Pep Guardiola - 2024/25

[vmsuhail]

City in 20/21 after a shit 19/20

I'm sure back then this thread was full of really clever people saying such things like "past performance is no guarantee of future success" and "the game has left him behind."

We were nowhere near as bad as now in 19/20, we finished 2nd and scored 100 goals, conceded 35 goals which is less than 1 per game, won the League cup beating Manchester United in the semi-finals. In the CL, i think we won the group, and beat Real Madrid in the quarters before the disaster at Lyon.

 

[King Jay]

Calls for 5 subs during corona but refuses to change his line ups every time becsuse „ pep „ doesn’t make mistakes .. the staring line up he choose don’t need changes during the game

 

[madloaf]

City in 20/21 after a shit 19/20

I'm sure back then this thread was full of really clever people saying such things like "past performance is no guarantee of future success" and "the game has left him behind."

We weren't shit in 19/20. I don't think anyone was saying that. I think people just accepted that the scousers were having their one asterisked league title run.

This year, we're shit. If we finish 5th (possible) it's our worst season since 2009.

 

[OrigamiNinja]

If he had ideas about winning I cannot fathom why he started Gundogan. At least Kovacic offers some energy.

It would be interesting to see the G/A stats whilst Gundogan's been on the pitch this season.

The main problem of this current side is that the midfield isn’t fit for purpose. We have gone from having the best midfields in the world over the last decade, to a midfield that is barely top half of the Prem standard. This week is Gundos turn in the firing line. Next week it will be Kovacic or Bernies turn. The fact is, none of them are good enough. Kovacic has always been the bridesmaid but not the bride and Gundo/Bernie are past it.

We will win games because we have quality in other areas but the consistency we’ve had in previous years won’t be there with this midfield. Peps whole game plan is built on us having 70+% possession every game and this midfield cannot deliver that anymore. Once the possession stats start heading more towards 50/50, we are in the shit, because it means that the likes of Gundo (who can’t run) is spending half the game chasing the ball and he can’t do it.

IMO, our best bet with this current side would be to bypass the midfield as much as possible. Tell Kova, Gundo, Bernie that they are to sit in and stop being caught out of position 30 yards inside the opposition half. Have Eddie and our defenders play it longer and quicker (dare I say like Klopps scousers) and leave it to our front 4 to hit the opposition with pace and power.

This would go against Peps philosophy, so it won’t happen but if he keeps playing the way we are, we will continue to see the same inconsistencies from week to week, until he can buy us midfielders that can move.

 

[robbieh]

As someone said apart from the back 4 it was very difficult to work out the formation.
Where was Savinho playing, hardly noticed him?

 

[Txiki Txiki Bang Bang]

For the love of God can you please fire up the players when the odds are against them? Talking up your opponents before a fiery game has never worked for him here, he did it before the game against the dippers when they wrecked our coach and now this.

I don't know if anyone else in football would get away with this, even Mancini acknowledged that the team would fight till the end despite the rags points at the top of the table. Put up a fight for christ sake.

 

[Dogtanian]

So many players have let him down this season, it's supposed to be a steady decline for players not a cliff fall, this season will have hurt Pep and I bet he will put it right next season..treble again ole ole

 

[Father Paul]

So many players have let him down this season, it's supposed to be a steady decline for players not a cliff fall, this season will have hurt Pep and I bet he will put it right next season..treble again ole ole

I hope your right but fear he has come to the end of this road at least. Would not be surprised if he is off as originally planned in the summer. Regardless we are still 4 to 6 quality players shy of another treble. Ahh well it was good while it lasted.

 

[BlueMonkey79]

So many players have let him down this season, it's supposed to be a steady decline for players not a cliff fall, this season will have hurt Pep and I bet he will put it right next season..treble again ole ole

If he's hurting that much, why does he keep playing the same players that keep letting him down every week?

Gundo the prime example. I think sentiment has gotten into him this season.

Fuck sentiment!

It doesn't win you trophies. If he continues with the old guard we ain't making top 4. And as soon as we play anyone higher than the championship in the FA cup, that will be the end of that.

 

[Dogtanian]

I hope your right but fear he has come to the end of this road at least. Would not be surprised if he is off as originally planned in the summer. Regardless we are still 4 to 6 quality players shy of another treble. Ahh well it was good while it lasted.

6 titles in 8, he deserves nothing but love, affection and loyalty, a steady back 4, a fit again Rodri.and 3/4 new signings and we will be fine, the biggest job will be unloading some of the older players

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

I’m not attacking pep but what I am saying is he doesn’t get the criticism he should be getting because some of his set ups have been poor and his in game management this season has been non existent at times . We keep talking about this massive rebuild and pep will sort it but we are in a mess and unless pep stays longer than 2 seasons he he. He won’t finish the rebuild . Peps record cannot be touched and he has broken his hat many records but has we say to Man Utd fans who go on about past titles it’s history and we are now in the present . For the record we will never sack pep and rightly so but he does deserve criticism like every body else .

