Middle East Conflict

I believe this exactly what Hamas and the Iranians want, a long drawn out soul sapping urban war, start a new front in the north and Israel is in serious trouble, that’s what is worrying the Americans, that this whole situation has been engineered is getting quite obvious they know Israel can’t stand back once attacked
I know fvck all, but basically said something similar many many pages ago.
Putin would love to have the Americans lured into this.

This whole situation does look like it has been engineered and a stand back and let’s think, is needed.

I don’t however think that is the initial urge from the Israeli government.
 
I'm scared to death some big fuck off war in on the horizon that results at some point in my son being forced into fighting. Sounds unrealistic but it is my biggest fear every time I hear a world war mentioned. Just googled and the UK only has 75000 in the current army.
 
I’m still to make my mind up.

What I have said and won’t change my mind on is what I said previously, regardless of who fired the missile and regardless of it being targeted or an accident, you just don’t hit a hospital.
what you mean like 2 days before when the IDF shelled it and then followed up by telling them to evacuate? Do you acknowledge the fact that the IDF have form for bombing hospitals and schools?
 
I just got to pondering the word “Terrorist” few thoughts

By the definition of the word Hamas are “Terrorist” but I did think the word was generally reserved for non state actors who wage war on both civilian and military targets, like it or not they are the governing power in Gaza, can a governing power be classed as terrorist? It’s of of no matter, however what to we call a governing power that sets out to indiscriminately kill its own citizens and citizens from another side of a conflict, Syria, Myanmar, Russia for example are theses terrorist states?

For the host population theses groups are not classed as terrorists rather freedom fighters, take the IRA and all its previous incarnations, for the poor and oppressed Irish they were their salvation from the oppressive and unfair governance of Ireland

Forgetting that debate, how would people suggest the Palestinians go about getting their own state and freedom from the daily oppression they suffer? Non violence like Ghandi? Just suffer in silence with the hope that the world notices their plight? Or form violent resistance against Israel ? It’s an interesting point to ponder and I am genuinely interested in what people think
Anyone who the USA deem as terrorist states
 
I’m still to make my mind up.

What I have said and won’t change my mind on is what I said previously, regardless of who fired the missile and regardless of it being targeted or an accident, you just don’t hit a hospital.
The evidence is now pretty overwhelming. Whether the Palestinian Jihad missile broke-up in the air en route to Israel (due to ir's quality being a bit poor) or because it was intercepted by an Israeli iron dome missile is probably the only Who-Done-It issue to resolve.
 
Here's a mind blowing story for you.


HAMAS not just armed and trained by Iran, but by Russia too.
Wagner was the Russian organisation used to train Hamas units. Russian supplies were funneled via Iran.

The way the massacre unfolded in Israel it was very clear to see who was behind such an unprecedented attack. Just a matter of time until it came out and good to see it was sooner rather than later.
 
what you mean like 2 days before when the IDF shelled it and then followed up by telling them to evacuate? Do you acknowledge the fact that the IDF have form for bombing hospitals and schools?
Absolutely they have form. Said as much myself, that saying we will do it, it happening and then saying it wasn’t us, is highly suspicious.

But I’m with blueinsa on this. We don’t know the truth and there are conflicting stories that are very plausible from both sides.

On balance of probabilities you may side one way or the other but that is not a high enough standard of proof.

At the end of the day no matter who is responsible, it is a war crime, in my opinion.
 
The evidence is now pretty overwhelming. Whether the Palestinian Jihad missile broke-up in the air en route to Israel (due to ir's quality being a bit poor) or because it was intercepted by an Israeli iron dome missile is probably the only Who-Done-It issue to resolve.
No it’s not, it’s inconclusive, if you read Israeli friendly news sources PIJ did it, but many others say it’s inconclusive and without proper forensic evidence gathered at the scene we will never know
 
Icedently, why does anyone believe anything Hamas says?
It's all a grain of truth wrapped up in propaganda that Goebles would be proud of.
Take the claimed 500 deaths IN the hospital as an example. They would be mostly totally OUTSIDE the hostpital and 500 would be in the very top 5% percercentile of expected casualties according to expert after expert interviewed over the last few days.
Yes deaths in war are terrible, but it's as though folks are DESPERATE to BLAME Isreal for anything and everything - regardless of the evidence.
Isreal have a lot to answer for, but really it's getting stupid.
 

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