North Stand expansion - seating, ticketing etc

[.db.]

Agreed, but if you’re building an end designed with atmosphere in mind you want to keep “football tourists” out of there. GA+ and corporate areas attract none supporters more than other areas of the stadium.
I bet you don’t find many none Dortmund supporters in the yellow wall for instance.

The gentrification of the Etihad is being carried on with this new stand I’m afraid.

The whole of the rest of the Etihad, with its small tiers and a second tier that wraps around from 201-231, is ideal for all that guff with the football tourists, GA+ and all that attracts none supporters.

I sit in ESL1, for me, they can make all of ESL1 ‘[opposite the]Tunnel Club II’ and all second tier blocks from 201-231 GA+ but give me and 8,000 others cheap tickets in a full safe standing NSL2.

The one place that is being designed that groups a massive chunk of fans together, that in every single other football stadium in the world would be an dedicated atmopshere stand, at a stadium that is crying out for an dedicated atmosphere stand, at a club that hasn’t had a famous one for three decades, is not going to be a dedicated atmosphere stand.

Makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. What are City playing at?!

It’s the one area of the Etihad designed for atmosphere. Big deep roof, big deep stand, one huge tier, the only stand anywhere in the stadium that could be classed as something substantial that would give fans pride in being part of.

I’d be gutted if we missed this opportunity and just made it like everywhere else in the stadium.

 

[.db.]

I can't agree with that.

People who are sitting (whether on padded seats or not) are equally, if not more so, genuine blues who would be more than happy to hep join in the atmosphere. I'm not quite quite sure where this fallacy that only people who wish to stand are genuine blues and create an atmosphere comes from but it is nonsense of course.

Market the stand as an atmosphere end and, regardless of whether you wish to sit or stand, it will work.

Here’s an example of one of the problems with it…

Look at any decent atmosphere stand in Europe and the front is where all the flags are waved and where displays are central to. But in the new NSL2 there are rows of GA+ seats.

The equivalent GA+ seats the South Stand end of the stadium, do this when there’s a display on across the whole stand:



^ that whole chunk above where it says ‘Definitely Manchester’ were provided with white cards to hold up and didn’t bother.


And most of the time when there’s a display taking place, they don’t even bother getting to their seats so they make our displays look like a joke:



This is the sort of area that is front and centre of the NSL2 plans. It’s the antithesis to what people have been striving for.

Liverpool have just opened up a big new tier at their stadium similar to what City have described the expanded North Stand being like - a mish mash of loads of things without being anything in particular, and expensive as fuck… and it’s already affected the atmosphere at Anfield for the worse.

 

[jrb]

Here’s an example of one of the problems with it…

Look at any decent atmosphere stand in Europe and the front is where all the flags are waved and where displays are central to. But in the new NSL2 there are rows of GA+ seats.

The equivalent GA+ seats the South Stand end of the stadium, do this when there’s a display on across the whole stand:

View attachment 133690

^ that whole chunk above where it says ‘Definitely Manchester’ were provided with white cards to hold up and didn’t bother.


And most of the time when there’s a display taking place, they don’t even bother getting to their seats so they make our displays look like a joke:

View attachment 133691

This is the sort of area that is front and centre of the NSL2 plans. It’s the antithesis to what people have been striving for.

When City moved to the Etihad from MR my relocated seat was in block 215 on SSL2, which is now one of the hospitality blocks you highlighted. A lot of the fans in block 215 were from North stand, Block R, and other parts of the North stand. A lot of people knew each other, and were relocated together. 215 was a very vocal block, as most of SSL2 was then.

 

[Prophet of Doom]

Here’s an example of one of the problems with it…

Look at any decent atmosphere stand in Europe and the front is where all the flags are waved and where displays are central to. But in the new NSL2 there are rows of GA+ seats.

The equivalent GA+ seats the South Stand end of the stadium, do this when there’s a display on across the whole stand:

View attachment 133690

^ that whole chunk above where it says ‘Definitely Manchester’ were provided with white cards to hold up and didn’t bother.


