Kamala Harris

[TinFoilHat]

No. Cos Trump is a fascist ****.
It would appear J Lo has also worked that out.

Despite being born in the USA Trump would send her and everyone else to Puerto Rico.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Despite being born in the USA Trump would send her and everyone else to Puerto Rico.

Did I hear that Puerto Rico is a island of garbage?

No wonder he wants to send them all back.

 

[Frank the Yank]

Are you planning to vote for Trump?

And, if so, do you believe him having a second term would help you and your family? What about other people’s families?

Secret ballot.

I really don’t think a Trump second term would either help or hurt my family. If Harris gets in and passes a tax on unrealized gains, then yes that can hurt me financially. That would definitely hurt some members of my family who have more money than I do. Having said that they are hard core Democrats.

I don’t live my life relying on other people. I don’t enjoy having other people wielding power/ control over my destiny.

Having said that real wages in Trumps four years rose 8.2%. Under this administration they have risen 1%-US govt stats. Factor in that inflation has been raging the past four years compared to the previous four.

Add to this I haven’t received a raise in four years. The evil corporation that I work for a big Harris/Walz supporters. I know this to be true not only seeing the actions of my company but I know people VERY high up and this is definitely true.

 

[Frank the Yank]

Secret ballot.

I really don’t think a Trump second term would either help or hurt my family. If Harris gets in and passes a tax on unrealized gains, then yes that can hurt me financially. That would definitely hurt some members of my family who have more money than I do. Having said that they are hard core Democrats.

I don’t live my life relying on other people. I don’t enjoy having other people wielding power/ control over my destiny.

Having said that real wages in Trumps four years rose 8.2%. Under this administration they have risen 1%-US govt stats. Factor in that inflation has been raging the past four years compared to the previous four.

Add to this I haven’t received a raise in four years. The evil corporation that I work for a big Harris/Walz supporters. I know this to be true not only seeing the actions of my company but I know people VERY high up and this is definitely true.

 

[Frank the Yank]

Tried to upload something. Don’t know if it worked. I speak multiple languages but te h aint one of them..

 

[halfcenturyup]

The power of the army is a key factor.

True, but at least the army pledge allegiance to the monarch as you would expect, which is just as well as the police pledge allegiance to whoever pays them the most.

Anyway, as I said, wrong thread.

 

[SebastianBlue]

Secret ballot.

I really don’t think a Trump second term would either help or hurt my family. If Harris gets in and passes a tax on unrealized gains, then yes that can hurt me financially. That would definitely hurt some members of my family who have more money than I do. Having said that they are hard core Democrats.

I don’t live my life relying on other people. I don’t enjoy having other people wielding power/ control over my destiny.

Having said that real wages in Trumps four years rose 8.2%. Under this administration they have risen 1%-US govt stats. Factor in that inflation has been raging the past four years compared to the previous four.

Add to this I haven’t received a raise in four years. The evil corporation that I work for a big Harris/Walz supporters. I know this to be true not only seeing the actions of my company but I know people VERY high up and this is definitely true.

I appreciate the earnest response (it rarely happens on here these days).

I disagree with some of your points, especially those related to the economy and economic policy (as that is my field of study and expertise), but I am not sure there is much to be gained by debating them at this time.

I will just say that I don’t think a Harris presidency would be perfect or make absolutely everyone’s life better.

But I do think her presidency would be substantially more beneficial to not only most people in the US, but for the country in general, compared to Trump. And I do not think one can exaggerate how big an ‘utilitarianism gap’ I believe there is between Harris and Trump.

And as father of a newly minted American who will have to directly or indirectly deal with the direction the US takes over the next few decades as he grows to be an adult—one that I will very likely not be around to guide and support through that journey—what happens over the next week (and months, unfortunately) are very important to me. Especially given his mother will soon be his sole caregiver (she really nearly is already) and that will be made even more difficult if MAGA is allowed to gain control of the Presidency in addition to the Judiciary (and, I shudder to say, Congress) and are able to continue to strip rights away from women. And if he ends up being neurodivergent like me, and/or his gender or sexuality conflicts with what MAGA consider acceptable norms (which is essentially white straight neuroconforming cisgender male), his rights will also likely be limited, as well.