I think even at our best he was slow to make subs and we often mismanaged the latter stages of games, the difference now is that it is more exposed by poor results. I do think pep is stubborn, and sometimes has been undone by refusing to sacrifice his footballing principles to just get a result,but on balance he's been proved right a lot more than he's been proved wrong. I'm sure pullis or allardyce would be much more pragmatic ;-)

 

[thegoatsthegoat]

The worry is that history has shown that a lot of top managers burn out, run out of ideas or fizzle out.

23 he peaked, being innovative and finding a way for us to dominate football without playing any full backs. During this spell he has offered nothing to sure us up, make us harder to play through, to defend better. It is the same rinse and repeat and sticking with crap like Bernardo and Gundog. I don't want him gone, but when it looked like he might not renew I wasn't as gutted as many. I was looking forward to a new body in there, fresh ideas. Change isn't always a bad thing. He has credit in the bank to see this through but there hasn't been a single thing this season that fills me with confidence that he can do that. Time will tell, a strong, confident end to the season and picking up that FA cup we threw away last year would be a good start.

 

[simon23]

Anyone blaming Pep is literally the most fucking stupid or blind person with zero knowledge of football

It has been obvious all season that our midfield core that has taken us to the very top is finished -

KDB has been finished for 12 months - people need to not bury their heads in the sand about this. He cannot be relied upon - the amount of good performances this season can be counted on one hand....He cant run, cant tackle and cant/wont defend....Pep knows playing him leaves us down one man less defensively when we dont have the ball
Now you can say the same about Bernardo (to a slight lesser extent) and Gundo as well - that is the core of our midfield and without Rodri to add to it
There is literally no other options he has at this present moment of time.....
Grealish - Ive never rated him but that aint he point....there is something obviously going on with him (off the pitch probably) and at present he aint available one way or another.

Stones - is finished - he cant stay fit - we cant afford to have him int he squad anymore as he is never on the pitch....
Ake - as above with Stones.
Walker - gone and done -

Now thats the core of the defence as well

We dont have the physicality on the pitch anymore

Now someone tell everyone else how this changes without significant transfer investment - answer is it doesnt...

We are at the start of the rebuild....

NO manager in the world can change any of the above - its the end of an era....accept this - the signs were there last season.

Pep needs the chance to rebuild his team - now this is where the ONLY criticism of Pep can be levelled - did he refuse a rebuild in the summer - he has said he did but is this Pep protecting the club or is it true - if it is then yes there is criticism BUT its one mistake in a huge era of success. But then you also have to look at the people above him for that as well then including Khaldoon and Txixi - the whole set up dropped the ball in my opinion when we won the treble -that was the moment to start again.....and we laboured for another season and us winning the title last year papered over the significant obvious cracks - again KDB, Walker, Stones, Grealish - all poor in that last year

Pep deserves every ounce of support from EVERY fan - anything beyond this and those people need to fuck off - yes there is criticism of him (as pointed out by the potential refusal of rebuild) - but its one season in a decade of unparalleled success....IF there are fans saying that he should go you need to fucking grow up and stop acting like spoilt children - pathetic fucking losers.

 

[Gaz (FMwkdsoul)]

We're back/He's gotta go within the space of 3 days, so over reactionary. lol

 

[Txiki Txiki Bang Bang]

Anyone blaming Pep is literally the most fucking stupid or blind person with zero knowledge of football

It has been obvious all season that our midfield core that has taken us to the very top is finished -

KDB has been finished for 12 months - people need to not bury their heads in the sand about this. He cannot be relied upon - the amount of good performances this season can be counted on one hand....He cant run, cant tackle and cant/wont defend....Pep knows playing him leaves us down one man less defensively when we dont have the ball
Now you can say the same about Bernardo (to a slight lesser extent) and Gundo as well - that is the core of our midfield and without Rodri to add to it
There is literally no other options he has at this present moment of time.....
Grealish - Ive never rated him but that aint he point....there is something obviously going on with him (off the pitch probably) and at present he aint available one way or another.

Stones - is finished - he cant stay fit - we cant afford to have him int he squad anymore as he is never on the pitch....
Ake - as above with Stones.
Walker - gone and done -

Now thats the core of the defence as well

We dont have the physicality on the pitch anymore

Now someone tell everyone else how this changes without significant transfer investment - answer is it doesnt...

We are at the start of the rebuild....

NO manager in the world can change any of the above - its the end of an era....accept this - the signs were there last season.

Pep needs the chance to rebuild his team - now this is where the ONLY criticism of Pep can be levelled - did he refuse a rebuild in the summer - he has said he did but is this Pep protecting the club or is it true - if it is then yes there is criticism BUT its one mistake in a huge era of success. But then you also have to look at the people above him for that as well then including Khaldoon and Txixi - the whole set up dropped the ball in my opinion when we won the treble -that was the moment to start again.....and we laboured for another season and us winning the title last year papered over the significant obvious cracks - again KDB, Walker, Stones, Grealish - all poor in that last year

Pep deserves every ounce of support from EVERY fan - anything beyond this and those people need to fuck off - yes there is criticism of him (as pointed out by the potential refusal of rebuild) - but its one season in a decade of unparalleled success....IF there are fans saying that he should go you need to fucking grow up and stop acting like spoilt children - pathetic fucking losers.

