On top of which , there may be businesses that currently do not trade with EU countries , but may wish to do so in the future , but will now find it more difficult being in a non EU country.This type of post perfectly encapsulates the dishonesty of politics today, the Brexit campaign keeps using that 90% and uses it in a way to imply that 90% export outside EU only 10% within. Now in this figure as I understand it they count businesses all as equal so rolls Royce and a two man window cleaning company count as the same, they also count all the companies - which is the vast majority that don't export at all. So local cabbies, shops etc whose sole role is domestic and are small businesses are wrapped up in a statistic.
The vast majority of businesses do not export anything anywhere (other than the odd tourist pound spent - of which no one would know if EU or not) also it discounts the fact that on the open market, with free trade and access directly EU exports will always be under reported anyway.
Basically what you want is socialism , I have a lot of sympathy with that view but it won't happen as long as people buy what is cheapest and often best rather than buying something purely because it's British. Leaving the EU will only make that worse as it will open us up even more to competition from cheaper less regulated and more competitive marketsI have being saying for years that globalization is simply a process where big business moves its manufacturing jobs to the lowest cost countries because they have the lowest cost workers,this does not benefit home workers. Ultimately home manufacturers are driven out of business as they lose the race to the lowest cost of production and home workers lose their jobs. This is also a huge issue in the US right now where vast numbers of US jobs have been lost, Apple manufactures in China and sells back into the US, this benefits Apple shareholders but not US workers. The same is true closer to home where the average annual wage in Poland is £9,000 and is £27,000 here, how can UK workers compete when the biggest cost is labour? Companies looking to cut costs and invest in low cost production sites move investment and production to Poland, I know because I used to work for a UK business that did exactly this with jobs lost in the UK. We need more manufacturing jobs here in the UK but this guy with a printers will not survive long term, I bought print 20 years ago when the vast majority of printing was done within the UK by well paid printers who spent their earnings in the UK, not by low cost Chinese printers who spend nothing in our economy.
I've met and talked t a few boat people in Australia and they are generally coming from less dangerous places in Syria. My general perspective was two fol - one, that if you have absolutely nothing to lose the downside of drowning trying to do something is not that great if you gave death, oppression, disease and have no hope and secondly that people do not have access to perfect or even good information so the promise of what they will get and the ease of the trip is not perhaps fully understood.
On top of which , there may be businesses that currently do not trade with EU countries , but may wish to do so in the future , but will now find it more difficult being in a non EU country.
What claptrap the out voice is ten times as shrill and dramatic which is why we hear much more from the outersAnyone who publicly outs themselves (pardon the pun) to vote leave gets lambasted and ridiculed as all sorts of nasty, the same way anyone who confessed to be a Conservative voter in the last election was subjected to the same treatment and look how it turned out. A mere observation and just my own opinion, but I agree with you there about these polls; many people are keeping their true intentions hidden due to how spiteful and nasty the debate has become.
Switzerland had a legally binding referendum on introducing limits to inward eu migration in 2014 which they won and the eu told them to fuck off - they're still trying to sort it out now
I doubt leaving would make any difference - in fact it could harm as why would Europe help in dealing with the problems caused by Anglo Franco US wars and power game. Germany is already having to deal with the outcome of adventures in Iraq and Syria which they played very little role in and we were key. I suspect we would see I'm the English Channel what happens in Italy now if Europe decided not to assist at all in stopping the flows of refugees across Europe or even quietly encouraged going to Britain. As it is that won't happen as we, even with an out vote will accept all the free movement of labour in Europe anyway as we will have to.I imagine because a lot of them come from wartorn/backward places that they do don't have have ability to question the traffickers 'promises'. Similar to poor Eastern European girls with promises of 'modelling' jobs which lead to prostitution
So, that said, they have my sympathy. However, there seems very little appetite/ability for the EU to stop this (seemingly) constant flow which not only endangers the UK population but the residence on the continent and the migrants themselves
If we left, we would surely have the autonomy to make out own descions on who we let in/don't let in but also how we defend(for want of a better word) our coastline
I appreciate the in/out debate is not a one issue vote but it matters
so why vote out and lose any say or influence then. Why vote to lop off your own cock?Even if out win that's what will happen and people on here's will say it's fine....
Can't say i've heard of In voters being labelled as racists, xenophobes, bigots, islamophobes, little Englanders etc, simply for holding the view that they disagree with the political union that is the EU.What claptrap the out voice is ten times as shrill and dramatic which is why we hear much more from the outers
no but they've been labled traitors to their forefathers, gutless, cowardly, naZi supporting etc so all equally nonsensical. The fact is Brexit campaign is giving increasing voice to elements who you know as well as I are prejudiced and giving voice to an anti immigration element of Britain that for some isn't as agnostic to race , colour and religion as you would have us believe. That said I don't think this is the case with many brexiters and the main posters on here don't seem to hold those views but even this thread has had its Britain first momentsCan't say i've heard of In voters being labelled as racists, xenophobes, bigots, islamophobes, little Englanders etc, simply for holding the view that they disagree with the political union that is the EU.
