Etihad Atmosphere - 2022/23

jrb said:
Not knocking you. All good ideas. If you offered half price season tickets to the fans in the singing section which is officially Block 115, you’d get plenty of people who stand in 115 but don’t sing applying for those half price season tickets, which is pretty pointless if we all want a new and larger singing section full of singers. You’d also piss a lot of singers off in 114, 116, 117, 111, 110 and 109 who wouldn’t be eligible for a half price season ticket as they aren’t officially in the singing section.

One of the ways the club could weed out the singers from the non-singers and insure singers fill a new singing section in the expanded North stand is by pushing a new singing section constantly on the OS, via emails, via social media. having info stands on the concourses on match days at the back of SSL1, 111, 110, the family stand, SSL3, etc, with City staff talking to the fans, getting them to sign up to relocate by taking their names and supporters number, sending club officials to OSC meetings, etc. The club will have 3 years to do this before the expanded North stand opens.

City need to speak to the Rags and find out how they created their successful singing section. No shame in that. Then they need to see if that or some thing similar could be implemented at City, even if it means tweaking it.

A bit dated, but an interesting read, Q&A, about United fans and United worked together to create a new singing section, which has since grown (1500 United fans?) and is located between the main stand and the Stretford End.

Jonathan Shrager talks to SEF’s Andrew Kilduff, better known as ‘Tufty’, about the second singing section trial and more generally about the group’s work.

The club have been very refreshing in their approach to the singing section and welcoming our ideas and input. I think they realise that something has to be done, and the weight of various fan groups behind Fans United also helped them buy into the idea. We have spent almost two years talking to the club, with the outcome being two trials so far this season. The club is also keen for this to be led by the fans, taking on board our ideas and suggestions. We also stated that the acoustics within the stadium don’t help the atmosphere and the club commissioned a study into this. It is the result of this study that has led to the trials.

The story behind Old Trafford's singing section

Formed in 2005, Stretford End Flags (SEF) is an independent supporters group, which was initially set up to provide the banners that adorn the front of the Stretford End. The group has since branched out, often organising mosaics at Old Trafford and elsewhere, and is at the forefront of the...
www.sportskeeda.com www.sportskeeda.com
Click to expand...
When I say that first refusal should be offered to the existing singing areas I mean all the areas which are currently railed seating. That’s probably about 3000 fans or more at a guess
 
jrb said:
Not knocking you. All good ideas. If you offered half price season tickets to the fans in the singing section which is officially Block 115, you’d get plenty of people who stand in 115 but don’t sing applying for those half price season tickets, which is pretty pointless if we all want a new and larger singing section full of singers. You’d also piss a lot of singers off in 114, 116, 117, 111, 110 and 109 who wouldn’t be eligible for a half price season ticket as they aren’t officially in the singing section.

One of the ways the club could weed out the singers from the non-singers and insure singers fill a new singing section in the expanded North stand is by pushing a new singing section constantly on the OS, via emails, via social media. having info stands on the concourses on match days at the back of SSL1, 111, 110, the family stand, SSL3, etc, with City staff talking to the fans, getting them to sign up to relocate by taking their names and supporters number, sending club officials to OSC meetings, etc. The club will have 3 years to do this before the expanded North stand opens.

City need to speak to the Rags and find out how they created their successful singing section. No shame in that. Then they need to see if that or some thing similar could be implemented at City, even if it means tweaking it.

A bit dated, but an interesting read, Q&A, about United fans and United worked together to create a new singing section, which has since grown (1500 United fans?) and is located between the main stand and the Stretford End.

Jonathan Shrager talks to SEF’s Andrew Kilduff, better known as ‘Tufty’, about the second singing section trial and more generally about the group’s work.

The club have been very refreshing in their approach to the singing section and welcoming our ideas and input. I think they realise that something has to be done, and the weight of various fan groups behind Fans United also helped them buy into the idea. We have spent almost two years talking to the club, with the outcome being two trials so far this season. The club is also keen for this to be led by the fans, taking on board our ideas and suggestions. We also stated that the acoustics within the stadium don’t help the atmosphere and the club commissioned a study into this. It is the result of this study that has led to the trials.

