The Boxing thread

Metalartin said:
I actually did answer it but then edited it to a much shorter reply because it does seem that you've made your mind up anyway. But since you insisted...

Calling AJ chinny is way too far(granted it's not as good as Ruiz Jr's chin but who's is?), would you call Wilder chinny since he's been stopped now? I wouldn't but I knew it wasn't as good as it was hyped up to be. Simply by some of the times he's been rocked before. He was knocked out cold in sparring against Wlad, he was rocked by Molina(who AJ handled no problem) as well Ortiz of course, who came close to stopping him before Fury actually did it, even Breazeale rocked him(another guy who didn't trouble AJ) before the Ortiz rematch. Off topic but did you notice the ref trying to buy Wilder as much time as possible, taking a point off Fury, while telling him off etc? That's twice I've seen that tactic in Wilder fights.

Anyone can get hurt or knocked out in boxing but you can't say chinny when the only people who have rocked AJ, do actually have decent power. That's not how it works. You can't say Whyte doesn't have power, you definitely can't say Wlad doesn't have power(or any man with 53KOs on his record) and he caught him with that straight right that has done the job on so many fighters before(it's better than his left hook for me). He got up, may have been on wobbly legs but who wouldn't be? Povetkin is another known puncher who was landing clean on the inside, he felt them but he was never even rocked in that fight. Ruiz Jr does have power and lightning fast hands, but it was the shots behind the head that did the damage in the 3rd and the 7th, the rest was accumulation of heavy shots, it was never one shot that put him down. In fact in the 7th AJ ate a clean shot on the chin in an exchange and it didn't phase him, which IMO was when Ruiz Jr decided to go back to the punch that did the damage in the 3rd. Smart but dirty.

AJ being predictable is also off the mark because he's beaten too many top ranked guys for that to have any credence. You don't beat all those guys, some very accomplished and experienced guys if you're predictable(AJ hasn't been fighting journeymen his whole career like some). He's a student of the sport, the sweet science if you will. Wilder has shown none of that, he fell in love with that right hand power long ago(10+ years), he barely talks about past boxers, doesn't seem to respect the history etc. I suppose he doesn't have to but it shows the mentality. People draw inspiration off past great boxers, if they are constantly looking to improve.

It doesn't get much more predictable than Wilder, he's looking for one punch the whole fight, the jab is merely a range finder or a deterrent at best for him. AJ definitely has shown that willingness to add more to his game all along, which is why the schooling he gave Ruiz Jr was no surprise to me. I still think he will go back and do a 3rd fight to avenge the stoppage but nobody is in a rush to see that yet. Ruiz Jr hasn't shown much encouragement so far unfortunately, of a willingness to redeem himself, for coming in heavy, then using that as an excuse. Especially when he accurately predicted AJ's fight plan: "he will move around the ring more but we have a plan for that" what plan was that then Andy? IMO coming in heavy was all so he had an excuse. I like him but that was poor and so are some of his fight tactics. He has his strengths but footwork and head movement have never been among them.

Wilder always has a punchers chance but he's nowhere near the boxer AJ is. I don't know if anyone noticed the way AJ was throwing the jab in the Ruiz Jr rematch was very similar to the Kronk jab. It was snapping Ruiz Jrs head back much like Fury's was on Wilder. One of his trainers talked about that after the fight. AJ has shown a better defence than Wilder, who thinks leaning back with a weak guard will be enough to get out of the way of a fighter stepping forward at you. AJ did make similar mistakes in the first Ruiz Jr fight but how much of that was about him not being with it from the end of the 3rd round? The footwork wasn't all new to AJ who was GB olympic trained, they work on all of that, he went back to basics and took it up a gear. AJ doesn't have amazing head movement but it's at least better than Wilder's as is his guard. It's rare a fighter adds head movement later on his career but you never know, wouldn't put it past someone like AJ, very dedicated to say the least.

