Banning smoking in beer gardens

[Coatigan]

Cheers pal.

A beer garden with a smoking and non smoking area works fine as it is but what annoys me is selfish non smokers do gooder busy bodies wanting smoking banned in open air spaces because they might just get a foul whiff of smoke.

I hope I can stop when I'm ready to and if I do I won't look at smokers in disdain like some third world leper because nicotine is the most addictive substance in the world, IMO.

It is all in the context. As I say, some bars are no issue, some are put up with it, some I actively avoid. You yourself might not be a problem to anyone where you are, you might be but are unaware, or you might be fully aware but not care. Entitled to any or all, all well within the rules. We'll end up going round in circles though, I don't need to say any more.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

For what it's worth, if the ban does come into play, I will feel bad for you, being denied a place to combine a pint and a smoke in public. I honestly mean that btw, with zero sarcasm, I fully get your take here.

But for every one of you, there will probably be four or five others that will either welcome it, be fine with it, or just not really care. And all their health will be improved. And if it doesn't come, the discussion alone may prompt some pubs to limit it anyway, or people to be more conscious of others. And if that doesn't happen either, then things stay the same, till it is tackled in some other way.

Polls do not support your assertion that 4 or 5 would welcome an outdoor smoking ban in pub gardens. Its about half in some polls, much less in others and more in some polls.

 

[Coatigan]

Pretty sure everything that needs to be argued already has at this point.
Probably best to just wait and see what happens. I doubt any full ban will take place and there will be several caveats to anything proposed.
Seems like a subject that people enjoy getting angry about.

I think they (the government) will dilute it, personally.

I think they will follow through with the ban outside hospitals and sporting venues, but will either abandon or largely reduce the beer garden part of it. As I said though, even legislation that forces pubs and restaurants to have a dedicated non-smoking outside area would be great, with leaving scope for places that can, to offer both, with dedicated smoking areas.

 

[Coatigan]

Polls do not support you assertion that 4 or 5 would welcome an outdoor smoking ban in pub gardens. Its about half in some polls, much less in others and more in some polls.

They don't, you are right. As things stand. I was aware of that, and it is my opinion that by the time it comes into play, if it does, mindsets will change. Based on nothing really other than how these things generally go, including the indoor ban. But yes, it was not an attempt at a factual claim.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

They don't, you are right. As things stand. I was aware of that, and it is my opinion that by the time it comes into play, if it does, mindsets will change. Based on nothing really other than how these things generally go, including the indoor ban. But yes, it was not an attempt at a factual claim.

Let's hope it doesn't come into force for the sake of the pub sector.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Oh fuck off you boring stuck record ****.

I will if you promise to donate your lungs to medical science.

 

[Phil1]

I think they (the government) will dilute it, personally.

I think they will follow through with the ban outside hospitals and sporting venues, but will either abandon or largely reduce the beer garden part of it. As I said though, even legislation that forces pubs and restaurants to have a dedicated non-smoking outside area would be great, with leaving scope for places that can, to offer both, with dedicated smoking areas.

Even the most ardent smoker shouldn’t complain about a ban outside hospitals. Sporting venues I presume have the choice unless council owned?

 

[BlueMoonRisin’]

I will if you promise to donate your lungs to medical science.

I can't. Already promised Hollands my lungs for their meat pies.

 

[BlueMoonRisin’]

Even the most ardent smoker shouldn’t complain about a ban outside hospitals. Sporting venues I presume have the choice unless council owned?

I'd like a designated smoking area within hospital grounds but if they banned it I'd be OK with it. I was actually glad when smoking in pubs and clubs was banned because I remember going in my local WM club and the air was so thick with smoke even I couldn't stand it. I never smoked on a plane because it's not fair for a non smoker to breathe in cigarette smoke in a confined space. I'm OK with all the places smoking is banned but banning it in a pub beer garden is a step too far I think.

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

Even the most ardent smoker shouldn’t complain about a ban outside hospitals. Sporting venues I presume have the choice unless council owned?

The nurses would probably complain

 

[Phil1]

I'd like a designated smoking area within hospital grounds but if they banned it I'd be OK with it. I was actually glad when smoking in pubs and clubs was banned because I remember going in my local WM club and the air was so thick with smoke even I couldn't stand it. I never smoked on a plane because it's not fair for a non smoker to breathe in cigarette smoke in a confined space. I'm OK with all the places smoking is banned but banning it in a pub beer garden is a step too far I think.

Hospital closest to me has an outdoor designated area. I suppose it’s a bit easier when you don’t get pissed wet through when heading to it..

 

[Phil1]

The nurses would probably complain

They’re too busy complaining (correctly) about the car park charges.

