Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Tuearts right boot]

Seems like the worst job going right now.

The Russians have started welding a sort of cage on top of their tanks (the missiles fly up in the air and come down on the roof of the tank where the armour is thinner.

Based on the number of destroyed tanks and APCs with cages welded on the top it seems to have made no difference at all.

Maybe it keeps the tank crews happy until......

 

[cleavers]

So it is being talked about today that we might send ukraine anti tank and anti aircraft weapons , thought we were the first in the world to give them these weapons ?

We've been sending them, and training their soldiers for at least 8 years (name of the op is available on google/wikipedia), and we've been delivering them daily since this kicked off.

They are flown to the nearest airport in Poland, and then transported onwards by road.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Seems like the worst job going right now.

The Russians have started welding a sort of cage on top of their tanks (the missiles fly up in the air and come down on the roof of the tank where the armour is thinner.

Based on the number of destroyed tanks and APCs with cages welded on the top it seems to have made no difference at all.

I wouldn't have thought it would offer much defence against the concussion of the blast on a steel box, or that the blast would do the electrical connections much good.

 

[Elbow beards]

Beard ?

No mate, mine was army not navy. :)

 

[kinkyblue]

You can see a before/after here -





Shows how scared the tank crews must be though.

That’s not stopping a Javlin!

 

[roubaixtuesday]

Johnson did say that they’re anticipating taking in hundreds of thousands in the coming months, though that is admittedly little comfort to those seeking refuge now.

Words are cheap

 

[Slipper One]

Inch by inch, the world moves closer to World War 3

From somewhere the world needs a person who will bring some sanity to the situation, because if it does not happen, Russia has over 2,500 nuclear weapons. MAD becomes reality.

Very worrying times.

Isn't this a little fearmongering?

There will be no WW3 unless NATO steps in with 'boots on the ground' and they are acutely aware of that.

The sanctions applied will really bite the Russian economy and ability to wage any long term war. Give them chance to take proper effect.

Perhaps communications between the west and Russia bought some sort of agreement thereby stopping the MIG transfer, who knows.
Whether you realize it or not, negotiations are ongoing to try and resolve this and that takes time. Putin has already set out his demands and they will always be higher than what he would actually accept, that's how negotiation works. He would benefit from negotiating from a position of power, but with the slow progress of his military and the global sanctions, how powerful that is remains in question. His power will come from threats and bullying.........and civilian loss of life. All of this media coverage showing dead women and children just strengthens his position.

To get any sort of resolution in this, the absolute minimum is that he will have to come out of this as being seen 'victorious' and having achieved his objectives. I think however this plays out, the eastern areas of Luhansk and Donetsk will unfortunately be conceded.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Those might offer limited protection against rpgs which is what Russia experienced in Chechnya & Afghanistan. They would be pretty effective against Molotov’s, that said Molotov’s should be directed at tracks first to disable anyway.
A tandem heat warhead like javelin or spike is going through any current armour and isn’t getting stopped by a cage no matter what Putin says.

What is spike? A different kind of missile?

("Don't tell him, spike" would be an unhelpful answer!)

 

[hilts]

Huh, wiki ! I had an Action Man (with movable arms) so I know all about military conflict.

Unless you had the parachute and threw him out of your bedroom window you know nothing.

Nothing.

 

[Hayley Croppers chopper]

The government here faces a dilemma with the refugee crisis from Ukraine. Brexit proved that we have a lot of our electorate from both the traditional left and the right are Nationalistic. The general view is that people didn't like the free movement of people or people seeking refugee status here. Now that we are living with the 24 hour coverage of the horrific war in Ukraine ,the general feeling is that we should be taking a lot more Ukrainian refugees but I bet they don't feel the same about other refugees of different nationalities. If the government takes a different approach to Ukrainian refugees ,will they be accused of prejudice?
I know brexit was a lot more than the movement of people but I want this post to stick to the topic

I voted for Brexit.
I believe all refugees fleeing war or persecution should be entitled to enter into this country.
Checks have to be made on people coming here, but it should be made easier for the poor refugees of Ukraine, Syria, Afghanistan, or wherever they are without them having to tear their arses across europe.
It was disgraceful how Afghans who have served our country were just left to fend for themselves when the west pulled out.
I never voted Tory.

