EU referendum

EU referendum

  • In

    Votes: 503 47.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 547 52.1%
  • Total voters
    1,050
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BigJoe#1 said:
But the Tory Government is sponsoring the remain campaign with £9.3m to fund remain leaflets... That's more than £7m.

If the government choose to get involved surely, in the name of fairness and democracy they should present a balanced view... shouldn't they?
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Which is why they are giving the out team the Same amount of cash.

It does suck though, if they wanted to present facts they should have presented non biased facts.
 
grunge said:
Which is why they are giving the out team the Same amount of cash.

It does suck though, if they wanted to present facts they should have presented non biased facts.
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They aren't giving Out the same amount of cash. Both sides will get £7m to spend between when the campaigns officially start on the 15th of April (http://www.electoralcommission.org....7773/EU-Campaigner-Update-6-February-2016.pdf) until polling day.

Here, In have had an extra £9.3m spent on them before that official campaign start date, under the guise of providing everyone in the country the 'facts' of EU membership. As it is, it is quite clearly material that would influence an otherwise uneducated reader to vote In because it is presenting opinions in that direction as facts.
 
CityStu said:
They aren't giving Out the same amount of cash. Both sides will get £7m to spend between when the campaigns officially start on the 15th of April (http://www.electoralcommission.org....7773/EU-Campaigner-Update-6-February-2016.pdf) until polling day.

Here, In have had an extra £9.3m spent on them before that official campaign start date, under the guise of providing everyone in the country the 'facts' of EU membership. As it is, it is quite clearly material that would influence an otherwise uneducated reader to vote In because it is presenting opinions in that direction as facts.
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Someone on here said the gov had said they were upping the outs cash inline with this.

Just trying to validate.
 
grunge said:
Someone on here said the gov had said they were upping the outs cash inline with this.

Just trying to validate.
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Nope. I'm pretty sure that each side will get £7m after campaigning officially starts. This is extra.
 
Just imagine what Cameron would be saying if Vladimir Putin sent out a state funded "factsheet" on some issue affecting Russia prior to a referendum.

I can remember back in the seventies when Wilson, Callaghan and Thatcher would all criticise eastern bloc states for their government propaganda. Funny how times change.
 
grunge said:
Someone on here said the gov had said they were upping the outs cash inline with this.

Just trying to validate.
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I can't find any reference to this? Look, it's perfectly possible to be pro-EU but to agree that this is unfair. Do I agree with everything the Leave side say? No, and if the roles were reversed I'd be unhappy that the referendum campaign could be seen as being skewed with taxpayer funded propaganda. You either agree that it's wrong or you don't.
Meanwhile, the dutch become the latest nation to reject the EU in a referendum as the population of Europe send another message to the political elite. No matter, this one will be ignored as all previous referendums have, but a UK vote to leave is not so easily ignored. Far from the leave side being isolationalist, there are freedom loving people across Europe looking to the British to grow some balls and show some leadership, and unless there is a serious attempt by the EU to address issues of sovereignty, democracy and the role of the nation state, others will surely follow our lead.
 
hgblue said:
I can't find any reference to this? Look, it's perfectly possible to be pro-EU but to agree that this is unfair. Do I agree with everything the Leave side say? No, and if the roles were reversed I'd be unhappy that the referendum campaign could be seen as being skewed with taxpayer funded propaganda. You either agree that it's wrong or you don't.
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If its extra, and its biased then its very bad, there should be even spending by the gov for both sides.
If its extra, and its non biased facts then its fine,
If they give the same amount to the other side then its fine.

I've only seen one person on here say they are giving the 9 million extra to the out campaign too, and I cant find anything online about it so its probably a mistake.
 
Chancy Termites said:
Just imagine what Cameron would be saying if Vladimir Putin sent out a state funded "factsheet" on some issue affecting Russia prior to a referendum.

I can remember back in the seventies when Wilson, Callaghan and Thatcher would all criticise eastern bloc states for their government propaganda. Funny how times change.
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I am sure Vlad will have found a way to fund the out campaign already - I wonder what Cameron will think about that
 
And what about the millions of pounds being spent by the Sun, Times, Telegraph, Mail and Express to spread misinformation? Probably much more than £9.3m. If I was swimming against that shit tide, I want to put out something to counter it.
 
jimbopm said:
And what about the millions of pounds being spent by the Sun, Times, Telegraph, Mail and Express to spread misinformation? Probably much more than £9.3m. If I was swimming against that shit tide, I want to put out something to counter it.
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The millions of pounds spent by those papers is not public money. Nobody has kicked off at the Guardian, for example, for writing in defence of the EU.

But when the government are using my taxes to tell me how they think I should vote in, what they claimed was, a fair, unbiased referendum, I get a bit cheesed off.
 
CityStu said:
The millions of pounds spent by those papers is not public money. Nobody has kicked off at the Guardian, for example, for writing in defence of the EU.

