EU referendum

[BigJoe#1]

That's probably the point that stoner was making a dozen people making 90% of the posts all locked in to their thinking.

Acknowledging Stonerblue is probably referring to me, I might suggest that it applies to you too. BIG TIME!

 

[blueonblue]

I read that as a post of a person who doesn't believe in multiculturalism, doesn't believe in economic freedom and believes in fear and retreating to the past and opening up the future

Leaving aside the nonsense you slip in on "Multiculturalism" for a moment lets look at economic freedom shall we, please point me in the direction of any statement where I have not advocated the economic freedom to trade with anyone, while its you that defends the EU position that restricts trade without preset conditions.
The remain campaign as well as your postings are based on fear and opposition to opening up the future by trading with the world rather than a small part of it.
Freedom of labour is a far cry from undermining pay, job security, and working conditions, and again look at who exactly it benefits, because it aint the workers.

Now lets go back to your utter drivel that multiculturalism has any part in this shall we ?, I advocate we deal with the whole world, that we bring in the skills we need from the whole world, explain the conflict with multiculturalism in that, or get your hands up that its no more than the usual lefty bullshite of implied racism because you can not come up with a logical answer

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

What you talk about goes against the facts though as a % of the world economy and in terms of growth Western Europe , USA etc are falling back and have done so for some time and will continue to do so, while consumption , growth, increasing size of middle class drives more power into the poor countries you deride. The world is pivoting back to Asia which has dominated GDP for all but the last 100 or so years and will dominate again soon. your view of the world is dated, there is nothing to be well meaning about its just the inevitable happening

We agree on this. Have been lucky enough to go to Korea Shanghai Hong Kong and Singapore and what you see is just amazing confidence and growth. It's crackers actually and overwhelming

Even in this region though there has been masses of migration of people and exploitation of people from weaker countries which is not good.

From a population management and environmental point of view having people moving freely around the globe is madness. We have loads of people migrating to areas of dominance with no control is not good from an environmental point of view and not good from a long term view of the receiving country and the outgoing country. Free movement of labour can have massive long term effects. Australia and New Zealand recognised this early on.

There are riots in Greece, I think they would like a referendum but I am afraid the economic damage is now done and they are between a rock and a hard place.

I just think free movement of labour is great if you are the one moving but if you are loyal and staying you just see what is left getting worse and worse and wonder whether your loyalty was a good thing after all and you should have just pissed off ages ago like everyone else..

 

[EalingBlue2]

Acknowledging Stonerblue is probably referring to me, I might suggest that it applies to you too. BIG TIME!

Absolutely it does!

 

[EalingBlue2]

We agree on this. Have been lucky enough to go to Korea Shanghai Hong Kong and Singapore and what you see is just amazing confidence and growth. It's crackers actually and overwhelming

Even in this region though there has been masses of migration of people and exploitation of people from weaker countries which is not good.

From a population management and environmental point of view having people moving freely around the globe is madness. We have loads of people migrating to areas of dominance with no control is not good from an environmental point of view and not good from a long term view of the receiving country and the outgoing country. Free movement of labour can have massive long term effects. Australia and New Zealand recognised this early on.

There are riots in Greece, I think they would like a referendum but I am afraid the economic damage is now done and they are between a rock and a hard place.

I just think free movement of labour is great if you are the one moving but if you are loyal and staying you just see what is left getting worse and worse and wonder whether your loyalty was a good thing after all and you should have just pissed off ages ago like everyone else..

You make your choice and you live with your choice, many people stay because that is what they want to do and how they enjoy life and get The most from it. But all in all of you make your decisions and take responsibility for them

 

[EalingBlue2]

Leaving aside the nonsense you slip in on "Multiculturalism" for a moment lets look at economic freedom shall we, please point me in the direction of any statement where I have not advocated the economic freedom to trade with anyone, while its you that defends the EU position that restricts trade without preset conditions.
The remain campaign as well as your postings are based on fear and opposition to opening up the future by trading with the world rather than a small part of it.
Freedom of labour is a far cry from undermining pay, job security, and working conditions, and again look at who exactly it benefits, because it aint the workers.

Now lets go back to your utter drivel that multiculturalism has any part in this shall we ?, I advocate we deal with the whole world, that we bring in the skills we need from the whole world, explain the conflict with multiculturalism in that, or get your hands up that its no more than the usual lefty bullshite of implied racism because you can not come up with a logical answer

That not what you said though is it , you wrote about immigrants filling schools, bringing down wages , straining hospitals and all the usual stuff..... I don't alledge racism you have done that, it reads more like a Luddite desire for a past that's gone or a selfish desire to deny others opportunity to make your own easier? If people come here or there and make companies more productive and do a better job, pay tax to help maintain the unfunded elderly then good on them , if I need to lift my game so be it but fear and blame certainly won't do anyone any good

As for the lefty thing how comical I am defending capitalism and the basic principle of the free movement of labour. You are defending closing shops and protecting markets by denying labour competition - who is the leftie?

 

[blueonblue]

No thats not what I said though is it ?, since when has MASS immigration equated to multiculturalism, again straight out of the little leftie play book with the deliberate fogging on the huge difference between immigration and MASS immigration (I used capitals so you can pick up the word you keep missing ).

If it preaches like a leftie, talks shite it can not defend like a leftie, then its usually a leftie

 

[Monkfish]

The remain campaign as well as your postings are based on fear and opposition to opening up the future by trading with the world rather than a small part of it.

yeah the EU stops us exporting to the rest of the world, just like it stops Germany exporting to the rest of the world ....oh wait

 

[BigJoe#1]

yeah the EU stops us exporting to the rest of the world, just like it stops Germany exporting to the rest of the world ....oh wait

It does though, it prevents us from striking individual or bilateral agreements with countries outside the EU. We can only negotiate with countries outside the EU through the EU.

Still, the fact that the EU mergers committee can rule whether or not O2 and Three can merge in the UK does not sit right with me - regardless of whether or not I think the decision is correct, which incidentally I do. It should be up to the UK to make those decisions for itself, shouldn't it? Do the EU have the same stipulations and considerations as we might have?

 

[EalingBlue2]

No thats not what I said though is it ?, since when has MASS immigration equated to multiculturalism, again straight out of the little leftie play book with the deliberate fogging on the huge difference between immigration and MASS immigration (I used capitals so you can pick up the word you keep missing ).

If it preaches like a leftie, talks shite it can not defend like a leftie, then its usually a leftie

I think you have very little grasp of what left and right is, beyond a lazy Daily Mail stereotype. The left has often been more anti immigration than the right , has been far more protective of labour and against the free flow than the right and just as intolerant of groups , religions etc as the right. I think you confuse tolerance, progressiveness, liberal ideals with the left and conservative , intolerance , protectionism with the right. There are huge chunks of both the left and right who would fervently share the opposite view than which you espouse to them.

Little englanders , those who panic about immigration , those who seek to be isolationist or protectionist and those who hark for a past that is long gone come from both left and right and actually I see your views on here as quite lefty. UKIP are quite left in some ways and in many ways the far right or Tories and labour are much closer than they think and the left of the Tories and right of labour are far closer than they would admit.

That is reality but it doesn't confirm to lazy stereotype a hole I admit to falling into pm here by associating brexit with the right which is true on the face of it based on supporters but won't reflect the actual voters