And most of the time when there’s a display taking place, they don’t even bother getting to their seats so they make our displays look like a joke:

View attachment 133691

This is the sort of area that is front and centre of the NSL2 plans. It’s the antithesis to what people have been striving for.

Liverpool have just opened up a big new tier at their stadium similar to what City have described the expanded North Stand being like - a mish mash of loads of things without being anything in particular, and expensive as fuck… and it’s already affected the atmosphere at Anfield for the worse.

I’m sorry but holding a piece of cardboard up above your head before kick off is not creating an atmosphere.

Even if that actually floats your boat it’s done a couple of times a season whilst loads of supporters are finishing pints or still
queuing to get in the stadium.

An atmosphere is created by 4 sides of stadium singing, screaming and shouting throughout the game.

A couple of rows at the front of the new NS second tier is not going to affect that - and for the 100th time the new stand does not get built if there were no corporate or GA premium seats !

 

[Buckshaw Blue]

When City moved to the Etihad from MR my relocated seat was in block 215 on SSL2, which is now one of the hospitality blocks you highlighted. A lot of the fans in block 215 were from North stand, Block R, and other parts of the North stand. A lot of people knew each other, and were relocated together. 215 was a very vocal block, as most of SSL2 was then.

Agreed. I was one of those who went from block R Maine Road to 215/216 (can’t remember which) and the atmosphere was great to start with and gradually declined over time. Moved up to SSL3 and haven’t looked back.

 

[jrb]

A couple of rows at the front of the new NS second tier is not going to affect that - and for the 100th time the new stand does not get built if there were no corporate or GA premium seats !

100th time! That many?

Why do you keep on posting that? You don’t know that. Are you making that up, or has somebody high up at City told you that?

5 rows of GA+ seats at the front of NSL2 aren’t a North stand expansion deal breaker.

Where else is the corporate on NSL2?

There is a hotel, with hotel balconies, and a hotel restaurant, behind a floating 3rd tier. That isn’t corporate. Anyone can book a hotel room and use the restaurant. It doesn’t have to be on a match day.

 

[Beaker]

I’m sorry but holding a piece of cardboard up above your head before kick off is not creating an atmosphere.

Even if that actually floats your boat it’s done a couple of times a season whilst loads of supporters are finishing pints or still
queuing to get in the stadium.

An atmosphere is created by 4 sides of stadium singing, screaming and shouting throughout the game.

A couple of rows at the front of the new NS second tier is not going to affect that - and for the 100th time the new stand does not get built if there were no corporate or GA premium seats !

Why? Why can’t we expand corporate/GA premium seats in other areas of the stadium if the club believes demand is there and keep this stand solely for enhancing the atmosphere?

 

[jrb]

Agreed. I was one of those who went from block R Maine Road to 215/216 (can’t remember which) and the atmosphere was great to start with and gradually declined over time. Moved up to SSL3 and haven’t looked back.

Similar experience. I moved to 110 when that and 111 became the unofficial singing blocks. I then moved to 115 when the club made that the official singing block.

 

[jrb]

Why? Why can’t we expand corporate/GA premium seats in other areas of the stadium if the club believes demand is there and keep this stand solely for enhancing the atmosphere?

Exactly.

Is it really worth plonking 5 rows of GA+ seats at the front of NSL2?

How much extra is the club going to make over a season from those few hundred GA+ seats, compared to the thousands of GA seats behind them?

As you say, if the club wants to expand hospitality seating further across the Etihad, there will be plenty of opportunity to do that with 1000’s of fans relocating from all over the ground to the NS.

 

[jrb]

The real NS money making will be the hotel.

The average price for a good standard hotel room on Saturday in the city centre is roughly £150-£200 for 2 adults per room.

Times that figure by 400 rooms. Then add 2 match tickets on NSL2. A meal in the hotel restaurant. Or a hospitality package that includes all those things.

How much is that going to be, give or take, £300-£400, for 2 people.