But when the government are using my taxes to tell me how they think I should vote in, what they claimed was, a fair, unbiased referendum, I get a bit cheesed off.
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Are you aware how much £9.3m is in the context of all of public expenditure?

We should be commending Whitehall for designing, producing and distributing a document that will cost approx 15p/head!
 
jimbopm said:
Are you aware how much £9.3m is in the context of all of public expenditure?

We should be commending Whitehall for designing, producing and distributing a document that will cost approx 15p/head!
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Of course I'm aware but that's not the point is it?
  • The government work for me, not I for them. I resent them charging me to tell me what to do - I should be telling them what to do as that's how it works.
  • The In campaign has had an unfair advantage in effectively having its campaign being run for an additional week whilst Out are barred from campaigning.
  • It's also unfair that this In document be dressed up as an impartial fact sheet when it contains no facts.
  • It's unfair that the In campaign has now had 230% of the budget that the Out campaign will get.
Although there is an argument that when the government are slashing public services here there and everywhere, that £9m could have been better spent. It's like burning a fiver in front of a homeless person - not that much in the grand scheme of things, just a bit sick.
 
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CityStu said:
Of course I'm aware but that's not the point is it?
  • The government work for me, not I for them. I resent them charging me to tell me what to do - I should be telling them what to do as that's how it works.
  • The In campaign has had an unfair advantage in effectively having its campaign being run for an additional week whilst Out are barred from campaigning.
  • It's also unfair that this In document be dressed up as an impartial fact sheet when it contains no facts.
  • It's unfair that the In campaign has now had 230% of the budget that the Out campaign will get.
Although there is an argument that when the government are slashing public services here there and everywhere, that £9m could have been better spent. It's like burning a fiver in front of a homeless person - not that much in the grand scheme of things, just a bit sick.
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I don't see how the government is telling you what to do. They are not handcuffing you and dragging you to the polling station to get you to vote remain! First you read the leaflet and then if you've got any brains in your head you do a bit of research and fact checking.

This whole referendum is unfair! I certainly feel that way. I mean I don't find it fair that I have to see Nigel Farage, Michael Gove and Boris Johnson on my TV seemingly every 5 minutes talking nonsense. I also don't think it's fair that the spearhead of the campaign I support happens to be one of the most loathsome PM/Chancellor duos in the history of politics.

As for £9m as whether it could be better spent, that depends on your point of view. If that £9m saves us many times that amount by keeping us in the EU then I wouldn't call that a waste of money.
 
This goes so far beyond bias as to raise serious questions in anyone who is genuinely undecided, this is not the "Government" who are made up of many who want out, but a small inner circle of prominent "Stay in" politicians, run any of their names in a search for connections to Goldman Sachs and you will see a very disturbing pattern ( Do the same with the EU bigwigs if you want to see a fuller picture).

Nor is it just on the visible campaign, anyone who thinks the BBC is unbiased as it should be, ask yourself why there has been NO coverage of any kind on the Dutch telling the EU to f*ck its self, you could just put it down to the 3 billion in funding it received from the EU (Against its charter), or compare how the stories they do show are spun rather than factual.
 
jimbopm said:
I don't see how the government is telling you what to do. They are not handcuffing you and dragging you to the polling station to get you to vote remain! First you read the leaflet and then if you've got any brains in your head you do a bit of research and fact checking.

This whole referendum is unfair! I certainly feel that way. I mean I don't find it fair that I have to see Nigel Farage, Michael Gove and Boris Johnson on my TV seemingly every 5 minutes talking nonsense. I also don't think it's fair that the spearhead of the campaign I support happens to be one of the most loathsome PM/Chancellor duos in the history of politics.

As for £9m as whether it could be better spent, that depends on your point of view. If that £9m saves us many times that amount by keeping us in the EU then I wouldn't call that a waste of money.
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They are suggesting what I do by presenting the case of staying in the EU in a biased manner. Yes, people should do their own research but many won't.

Tough cookies. A majority of voters at the last GE voted for a referendum so a referendum we shall have. It's obviously a huge issue so it gets airtime, as do the people who are passionate about either cause. I'm sorry that you don't like their faces but I find that incredibly trivial in the face of a democratic decision.

And what if we'd save more by not being in the EU? The In campaign are awfully fond of presenting their opinions as facts and by your comment, it seems endemic.
 
blueonblue said:
This goes so far beyond bias as to raise serious questions in anyone who is genuinely undecided, this is not the "Government" who are made up of many who want out, but a small inner circle of prominent "Stay in" politicians, run any of their names in a search for connections to Goldman Sachs and you will see a very disturbing pattern ( Do the same with the EU bigwigs if you want to see a fuller picture).

Nor is it just on the visible campaign, anyone who thinks the BBC is unbiased as it should be, ask yourself why there has been NO coverage of any kind on the Dutch telling the EU to f*ck its self, you could just put it down to the 3 billion in funding it received from the EU (Against its charter), or compare how the stories they do show are spun rather than factual.
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...U-the-vampire-squid-commands-you-to-stay.html
 
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