Fortunately, they have an escape route to several other countries due to our multi-citizenship status. But that requires a lot of upheaval, effort, money, and risk in of itself. So being forced in to that sort of action is pretty destructive, and most Americans will not have that option.

 

[I'm With Stupid]

No, not joking. By that metric, every country on earth was created by empire. How far back should we go to create the starting point?

The US literally still has overseas territories. What are they if not a product of a colonial past? And I don't mean the colonialism of creating the United States in the first place, I mean the colonialism that they engaged in once they became an established world power. Or are we to pretend that Guam has always had close ties to a territory nearly 7,000 miles away? And perhaps ask the people of the Philippines if the US has a colonial history. American Samoa? The US Virgin Islands? Puerto Rico? Hawaii? That's before we mention the various proxy wars and actual US invasions that have happened throughout history to ensure that people sympathetic to the US are ruling various territories. It's textbook colonialism.

Britain didn't rule India by just going over with an army and conquering it, they spent years first trading with them, building up armies to 'protect their trading routes' against colonial rivals, backing rulers who were friendly to the British, and eventually using military might to overthrow rulers who'd had enough of the British interfering in their country. Remind you of anyone else?

 

[west didsblue]

Secret ballot.

I really don’t think a Trump second term would either help or hurt my family. If Harris gets in and passes a tax on unrealized gains, then yes that can hurt me financially. That would definitely hurt some members of my family who have more money than I do. Having said that they are hard core Democrats.

I don’t live my life relying on other people. I don’t enjoy having other people wielding power/ control over my destiny.

Having said that real wages in Trumps four years rose 8.2%. Under this administration they have risen 1%-US govt stats. Factor in that inflation has been raging the past four years compared to the previous four.

Add to this I haven’t received a raise in four years. The evil corporation that I work for a big Harris/Walz supporters. I know this to be true not only seeing the actions of my company but I know people VERY high up and this is definitely true.

High inflation in the last 4 years was a consequence of the world economy taking a huge hit during 2020 and 2021. The recovery from Covid has fuelled inflation, which has been worse in countries that were hit hardest by Covid. Due to the Trump administration’s shambolic handling of the pandemic during 2020, US inflation was consequently higher in the aftermath. The current administration has done well to get it back under control and at the same time enable the economy to grow to reinforce its place as the world’s strongest economy by far. Electing Trump would put all this at risk because his economic policies and ideas are totally incoherent. Plenty of more important reasons not to vote for Trump that have already been widely discussed.

 

[SebastianBlue]

The US literally still has overseas territories. What are they if not a product of a colonial past? And I don't mean the colonialism of creating the United States in the first place, I mean the colonialism that they engaged in once they became an established world power. Or are we to pretend that Guam has always had close ties to a territory nearly 7,000 miles away? And perhaps ask the people of the Philippines if the US has a colonial history. American Samoa? The US Virgin Islands? Puerto Rico? Hawaii? That's before we mention the various proxy wars and actual US invasions that have happened throughout history to ensure that people sympathetic to the US are ruling various territories. It's textbook colonialism.

Britain didn't rule India by just going over with an army and conquering it, they spent years first trading with them, building up armies to 'protect their trading routes' against colonial rivals, backing rulers who were friendly to the British, and eventually using military might to overthrow rulers who'd had enough of the British interfering in their country. Remind you of anyone else?

@ChicagoBlue This is one of those topics you and I disagree on, as my view very much aligns with IWS’s take above.

The US was/is as much a colonial power as Britain or Spain, it just came along later (ironically as a direct product of colonialism) and is currently in a different phase of power. I can say that with authority being from, and having lived and studied history and economics (the driving force behind most all colonialism that has ever taken place), in all three nations.