 

[Elliot houghton]

Here’s an example of one of the problems with it…

Look at any decent atmosphere stand in Europe and the front is where all the flags are waved and where displays are central to. But in the new NSL2 there are rows of GA+ seats.

The equivalent GA+ seats the South Stand end of the stadium, do this when there’s a display on across the whole stand:

View attachment 133690

^ that whole chunk above where it says ‘Definitely Manchester’ were provided with white cards to hold up and didn’t bother.


And most of the time when there’s a display taking place, they don’t even bother getting to their seats so they make our displays look like a joke:

View attachment 133691

This is the sort of area that is front and centre of the NSL2 plans. It’s the antithesis to what people have been striving for.

Liverpool have just opened up a big new tier at their stadium similar to what City have described the expanded North Stand being like - a mish mash of loads of things without being anything in particular, and expensive as fuck… and it’s already affected the atmosphere at Anfield for the worse.

Yh The ones that spurs can do in their stand are very good. Some say it makes no difference but imagine being a player and coming out to something like this could only motivate you.

 

[PragueBlue]

I haven’t once suggested that people who don’t wish to stand aren’t genuine blues. It doesn’t matter whether you wish to sit, stand, if you are old, young, male or female, if you’re a blue you’re a blue. I’m simply saying that standing areas do create a better atmosphere, I don’t think that’s a controversial statement, our away ends are always stood and they create some of the best atmosphere’s in the country.

GA+ and corporate areas are where you’re most likely to find none City fans and football tourists who have got their hands on tickets, if you’re looking to create a stand for atmosphere you would make it as difficult as possible for these people to get in there. You only have to look above some of the displays 1894 have done pre match to see all the empties in the corporate section in SSL2, it takes away from the effect, the atmosphere, everything.

The club are seemingly going in a different direction to what a lot of us hoped with regards to this stand. That’s their prerogative, I’ll continue to disagree with it.

I really don't think standing or seated really would make much difference to the atmosphere and a mix is probably the best solution (though I do hope there will be a better ratio of standing to seating). The main thing is to make sure that it is marketed as the atmosphere end so people that choose to stand/sit there are likely to be people that want to join in.

The GA+ seats are (I think) hospitality rather than corporate and so again are likely to attract blues that want to join in but with a little extra comfort. I really don't see it as a problem if the seats go to existing or new season ticket holders. That would ensure that they are genuine blues.

 

[Coatigan]

Right so 3000 rail seats, possibly more, at the most acoustic end of the stand make no difference whatsoever, but 648 seats further down will kill the atmosphere? Ok.

 

[Coatigan]

A couple of rows at the front of the new NS second tier is not going to affect that - and for the 100th time the new stand does not get built if there were no corporate or GA premium seats !

100th time! That many?

Why do you keep on posting that? You don’t know that. Are you making that up, or has somebody high up at City told you that?

5 rows of GA+ seats at the front of NSL2 aren’t a North stand expansion deal breaker.

Where else is the corporate on NSL2?

There is a hotel, with hotel balconies, and a hotel restaurant, behind a floating 3rd tier. That isn’t corporate. Anyone can book a hotel room and use the restaurant. It doesn’t have to be on a match day.

It is possible the hotel rooms can be used as corporate/boxes on match days. The PA notes the rooms can be converted with beds stored away etc.
Not arguing your point which I mostly agree with, just adding that bit to the bottom.

 

[Prophet of Doom]

Exactly.

Is it really worth plonking 5 rows of GA+ seats at the front of NSL2?

How much extra is the club going to make over a season from those few hundred GA+ seats, compared to the thousands of GA seats behind them?

As you say, if the club wants to expand hospitality seating further across the Etihad, there will be plenty of opportunity to do that with 1000’s of fans relocating from all over the ground to the NS.

starting to think you are just on a wind up.

The reason they will use the new purpose built stand for hospitality and premium GA seating is that it’s purpose built with adequate space to provide the correct facilities required for the premium areas.