 

[hello]

What is spike? A different kind of missile?

("Don't tell him, spike" would be an unhelpful answer!)

Spike is the Israeli atgm, a few variants which have max distances 1 man could in theory carry 2 spike lrs at only 4kilos more than 1 javelin if operating within 1-1.5km or the ER variant can be used 4K licks away. Both are tandem HEAT warheads and both fire and duck and wait for the boom

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

I don't know why they didn't just repaint the jets in Ukraine livery, and just fly them into Ukraine one by one (assuming they have the pilots), without announcing it all to the world, yes the russians would have an idea where they came from, but they could fly in from several directions so it wouldn't be easy for them to prove where they came from.

It's not as simple as that.
Although the Ukrainian Migs and say the Polish Migs are in essence the same planes (airframe, engines etc), Nato Migs will be fitted with a number of different electronic packages.
So before a Ukrainian pilot could use it, these electronic packages would have to be removed and/or replaced.

 

[Slipper One]

Maybe, maybe not.

Putin has spouted several times that what we (NATO) have already done is tantamount to joining Ukraine

You need to try and not take every word Putin (or others) say quite so literally.

Put your biases aside and not take everything you read and watch in the media literally either.

People like us are used like pawns in a chess game, especially now that social media is so prevalent.

 

[Protein Junkie]

Words are cheap

Jam tomorrow for the Ukraine refugees just like we are used to.

 

[Magicpole]

Unless you had the parachute and threw him out of your bedroom window you know nothing.

Nothing.

Bang on. Even commenting on anything remotely military, if you havent done this, shows you're basically a wrong un. And more than likely a ****.

 

[blueju]

Pfft....moveable arms my arse, did he have realistic hair, he's nothing without realistic hair.

eagle eyes

 

[west didsblue]

So all the Ukrainians have to do is is give away another massive chunk of land - the mineral and oil rich region that the economy is based on.

Then after the 2028 war they just give another bit.

And in the 2035 war they can just join Russia entirely.

I understand the desire to stop the fighting and the casualties but I think all Ukrainians know Putin is only going to come back and next time he won’t fuck up his war plan and give the Ukrainians a chance.

This invasion has been planned for years, the Russians simply cannot make up for all the blunders they made, it will take months to build more missiles and supply trucks and come up with counter strategies …. Unless they get another few years to regroup and launch another one.

The bit about the Israelis telling the US and EU about the terms because Ukraine didn’t shows that Ukraine is expecting to get fucked by the West.

Germany et al. desperate to stop having to sanction Russia or deal with refugees will say “Take the offer of only losing 1/3 of your country or the weapons tap is turned off”.

As you say, the invasion has clearly been planned for years, and the plan was to destabilise the west first to limit the response. I strongly suspect that they waited till now because they now have deployed these hypersonic missiles in sufficient numbers that we cannot defend against, whereas previously our missile defence systems were probably good enough to prevent all but a mass MAD style strike, so now they can make a credible threat of using these missiles and we would be much less likely to intervene militarily. Of course, due to the enormous cost of developing this new missile system they have neglected their conventional forces that are now being decimated on the ground in Ukraine. I'm sure that wasn't part of the plan, and neither was the fact that the west went from being destabilised to united within hours and have imposed the toughest economic sanctions possible.

 

[Big Joe Corrigan]

Unless you had the parachute and threw him out of your bedroom window you know nothing.

Nothing.

The parachute was too small to ensure a safe landing, a pillowcase was preferable.

 

[KS55]

Have we heard from @Petrusha?

 

[Chris in London]

The security thing is just an age old tactic to whip up some more fear of refugees.

No it isn't. Visas have a proven record in preventing state actors from entering the UK.

The government didn't grant a single visa application from Russian citizens who put "purpose of visit: to assassinate dissidents" on their application form.