Afghanistan

[BobKowalski]

The fallout from Afghanistan from a European perspective was the realisation in Europe that over-reliance on the US is not a sustainable position.

“In short, Europe seems to realise it will have to do more by itself. Whether sceptics understand it or not, this is exactly what Macron has been saying. Nobody will say so aloud. But the implicit recognition is zut alors, Macron was right" @The Economist

 

[Octavian]

Because the US signed a peace deal stating they would withdraw by May of this year in exchange for a ceasefire.

Jeez.

And that was a mistake… jeez

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

Not only the US gov know, they knew by a very credible source as it was one of their own generals that said this.

The year's extension was about getting people out with considerably less death than what happened as the result. There would been no need very the 'robust' action that happened.

Not sure why you see this as an issue?

>> Not only the US gov know, they knew by a very credible source as it was one of their own generals that said this.
I've answered this again and again. Clearly Biden didn't think that such a rapid take-over by the Taliban was likely. Intelligence counter to what has actually transpired must have been presented and was believed. That's on Biden.

There's a pattern here though - when it's perceived that the boss wants to hear something - everyone scrambles to present the boss with what he wants to hear. Dissenting opinions - while present - are downplayed. This is why we went into Iraq, perusing weapons of mass destruction - which, as it turned out - didn't exist.

And too, this is likely why Biden somehow believed that the Afghan government was at least stable enough to last until US troops and personnel withdrew from the country - intelligence counter to this viewpoint notwithstanding.

>> The year's extension was about getting people out with considerably less death than what happened as the result.
As I've said - security in Afghanistan is non-existent. Moreover, the Taliban wanted us out and refused any deadline extension. Staying any longer than we did would evacuate some more people but would come at the cost of American lives as suicide bombings and other attacks would almost certainly occur and would occur with some success.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

What everyone is missing in all this arguing is that the disaster was the war, not the exit from the war.

 

[Indaparkside]

Wife’s bagged 4 bin bags full of clothes unbearable watching them families young children old aged etc, be taking them tomorrow to help out in anyway we can heartbreaking what they’ve had to endure

 

[domalino]

What everyone is missing in all this arguing is that the disaster was the war, not the exit from the war.

Tell that to the women and girls who got to go to school, or walk down the street unaccompanied, or not wear a burqa for the last 20 years.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

If you get chance watch 'Turning Point - 9/11 and the war on terror' on Netflix. It goes a long way to explain just how f*cked up the Afghan war was.

 

[domalino]

If you get chance watch 'Turning Point - 9/11 and the war on terror' on Netflix. It goes a long way to explain just how f*cked up the Afghan war was.

Just finished it.

It's not perfect but it's a really good starting point.

 

[bluethrunthru]

If you get chance watch 'Turning Point - 9/11 and the war on terror' on Netflix. It goes a long way to explain just how f*cked up the Afghan war was.

I'm on holiday in Crete I have no time for this shit...........................said our FS

 

[ChicagoBlue]

Tell that to the women and girls who got to go to school, or walk down the street unaccompanied, or not wear a burqa for the last 20 years.

Great sound bite!

Completely meaningless response, but makes you look and sound like a great guy. Well done!

I know guys who have been over there many years and, to a man, they readily acknowledge that without a desire to be the occupying force underpinning a weak government running on American dollars, Afghanistan was ALWAYS going to be a third world, inhospitable, country living a hair’s breadth from the Middle Ages. Indeed, with the exception of Kabul, 95% of Afghanistan is STILL like a country stuck in the Middle Ages.

America has sacrificed enough to chase AQ out of Afghanistan, and the technology to hunt them down in 2021 is light years ahead of where it was in 2001…without boots on the ground.

In addition to the lives and money sent into the Afghan abyss, the world has moved on from chasing AQ, and OBL is long dead.

None of that presupposes that Afghanistan will never birth, or harbour, another terrorist, but then London could do exactly the same thing AGAIN (7/7).

It is all well and good to tout your denigration of the American cost by comparing it to the advances provided to females, but at what price, for how long, and paid for by whom?

There is nothing quite like the “enlightened arrogance” of the European/American male, who determined the entire world should live by HIS version of what a decent life is, what rights everyone should have, and what access to the kind of life he enjoys should be provided to others.

Meanwhile, racism is alive and well, sexism is alive and well, and inequality of all kinds runs rampant across Europe & America, but we should OCCUPY A FOREIGN COUNTRY to make them in our image?

Afghans, like Brits and Yanks before them, need to stand up for themselves sooner or later…and 20 yrs seems like later is here. Alas, it appears the men…the ones who were supposed to be the powerful ones in their families…look like they’re the weak ones, and the women and girls are the ones who have been showing ALL the courage in the face of aggression, which makes the weakness of the men in the Afghan govt even sadder.

Just not sad enough to stay in an intractable war costing billions of American tax dollars per month with 10,000s of American boots on the ground ad infinitim. Sorry.