You can’t just change the odd vacated seats round the stadium to hospitality with no facilities or space to support them.

And yes I was told before the new stand was even announced that it wouldn’t be built without elements of hospitality and premium seats included.

You may think a few hundred GA premium seats are not a deal breaker but they had to be included.

If you want to know how much extra the club will make from them I would wait to see how much international fans are paying for them on a match by match basis - you will then understand why they were so important.

 

[Manchester33]

starting to think you are just on a wind up.

The reason they will use the new purpose built stand for hospitality and premium GA seating is that it’s purpose built with adequate space to provide the correct facilities required for the premium areas.

You can’t just change the odd vacated seats round the stadium to hospitality with no facilities or space to support them.

But then the point is it’s not an atmosphere stand…. It’s a purpose built hospitality stand.

Opportunity to create a brilliant atmosphere missed!

 

[Coatigan]

Exactly.

Is it really worth plonking 5 rows of GA+ seats at the front of NSL2?

How much extra is the club going to make over a season from those few hundred GA+ seats, compared to the thousands of GA seats behind them?

As you say, if the club wants to expand hospitality seating further across the Etihad, there will be plenty of opportunity to do that with 1000’s of fans relocating from all over the ground to the NS.

Not sure how apt the last paragraph is.

While I agree with the first two (said similar myself here and there), clearly the club think that area as proposed has a reason and some value. Beyond what would be a, what potential 2-5% increase in revenue a year?

Maybe they think it is an easier sell to new season ticket holders, or new members. Maybe an easier sell to a wider range of fans. I would have previously thought an easier sell to planning, but the latestest statement probably makes that unlikely now. Maybe they are thinking CL final future potential. Or maybe they see the way football is going and want to have that in now. Who knows, but one thing I would comfortably bet on, is that they are not putting it there just because they don't want an atmospheric end.

 

[blueparrot]

But then the point is it’s not an atmosphere stand…. It’s a purpose built hospitality stand.

Opportunity to create a brilliant atmosphere missed!

Nonsense not only are those seats no more than premium there are 0nly 700. If there is no atmosphere in that stand it won't be because of the 700 people payng a bit more ,people who will probably join in what the other 8000 are doing.

 

[Prophet of Doom]

But then the point is it’s not an atmosphere stand…. It’s a purpose built hospitality stand.

Opportunity to create a brilliant atmosphere missed!

If the 8000 supporters in the stand can’t create an atmosphere then that’s on them - not the 600 at the front of the stand.

People comparing the Spurs end are not making a fair comparison. Spurs had a purpose built stadium which allowed them to create the required hospitality space in the other stands and keep the end for atmosphere.

City haven’t got that option.They have kept the premium seats to the minimum which won’t make a difference to atmosphere.

How many singers will even relocate ? A couple of thousand maximum ?. The other 6000 seats will be taken by tourists, new fans or randoms or non regular fans.

Maybe some will see it as an opportunity missed - but the stand was built for commercial reasons not to take a gamble that atmosphere would improve.

 

[M18CTID]

If the 8000 supporters in the stand can’t create an atmosphere then that’s on them - not the 600 at the front of the stand.

People comparing the Spurs end are not making a fair comparison. Spurs had a purpose built stadium which allowed them to create the required hospitality space in the other stands and keep the end for atmosphere.

City haven’t got that option.They have kept the premium seats to the minimum which won’t make a difference to atmosphere.

How many singers will even relocate ? A couple of thousand maximum ?. The other 6000 seats will be taken by tourists, new fans or randoms or non regular fans.

Maybe some will see it as an opportunity missed - but the stand was built for commercial reasons not to take a gamble that atmosphere would improve.

Well if that's the case then maybe the club should make that clear rather than going big on the atmosphere line that they did last week in their statement. But then again, even if it was a full-on atmosphere stand with 8000 rail seats they'd still make a fuck ton of money out of it in the long-term.

As for your second last paragraph about the number of singers relocating, that will be dictated by the club and not by all those wishing to relocate as the numbers will surely be capped.