Tell me, what do In voters get catagorised and chastised as for wanting to remain? What slurs are aimed at them that results in them being classed as social pariahs?
I doubt leaving would make any difference - in fact it could harm as why would Europe help in dealing with the problems caused by Anglo Franco US wars and power game. Germany is already having to deal with the outcome of adventures in Iraq and Syria which they played very little role in and we were key. I suspect we would see I'm the English Channel what happens in Italy now if Europe decided not to assist at all in stopping the flows of refugees across Europe or even quietly encouraged going to Britain. As it is that won't happen as we, even with an out vote will accept all the free movement of labour in Europe anyway as we will have to.
I would suggests we stop playing at regime change in the Middle East and get a lot more money and support to Syria, Jordan etc and start to solve the problems at source as when someone is at Calais or zeebrugge coming to the UK it's too late
Heard two women in work today saying they were voting to stay in as holidays to European destinations would be priced higher if we were outside the EU. One said that she had a holiday booked in Spain for £270, but if we voted out, then it would probably cost around £800. Basically, a holiday in Europe would cost near enough the same as going to America because of tax. They said they'd seen it on the telly from a travel expert!
Now, I've not followed this issue closely, as I just can't be arsed, but surely that is bollox? They were both quite adamant it was true though, and they're both voting to stay in because of it, it is the biggest issue for them.
I'm still voting out because of Obama......
You hope.........Not even a decent WUM.
France has a big issue it has to address that is 1789 related an post war and not EU related. In France every citizen is equal , it's imperative to who they are but it means they will run no policy, no research , no principle that in anyway divides on allows for policy on religion, on ethnicity, on the drivers of poverty or social unrest , also if you were part of the French empire you were part of France and a full citizen. These are very worthy principles and part of Liberte egalite fraternity, Unfortunately with huge poverty associated with North African areas they can't and don't take policy and government action to understand the issues and therefore seek to solve them. In the seventies and eighties the French looked at the problems in Northern Ireland as being entirely because the UK did not have this equality but now the UK can look at France and see the problem that the UK can acknowledge and take specific action on. French principles vs British pragmatismIf only most people knew what was happening there but the media appear to be keeping it as quiet as possible. Funny that.
Can't say i've heard of In voters being labelled as racists, xenophobes, bigots, islamophobes, little Englanders etc, simply for holding the view that they disagree with the political union that is the EU.
Tell me, what do In voters get catagorised and chastised as for wanting to remain? What slurs are aimed at them that results in them being classed as social pariahs?
Why would it. I´m not in the EU and mine goes up in line with inflation every year.You hope.........
Had a decent wager at $6 as did a few friends and my brother, it was over priced and was always going to come down even if just with Inners money, will cash out at a profit or hold , will be having a decent bet on The Dems to win the presidency too as that will peak in the next few days In odds terms as the last throes of sanders and the disappointment of his defeat will means for a few weeks the polls will be false flags and the odds will be at their best.Indeed - this thread has shown this arsehole to be a utterly up his own arse ignorant thread vandal. Most threads get them nowadays it seems - so intent on just pouring out crap to divert from 'healthy discussion/debate'.
He has probably more posts in this thread than anyone - but has likely added the least value - even for the Remain side because he devalues their position by his continual ignorance
I commented yesterday that the odds on Betfair had reduced from 5.1 to 4.6 for Brexit - 3.6 this morning!!
So, nothing incriminating, just slightly insulting to their ego's. Ask yourself this question, would you rather have people see you as a racist or as a coward? Which one would be more damaging to your life in general if the public held a particular opinion of you?no but they've been labled traitors to their forefathers, gutless, cowardly, naZi supporting etc so all equally nonsensical. The fact is Brexit campaign is giving increasing voice to elements who you know as well as I are prejudiced and giving voice to an anti immigration element of Britain that for some isn't as agnostic to race , colour and religion as you would have us believe. That said I don't think this is the case with many brexiters and the main posters on here don't seem to hold those views but even this thread has had its Britain first moments
I've met and talked t a few boat people in Australia and they are generally coming from less dangerous places in Syria. My general perspective was two fol - one, that if you have absolutely nothing to lose the downside of drowning trying to do something is not that great if you gave death, oppression, disease and have no hope and secondly that people do not have access to perfect or even good information so the promise of what they will get and the ease of the trip is not perhaps fully understood.