 

[BlueMoonRisin’]

Hospital closest to me has an outdoor designated area. I suppose it’s a bit easier when you don’t get pissed wet through when heading to it..

I have stood outside smoking like a wet through drowned rat and sometimes think I'm an idiot, but nicotine is that addictive that I carry on till I finish a cigarette, or until the rain extinguishes it.

 

[Coatigan]

Let's hope it doesn't come into force for the sake of the pub sector.

I disagree, but it has all been said pal.

If of interest, the following doesn't really prove anything (nor am I trying to) as it is one example, but others like it will exist.

Following the news I had a chat with a friend who manages a bar that I like. She is all for it, she thinks it would make their pub far better. They have a very small rear beer garden, which nobody uses for anything other than smoking, because nobody likes being in it any longer than they have to, when someone smokes. They tried lots of things, like putting plants and lighting outside, nice furniture etc, to make it more appealing to non smokers, but the size of it means it just takes one person to light up there and the rest can't avoid it. More than that, it affects the inside. The door to it is directly opposite the bar and all the staff hate the smell, just from the door opening and closing when people go for a smoke. The quizzmaster dude hates it, the chef hates it, and some of the regulars hate it, and joke it smells like a pre 2005 pub. They have put signs up to shut the door and regularly tell people off to not lean on it or leave it open, but it still comes through. The toilets also have high level windows that face out onto it so the smell gets in there too. The pub do great food, good selection of beer and drink, are better priced than other nearby pubs, and the staff are friendly. But they are not always that busy, and she is convinced that is largely to do with the beer garden and smoke smell from it. She is now trying to encourage the owner to make the beergarden non-smoking (they still have a front door where people could go smoke).

It will vary greatly from place to place, by size, users etc. But I don't think the argument that all pubs and the whole sector will suffer adds up.

 

[DiscoSteve]

I believe the aussies have it right, they enforce segregation of smoking areas from eating areas - it is f**king disgusting having to inhale second hand smoke while trying to eat!

 

[Phil1]

I have stood outside smoking like a wet through drowned rat and sometimes think I'm an idiot, but nicotine is that addictive that I carry on till I finish a cigarette, or until the rain extinguishes it.

It’s still quite popular in Spain to smoke though I’ve noticed the younger generation don’t seem to be as bad. I think it’ll die out naturally over time. Take a few years though.

 

[jimharri]

Even the most ardent smoker shouldn’t complain about a ban outside hospitals. Sporting venues I presume have the choice unless council owned?

Is the law the same in the UK, as it is over here re smoking being banned in the workplace? If it is, then sporting venues could arguably be described as workplaces. How many people are employed by City in the stadium on a matchday (not counting those outside the confines of the stadium; stewards, programme sellers, car parking staff)?

 

[Coatigan]

I believe the aussies have it right, they enforce segregation of smoking areas from eating areas - it is f**king disgusting having to inhale second hand smoke while trying to eat!

They also aren't allowed to smoke on beaches and in parks.

 

[MCFC Wirral]

I believe the aussies have it right, they enforce segregation of smoking areas from eating areas - it is f**king disgusting having to inhale second hand smoke while trying to eat!

I only tend to eat inside but wouldn’t want to eat in a beer garden when people are smoking.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

I disagree, but it has all been said pal.

If of interest, the following doesn't really prove anything (nor am I trying to) as it is one example, but others like it will exist.

Following the news I had a chat with a friend who manages a bar that I like. She is all for it, she thinks it would make their pub far better. They have a very small rear beer garden, which nobody uses for anything other than smoking, because nobody likes being in it any longer than they have to, when someone smokes. They tried lots of things, like putting plants and lighting outside, nice furniture etc, to make it more appealing to non smokers, but the size of it means it just takes one person to light up there and the rest can't avoid it. More than that, it affects the inside. The door to it is directly opposite the bar and all the staff hate the smell, just from the door opening and closing when people go for a smoke. The quizzmaster dude hates it, the chef hates it, and some of the regulars hate it, and joke it smells like a pre 2005 pub. They have put signs up to shut the door and regularly tell people off to not lean on it or leave it open, but it still comes through. The toilets also have high level windows that face out onto it so the smell gets in there too. The pub do great food, good selection of beer and drink, are better priced than other nearby pubs, and the staff are friendly. But they are not always that busy, and she is convinced that is largely to do with the beer garden and smoke smell from it. She is now trying to encourage the owner to make the beergarden non-smoking (they still have a front door where people could go smoke).

It will vary greatly from place to place, by size, users etc. But I don't think the argument that all pubs and the whole sector will suffer adds up.

You are right it means nothing. Data on pubs that closed after the smoking ban speaks volumes. They didn't thrive as you stated.