I think it is important to acknowledge that, as well, because the only way to pull back from it is to accept that it is true and then earnestly assess what the US has done and how to make things right moving forward.

 

[ChicagoBlue]

Lots of senior folks on that crew. Come to EWR and fly with some juniors. Hope they treat you ok.

No, I wouldn’t commute either. Never have but I imagine it’s like another job!!

My commute is 15 mins, and I like most of the older ORD ladies. In fact, I bought dinner last night and breakfast this morning for the Purser on this trip, as we have flown together before and always got along famously.

And, no, it wasn’t breakfast in bed!!

 

[ChicagoBlue]

@ChicagoBlue This is one of those topics you and I disagree on, as my view very much aligns with IWS’s take above.

The US was/is as much a colonial power as Britain or Spain, it just came along later (ironically as a direct product of colonialism) and is currently in a different phase of power. I can say that with authority being from, and having lived and studied history and economics (the driving force behind most all colonialism that has ever taken place), in all three nations.

I think it is important to acknowledge that, as well, because the only way to pull back from it is to accept that it is true and then earnestly assess what the US has done and how to make things right moving forward.

We can agree to disagree. That’s the good thing about freedoms we enjoy!

 

[kaz7]

Do celebrity endorsements make much difference?

Springsteen, Beyonce, J-Lo, LeBron is pretty heavyweight.

Dont forget swifty , there has been a huge amount of younger people registering to vote

 

[Dax777]

Hard to say I am a trump supporter . I am more anti left.

My two big issues on this election are economic (mainly inflation especially since I have had a raise in four years) and immigration… illegal immigration and illegal immigrants in this country.

A few years ago the left mantra was “separated families”. Well my family has been separated for years since my adopted daughters have been waiting over 6 years to come here…

Amen to that!

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Dont forget swifty , there has been a huge amount of younger people registering to vote

Indeed. I think I saw Selena Gomez being provoked into saying something by the Puerto Rico 'comedian' - she's not a billionaire for nothing.

 

[KS55]

No, not joking. By that metric, every country on earth was created by empire. How far back should we go to create the starting point?

No, this is recent history and colours current US Politics. For example US was still fighting a colonial war in 1914. Consider the origins of the Electoral College. Consider the current attitudes towards black people in southern states. Native Americans on the reservations did not get a vote until Eisenhower. etc etc.

 

[lloydie]

I would agree that empires decline, but America has never been an empire, only a projection of strength with allied assistance. Military bases and lily pads have almost always been in “friendly” location, with a few notable exceptions, and the raison d’etre has not been to conquer and occupy, but rather to stop others from same.

Englands battles of the Middle Ages that helped create the Empire…and a long, much heralded Empire it was…became a burden England could not easily contain or maintain. America, on the other hand, has sought allies in the four corners of the globe from which friends can help protect friends.

Today, some might say the cost to maintain that reach and constrain potential enemies is too significant to continue to bear. Others might say it’s too significant NOT to bear.

We shall see which way the tension breaks. Let’s hope allied friendly democracies have the backbone for such difficult decisions.

I'm catching up so others may have already argued the point, but it's moot at best.

American imperialism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's record on regime change is at times has been despicable.

 

[lloydie]

Amen to that!