I will leave it at that, this is why I deleted it the first time around because the post was getting too long. I'm actually happy for Fury and don't feel the need to bash him at this point. I don't get the AJ hate personally but that's just me.
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AJ has a habit of moving out of range in straight lines, even in Ruiz 2, he did it. That will always leave him open to either a counter straight right, or hook. Its also a flaw that Wlad had. LL could be caught, but I dont recollect him having to get on his bike against a limited opponent. LL was a exceptional champion, who still got caught. I feel that despite his size TF has better ring craft than AJ and better hand speed. That doesn't mean I think AJ is anything other than a very good fighter, I just feel he still has the same lapses in ring craft and looked suspect everytime the pillsbury landed a half decent punch. That's not his fault, but why I dont think Wilder wouldn't be a 50/50 fight. You are 100% correct regarding the referee on Sunday am, he was also pushing TF back after every break to give Wilder a chance to tee of on TF.
 
leighton said:
Oleksandr Usyk is the 1 in the heavyweight division I am waiting for to be pushed up to the title fights. I think he is mandatory for a World Title shot in 1 of belts think it is the WBC title as he was the Cruiserweight champion and moved up to heavyweight they got some ruling giving the Cruiserweight champion a mandatory fight with the Heavyweight champion. Him against either Fury or AJ I would fancy him doing well if he can take there shots I feel he might have too much for both.
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he’s only had 1 HW fight hasn’t he?

personally I think Del Boy would stop him.

you are correct he is the mandatory to one of AJ’s belts due to being the holder as cruisersweight
 
Man_City_Loyal said:
he’s only had 1 HW fight hasn’t he?

personally I think Del Boy would stop him.

you are correct he is the mandatory to one of AJ’s belts due to being the holder as cruisersweight
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yeah don’t think Usyk was a concussive puncher at cruiser so can’t see him putting many top heavyweights away
Think he might have enough freshness and skill to take Chisora on points with late run of rounds as Chisoras age and wars catch up but it will be very interesting early on
Seeing the comparison to Holyfield is far to premature, Holyfield was one of the toughest and mentally strong fighters that has ever been at any weight and what he achieved has only been done once by a cruiser moving up, he’s not the norm
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
Wilder says he lost as his ring costume too heavy. YCNMIU Lol. Ali must be looking down with a smile on his face.
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It's a novel excuse, will give him that. Not gonna do him many favours amongst fight fans, but I suppose it's his prerogative to take the 3rd fight. Am slightly surprised he's not wanting to look elsewhere for at least one fight before going back for another against TF tho, so convincing was his beating.
 
Wilder has to find excuses and sack people because that’s the only way he can go into the third fight mentally. There will be a third fight because there’s too much money in it for him and his team. And the same thing will happen again. And there’ll still be pundits and people galore backing Wilder next time because ‘he only has to land once’ blah blah blah.

The Chisora fight is gonna be a great barometer of where Usyk is at. If he knocks Del Boy out then he’ll be in business.
 
bluemoon32 said:
He lost because he shit himself, a bully being bullied, he was like a rabbit in the headlights
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I watched it last night - I was surprised at how poor he (wilder) was. It was pretty clear from round 1 that TF had the right game plan to avoid the big rights and that left Wilder with his pretty useless jab game for such a big man and for his build you would think he would have the better movement and be able to get in range punch and get out, the heavier lumbering TF was doing that and credit to him. Wilder had nothing to come back with, he made Fury look good when in reality Fury wasn't doing a great deal of damage with his punches it was a war of attrition where Fury clearly had more appetite for it and relished it and wrestled his way through a lot of it. Wilder was banking on a speculative big right, just like the first fight, but this time it never came. Credit to TF but I still think he is a limited fighter, he looked fitter and his movement was very good but Wilder offered up very little and TF still struggled to finish him off.

I think a Wilder - AJ fight would be a good match up as I don't think AJ has the physical ability to wear down Wilder in that kind of attritional style. It would be a very different fight but I still think AJ would beat him though, he has the better all round technique and enough game to get out of the way of the big rights.
 
Gaudion M said:
Credit to TF but I still think he is a limited fighter, he looked fitter and his movement was very good but Wilder offered up very little and TF still struggled to finish him off.
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Sorry mate, but your talking rubbish here - Fury is not a 'limited fighter', his ability in the ring is second to none and most good judges/experts say he is going to go down as one of the great heavy weight fighters. Fury did not 'struggle' to finish Wilder off either, he pummelled him for 7 rounds and was completely toying with him.

I'm not sure what fight you were watching.
 
Wilder has always been a glorified chicken leg slugger with limited boxing ability. He came into boxing late after a career in basketball and it shows.
 
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