The story behind Old Trafford's singing section

Formed in 2005, Stretford End Flags (SEF) is an independent supporters group, which was initially set up to provide the banners that adorn the front of the Stretford End. The group has since branched out, often organising mosaics at Old Trafford and elsewhere, and is at the forefront of the...
www.sportskeeda.com www.sportskeeda.com
Click to expand...
That’s an interesting read, particularly this bit which is EXACTLY what a few of us on here keep saying:

“For the Sociedad trial we tested the L-stand area, which is usually home to the away supporters. This area worked well, however it was felt that South Stand didn’t really join in and that the area also didn’t allow United chants to flow upwards to the upper tier due to the location of the section. For the next singing section trial against Fulham on February 9th we will be using the other quadrant where North Stand meets East Stand – the old J and K Stand areas. This section should allow all of East Stand upper and lower to join in with the singing and for those in North Stand to also join in. With the roof of North stand also trapping the noise we feel that this will improve the atmosphere and volume within of Old Trafford”.

Their acoustic experts notes that songs don’t “flow upwards”. Our ground is even worse because of the high roof and its angle. And our situation is much worse because songs can’t “flow” through away supporters so only “flow” one way. That brings us back to crowd psychology: people will sing if those around do. It takes a pissed up or unself conscious to stand up on their own in a block and join in with a song being sung 100 yards away.
 
At City we have always had the singers next to the away fans and that will never change. If you’re wanting the singers to relocate to a new home end in the NS then you’re wasting your time. At the Swamp their singers have always been too shit scared to go anywhere near the away section. Same too for Liverpool. Probably because they know they’d get rinsed for being JCL foreigner types.
 
Didsbury Dave said:
When I say that first refusal should be offered to the existing singing areas I mean all the areas which are currently railed seating. That’s probably about 3000 fans or more at a guess
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OK.

But the problem is identifying singers and people who only want a cheaper season ticket.

The club has to find a way of targeting fans who want to move to a new North stand singing section because they want to sing. Offering season ticket incentives doesn’t guarantee that, even though cheaper season tickets are a good idea. TBH I doubt the club would even consider that. There has only been 1 season ticket freeze in 11 years, never mind a season ticket price reduction.
 
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JOGAMIGMOG said:
At City we have always had the singers next to the away fans and that will never change. If you’re wanting the singers to relocate to a new home end in the NS then you’re wasting your time. At the Swamp their singers have always been too shit scared to go anywhere near the away section. Same too for Liverpool. Probably because they know they’d get rinsed for being JCL foreigner types.
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The Rags’ singing section is right next to the away fans now isn’t it?
 
Didsbury Dave said:
That’s an interesting read, particularly this bit which is EXACTLY what a few of us on here keep saying:

“For the Sociedad trial we tested the L-stand area, which is usually home to the away supporters. This area worked well, however it was felt that South Stand didn’t really join in and that the area also didn’t allow United chants to flow upwards to the upper tier due to the location of the section. For the next singing section trial against Fulham on February 9th we will be using the other quadrant where North Stand meets East Stand – the old J and K Stand areas. This section should allow all of East Stand upper and lower to join in with the singing and for those in North Stand to also join in. With the roof of North stand also trapping the noise we feel that this will improve the atmosphere and volume within of Old Trafford”.

Their acoustic experts notes that songs don’t “flow upwards”. Our ground is even worse because of the high roof and its angle. And our situation is much worse because songs can’t “flow” through away supporters so only “flow” one way. That brings us back to crowd psychology: people will sing if those around do. It takes a pissed up or unself conscious to stand up on their own in a block and join in with a song being sung 100 yards away.
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Singing section at the top and the back of the stand with a low flat roof above.

1672855760314.jpeg

Some of you will cringe at this letter. Only just see the picture of the letter myself. But it worked and probably wasn’t needed again.

Fans United, a collaboration of Manchester United supporters groups and Fanzines, were keen for those sat in the new singing section to set an example to the rest of the stadium and improve the atmosphere at Old Trafford.

2013.

In the letter, fans were urged to 'make it a night to remember' and told: 'You know why you're here. To make a difference, to make Old Trafford better.'

1672855657864.jpeg
 
jrb said:
Singing section at the top and the back of the stand with a low flat roof above.

View attachment 65180

Some of you will cringe at this letter. Only just see the picture of the letter myself. But it worked and probably wasn’t needed again.

Fans United, a collaboration of Manchester United supporters groups and Fanzines, were keen for those sat in the new singing section to set an example to the rest of the stadium and improve the atmosphere at Old Trafford.

In the letter, fans were urged to 'make it a night to remember' and told: 'You know why you're here. To make a difference, to make Old Trafford better.'

View attachment 65179I
Click to expand...
I hate to say it but they’ve always had better organized fan groups than us. Ours tend to end up falling out with each other. City fans are perhaps a bit more individually minded.
 