@Dax777, this is just for you. I don’t know quite why I’m bothering with this particularly boring bit of jurisprudence, perhaps I am hoping that you break the habit of a lifetime and accept you were wrong in your insistence that J6 was not an insurrection. My response is not particularly polished but I can’t be bothered to add lustre.
Your statement was ‘J6 was NOT an insurrection. It was a protest.’
INSURRECTION
An insurrection is an act or series of acts committed by an ORGANISED group with the PURPOSE of usurping the legitimate government or preventing it from taking office. An insurrection has various CHARACTERISTICS which are: the acts are illegal or unconstitutional, they are usually extra parliamentary, and they always include violence.
J6
Was there an organised group?
Two days after Biden won the 2020 election, lawyers acting for Trump hired a series of rooms at the Willard hotel in Washington to provide a place in which to plan the insurrection. Several high ranking Trump advisors attended meetings including Guiliani and John Eastman. Leaders of several militia such as the Proud Boys also attended meetings.
At the same time various meetings took place in several states and the plan to subvert the Electoral College by creating false certification documents was hatched.
The purpose of these documents was to replace the EC’s vote for Biden. with a vote declaring Trump the winner.
In the run up to J6 Trump attempted to persuade VP PENCE that he had the power to replace the genuine EC votes or to refer the vote
back to the states. So J6 was put together by an organised group.
METHODS.
The methods used included forgery, false declarations by the replacement EC voters, and the unconstitutional attempt to refer the vote back to the states.
Pence consulted the most prominent conservative Jurist, Judge Michael Luttig who advised that the VP had no power under the constitution to do anything other than tot up the EC Certificates and declare the result. So the methods used were illegal and unconstitutional.
J6 Violence.
The violence on J6 was not extempore but carefully planned at the Willard. The various militia groups were on the Ellipse specifically for that purpose as was Trump. He enjoined them to “Fight like hell or you won’t have a country” and to “Stop the Steal”. That is, their purpose was to prevent the legitimate government from taking office and replace it with Republican usurpers.
Failure.
Why did the insurrection fail?
First, the organisation of the false certificates was erratic. One state group forged the documents and then posted them in the US Mail.
The false certificates never reached the hands of the VP.
Second, Pence was persuaded by Luttig that he did not have the power to modify the EC vote in any way and he refused to do so.
Conclusion.
It is clear that this was an organised attempt to usurp to legitimate government using illegal, unconstitutional acts and violence. A classic insurrection.
Was it a protest?
A protest does not have the objective of usurping the government but rather attempts to persuade the gov to change policy. It is perfectly acceptable as a democratic action, though any associated violence is not.
It is clear that those who took part in J6 were not attempting to change any government policy. So it was not a protest.

So, I contend that J6 was an insurrection and that Dax is flat wrong.
Over to you @Dax777 .

I made some of the same points, & some others in the Kamala thread in reply to you, if you still disagree could you explain why?

Edit; @Dax777

 

[KS55]

I made some of the same points, & some others in the Kamala thread in reply to you, if you still disagree could you explain why?

I assume that is a question for @Dax777

 

[KS55]

I appreciate the earnest response (it rarely happens on here these days).

I disagree with some of your points, especially those related to the economy and economic policy (as that is my field of study and expertise), but I am not sure there is much to be gained by debating them at this time.

I will just say that I don’t think a Harris presidency would be perfect or make absolutely everyone’s life better.

But I do think her presidency would be substantially more beneficial to not only most people in the US, but for the country in general, compared to Trump. And I do not think one can exaggerate how big an ‘utilitarianism gap’ I believe there is between Harris and Trump.

And as father of a newly minted American who will have to directly or indirectly deal with the direction the US takes over the next few decades as he grows to be an adult—one that I will very likely not be around to guide and support through that journey—what happens over the next week (and months, unfortunately) are very important to me. Especially given his mother will soon be his sole caregiver (she really nearly is already) and that will be made even more difficult if MAGA is allowed to gain control of the Presidency in addition to the Judiciary (and, I shudder to say, Congress) and are able to continue to strip rights away from women. And if he ends up being neurodivergent like me, and/or his gender or sexuality conflicts with what MAGA consider acceptable norms (which is essentially white straight neuroconforming cisgender male), his rights will also likely be limited, as well.

Fortunately, they have an escape route to several other countries due to our multi-citizenship status. But that requires a lot of upheaval, effort, money, and risk in of itself. So being forced in to that sort of action is pretty destructive, and most Americans will not have that option.

Come to the UK! Healthcare free at the point of use. Discrimination on grounds of sexual orientation etc illegal, marry who you please of any sex. What more do you need? Oh, biggest tax hike in history this week. Sorry.