Your argument doesn't actually defend Pep, if anything those points mentioned puts him in a bad position. He is the manager, meaning he manages the team and oversees the decisions made by or for the team.

If I was going to make a counter argument, I would ask:

why has the manager failed to move the players you mentioned on if they are no longer able to perform at the required level?

Why did the manager decide to bring a player back from a much less physical league in Spain to an aggressive league that requires a lot of physicality and athleticism?

Why did the manager approve the signing of a player who has underperformed through out his time here for such an astronomical amount?

I understand the need to defend Pep and I also made a post about it a few weeks ago, but if you are going to defend Pep then at least provide a better argument. Your argument is similar to me buying a car then complaining that I can't drive it as it is too fast and I had no idea how fast it was.

Saying Pep is not to blame and then placing the blame on the team management/ Transfer market decision that he has made makes Pep look inept.

 

[supercity88]

Ancelotti is a better manager as he adapts to the players at his disposal.

He's not a better manager at all. He's won 6 league titles since he became a manager in 1995. He won it once with Milan in 8 seasons. He has won the PL once. He won the Bundesliga once with Bayern before getting sacked. He won Ligue 1 once with PSG in the 18 months he was there - they should have won it in his first season.

He's a cup manager. That's where he's excelled. 5 European Cups as a manager. But that's still in a considerably lot longer managerial career than Pep.

He's more flexible, he approaches a game to win it no matter what rather than with a style or philosophy underpinning the approach.

Pep's biggest weakness for me is that he adapts his approach slightly in the CL. He always sees controlling games as a way of winning them, but he is also more likely to make minor tweaks to plan for the opposition's threats in Europe. I've often felt that's added unnecessary pressure on the players - making them concentrate more on the risks rather than going out and playing how we do week in week out in the league, putting teams to the sword.

 

[B\connellblue]

Leaving everything else to one side, The style of play is truly awful to watch now . Saturday was a breath of fresh air when we were more direct , last night not one shot mustered until the 75th minute. Possession for the sake of it blows my mind.( At that stage we had just as much of the ball as they had.)We only end up getting turned over anyway. Pace!!!
Maybe Pep can change , the question is does he want to?

 

[simon23]

Your argument doesn't actually defend Pep, if anything those points mentioned puts him in a bad position. He is the manager, meaning he manages the team and oversees the decisions made by or for the team.

If I was going to make a counter argument, I would ask:

why has the manager failed to move the players you mentioned on if they are no longer able to perform at the required level?

Why did the manager decide to bring a player back from a much less physical league in Spain to an aggressive league that requires a lot of physicality and athleticism?

Why did the manager approve the signing of a player who has underperformed through out his time here for such an astronomical amount?

I understand the need to defend Pep and I also made a post about it a few weeks ago, but if you are going to defend Pep then at least provide a better argument. Your argument is similar to me buying a car then complaining that I can't drive it as it is too fast and I had no idea how fast it was.

Saying Pep is not to blame and then placing the blame on the team management/ Transfer market decision that he has made makes Pep look inept.

But Pep doesnt have overall say completely on his own...thats Txixi and Khaldoon as well....yes pep is responsible in part for some of it as i said before and i did say it was the one area of criticism that could be levelled at him - however those issues are not sortable in one transfer window...

There may have been financial constraints that we are unaware of as well -

there may have been also perception issues (as in thecub being worried about huge spends with thecloud of 115 charges hanging over us - we know for a fact that the club are very aware of public perception and that is everything to them and has been since day one - hence the very easy going/almost soft approach to the very pubic attacks by all and sundry over the last 15 years with us seemingly and at least publically taking it on the chin and not really reacting

The signing of gundo was mistake - but how do we know that Pep pushed for that...he probably needed an extra body and at the time when it was looking like we were getting no one he probably thought someone is better than no one and better the devil you know.

I think the other player you are talking about it Grealish (astronomical ammount?) - I agree on this one...I said at the time it was a big mistake and NOTHING has ever changed my mind on him - overrated and overhyped like most English players. BUT the amount was not controlled by Pep and the signing wouldnt have been purely down to him....again Txixi would have been a driver here...we know how it works with him and Txixi on transfers -

Im not saying Pep is blameless and in my OP pointed out where blame can be attributed which is where I agree with you) - however I was more commenting on the knee jerk ungrateful minorty of our fan base saying he should go after last night....he needs the chance to rebuild with time - it will take more than one summer transfer window

 

[BlueMonkey79]

Couldnt have said it any better. Long gone are the days when this team relied on pace and power. Pep would rather have the current Gundo than Prime Yaya Toure because Gundo is a good boy.

Pace and power is what is undoing us this season. We have none. The opposition have plenty.

It's like fighting a war with spud guns.

 

[hilts]

Pace and power is what is undoing us this season. We have none. The opposition have plenty.

It's like fighting a war with spud guns.

Calm down we haven't gone full Tottenham just yet.