Didsbury Dave said:
I hate to say it but they’ve always had better organized fan groups than us. Ours tend to end up falling out with each other. City fans are perhaps a bit more individually minded.
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True.

Similar to the Dippers.

We’ve got fan groups. They need to come together on this. So do the OSC branches. There’s quite a few young lads in the Branch I’m in. Always loud and boisterous at away games.
 
jrb said:
Even some thing simple and psychological like an official North stand singing section season ticket, different to all the other looking similar season tickets. It gives that person an identity with-in our fan base. Marks them out as a fan who stands in the North stand singing section.
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And puts more of an onus/expectancy on them to do some singing. Hopefully it would make individuals less reluctant to move there just for a potentially cheaper ticket too.
 
Didsbury Dave said:
I hate to say it but they’ve always had better organized fan groups than us. Ours tend to end up falling out with each other. City fans are perhaps a bit more individually minded.
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At least one of their fan groups is led by very comfortably off, and in some cases famous MGS old boys with a hotline to the directors. Apart from being the Scousers of Mancs in sensibility they have a wealthier fanbase and being a wealthy activist fan opens doors and gets you listened to. We have wealthy fans of course but there isn't an 'old school tie' network linking the fanbase and the club in the way they have.

But that's no excuse. Agree with others we have great fan infrastructure through OSCs etc and should be using it for this issue. Surely if the club hears the same thing from OSCs, which they're keen for fans to join, City Matters reps (any of us can write to them) and 1894 they're obliged to listen?
 
jrb said:
Even some thing simple and psychological like an official North stand singing section season ticket, different to all the other looking similar season tickets. It gives that person an identity with-in our fan base. Marks them out as a fan who stands in the North stand singing section.
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Call it “The New Kippax”.
 
Jazzyblue said:
At least one of their fan groups is led by very comfortably off, and in some cases famous MGS old boys with a hotline to the directors. Apart from being the Scousers of Mancs in sensibility they have a wealthier fanbase and being a wealthy activist fan opens doors and gets you listened to. We have wealthy fans of course but there isn't an 'old school tie' network linking the fanbase and the club in the way they have.

But that's no excuse. Agree with others we have great fan infrastructure through OSCs etc and should be using it for this issue. Surely if the club hears the same thing from OSCs, which they're keen for fans to join, City Matters reps (any of us can write to them) and 1894 they're obliged to listen?
Click to expand...
What our fan groups don’t have is a visible leader. With YouTube and social media it’s easy to get messages out there in no time. Some kind of leader or leaders who are respected by the vocal fans but intelligent enough to communicate with the club at board level could pull things together and give the fans a voice.
 
If they are clever they can take this a step further and try to use to encourage back lapsed local working class blues. As I stated earlier this would have to be price-led.

A dirt cheap “New Kippax” could sit alongside the other areas being more expensive as long as it was noticeably different. And with my commercial head on, once it’s established and recognised people will want to be part of it and prices can rise.
 
jrb said:
Singing section at the top and the back of the stand with a low flat roof above.

View attachment 65180

Some of you will cringe at this letter. Only just see the picture of the letter myself. But it worked and probably wasn’t needed again.

Fans United, a collaboration of Manchester United supporters groups and Fanzines, were keen for those sat in the new singing section to set an example to the rest of the stadium and improve the atmosphere at Old Trafford.

2013.

In the letter, fans were urged to 'make it a night to remember' and told: 'You know why you're here. To make a difference, to make Old Trafford better.'

View attachment 65179
Click to expand...
There are rules in their singing section where you can be told you’re not allowed to return to the area if you get your phone out during the game or you’re not singing.

I’m not saying we should do the same, but we should make it explicitly clear that the area is for singing. Information sent out when applications for the area come out saying ‘do not apply if you are not going to sing’ and letters/emails sent with seasonticket packs telling people the area is for singing.
 
Psychedelic Casual said:
There are rules in their singing section where you can be told you’re not allowed to return to the area if you get your phone out during the game or you’re not singing.

I’m not saying we should do the same, but we should make it explicitly clear that the area is for singing. Information sent out when applications for the area come out saying ‘do not apply if you are not going to sing’ and letters/emails sent with seasonticket packs telling people the area is for singing.
Click to expand...

Apparently so. City wouldn't accept that. They would still want some level of control over the singing section.

The club have a team who work on creating a better atmosphere, displays, etc. They're a good set of lads who take their job seriously and work very hard. A lot goes on behind the scenes that most City fans don't know about in that respect.
 
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