from civilian vessels and can pass through the straits only if the ship belongs to a Black Sea country. Other military ships have the right to pass through the straits if they are not in a war against Turkey and if they stay in the Black Sea basin for a limited time. The 1982 amendments to the Montreux Convention allow Turkey to close the straits at its discretion in both war and peacetime.

The Montreux Convention governs the passage of vessels between the Black, the Mediterranean and Aegean seas and the presence of military vessels belonging to non-littoral states in the Black Sea waters.

The Russian Black Sea Fleet has its official primary headquarters and facilities in the city of Sevastopol (Sevastopol Naval Base).

In December 2018, the Kerch Strait incident occurred, in which the Russian navy and coast guard took control of three Ukrainian vessels as the ships were trying to enter the Black Sea.
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Thanks
 
urban genie said:
If the do and it landed Manchester city centre head for Radcliffe, bolton or Bury


https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/


I am in the 3rd degree radiation burns and eventually death from radiation poisoning radius
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Straight after the match I'm setting off for Duckenfild. There is nowt there to lay waste to so it is the safest place there is. @i kne albert davy says i can stay at his. Biggie hasnt got back to me for some reason.
 
blueinsa said:
Twitter and co have been switched off by Russia because it is filling up with videos of smashed Russian vehicles, tanks, downed aircraft and dead servicemen.

Not bad for a country that hasn’t suffered a single loss yet.
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There's defintely memories of Comical Ali with how the Russian official media is playing this out - despite being the aggressors.

If... it's all true, and they are suffering major losses for no real gains, then it will either push Putin to try and get some political victory from a retreat, or push him onto the big red button... I doubt Putin does being humiliated well, judging from how he apparently felt when the Berlin wall fell.
 
JASR said:
There's defintely memories of Comical Ali with how the Russian official media is playing this out - despite being the aggressors.

If... it's all true, and they are suffering major losses for no real gains, then it will either push Putin to try and get some political victory from a retreat, or push him onto the big red button... I doubt Putin does being humiliated well, judging from how he apparently felt when the Berlin wall fell.
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In the context of the entire forces massed on Ukrainians borders, what we are seeing now is actually proportionally (to use Bidens words) a minor incursion. Easy for me to say from the comfort of the UK I know, but it does suggest room for negotiation or sadly of course the capacity for a further overwhelming invasion in the next week.
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
In the context of the entire forces massed on Ukrainians borders, what we are seeing now is actually proportionally (to use Bidens words) a minor incursion. Easy for me to say from the comfort of the UK I know, but it does suggest room for negotiation or sadly of course the capacity for a further overwhelming invasion in the next week.
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Or an army that looks impressive, but doesn't actually have the resources to supply all of them.
 
For the first time I think Sky News has actually taken over the BBC News on reporting of a big event.

Sky News seems to have better people to interview i.e former president of Ukraine.

And it seems to be giving a much better overview of the military actions themselves. They've just described how the main battle force of the Russians is closing on on Kyiv and they are likely to be ready by this evening. But might want to wait until morning light (street fighting is hard enough in the day) before they move in.

They also gave people images of what extra hardware these main forces bring i.e more Su35 fighter-bombers, more tanks (largely T72s), more BMP armoured personnel carriers and heavy artillery units as well.

I haven't seen any of that sort of detail on the BBC and that's pretty basic information.
 
Blue Llama said:
Does anyone really know what Putin is trying to achieve? His stated motivation was to stop the Ukraine joining NATO. I can understand Russia not wanting NATO on their doorstep but how does moving your doorstep next door to existing NATO member countries satisfy that target?
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It’s not really anything to do with NATO being on his border. He simply wants a disunited and weak West, and a larger more powerful Russia.

For me, his two most important quotes…

“The collapse of the Soviet empire was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century”, 2005
(Although not from a Communism point-of-view since he also once said “communism is a blind alley, far away from the mainstream of civilisation" - which I do agree with.)

“The cause of Peter the Great is still alive” (2019)
(Peter the Great founded the Russian Empire and was the man who had the biggest aims for a greatest Russian expanse possible. Putin has a statue of Peter the Great on his desk.)

…tell you everything you need to know.

When you look at the main list of things that he’s gone about to achieve his aims, I think it’s clear that a disunited and weak West, and a larger more powerful Russia is what he wants.

Takeover Russian state TV (in Russia and output around the world), spreading misinformation and Russian propaganda. Get this into countries in the West and you tickle the interests of West hating Westerners who think they’re edgy for watching alternative news output. This might seem small, even insignificant, but it’s the basis for many things. You peak the internet of people who you can exploit to do further damage.

Puppets in power in other countries. Yanukovych in Ukraine and Trump in USA were his puppets. Currently, Lukashenko in Belarus and Orban in Hungary are doing his dirty work in Europe.

Meddling in elections/referendums. Every election in Ukraine going back to 2004 has had Russia’s tentacles all over them. The 2016 and 2020 USA elections saw Russian interference towards the Clinton and Biden presidential drives. Also, Brexit…

He’s spread misinformation into the West across numerous topics, making our societies sceptical of everything and gullible to a lot of it with the amount of it there is. He’s not alone in this as it’s very likely China and North Korea also do this.

Off the back of the misinformation, the online war within the West was started that sees two extremes of an topic forever arguing online, or demonstrating their extremism in protests (Brexit, BLM, MAGA, Qanon, ‘cancel-cultre’, woke v gammon, Covid conspiracies, vaccine conspiracies, NATO’s “threat”/“imperialism” etc.)… If any of us could ever work back through to find the first Tweets, posts, threads, articles, videos etc. online of any issue or argument, you’ll probably link back to some far left or far right or West hating tosser who’s been manipulated, paid, forced, or happy to post their Russian (or Chinese/NKorean) misinformation or extreme argument online. And the disagreements spread like wildfire across comments sections and forums and in every day conversations.

There are likely many more things we’ve never even heard of or would consider, that he’s done.

He used the British public to get Britain to leave and weaken the EU, he’s got Orban who’s said he’s going to weaken the EU further from the inside, he used Trump to try and break up NATO by getting USA to leave it… and every **** everywhere is arguing, falling out, pointing fingers on each extreme of every argument.

He was more than winning in disuniting and weakening the West!

With his expansion of Russia:
He’s been after Georgia for years.
He went into Crimea and Eastern Ukraine in 2014.
He’s gone into all of Ukraine this year which he’s been planning for a long time (and I reposted something earlier that @dave_blue12 posted yesterday with reasons why Ukraine and Ukraine’s land is so important and so enticing for Russia to invade and takeover).
This week, he’s threatened Finland and Sweden of doing the same to them as he’s doing in Ukraine.
Moldova? Romania? Poland?
Kaliningrad part of Russia and can be bridged back to Russia by taking over the Baltic countries.
I think Belarus and maybe even Hungary would be easy to manipulate.
He’s talked heavily about the Russian Empire and Soviet Union lands many times, even this week!
 
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crooky said:
For the first time I think Sky News has actually taken over the BBC News on reporting of a big event.

Sky News seems to have better people to interview i.e former president of Ukraine.

And it seems to be giving a much better overview of the military actions themselves. They've just described how the main battle force of the Russians is closing on on Kyiv and they are likely to be ready by this evening. But might want to wait until morning light (street fighting is hard enough in the day) before they move in.

They also gave people images of what extra hardware these main forces bring i.e more Su35 fighter-bombers, more tanks (largely T72s), more BMP armoured personnel carriers and heavy artillery units as well.

I haven't seen any of that sort of detail on the BBC and that's pretty basic information.
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The BBC would be leading on why the Ukrainian forces are not wearing masks.
 
bluethrunthru said:
The protest that the Irish did was lacking in the full extent of damage this **** deserves

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I watch David McCullough on the RTE news yesterday and thought he tackled him quite well. He didn’t allow him to spout bollox.

I agree that he should be expelled and think all supporting countries should do the same with Russian officials on their soil.
 
Saleha mohsin US is eyeing sanctions on Russia’s central bank, I'm told, a move that would target much of the $643b reserves Putin has amassed A final decision hasn’t been made but admin aims to make each move in conjunction with allies across Europe for maximum impact.
 
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