Ali v Tyson

[SWP's back]

Tyson at his peak. No doubt in my mind.

 

[Metalartin]

I'm not sure you can say Tyson would win personally, he had power sure but are you forgetting Foreman and Frazier both had brutal power. Secondly some of Tysons loses raise big question marks there's excuses by Tyson fans for a young Tyson(he got beat by Buster Douglas in his prime ffs) and an old Tyson... Ali fans dont even need excuses at any point of his career. Ali was hard to hit and had a good solid chin, Tyson would get frustrated and sloppy and then Ali would take him out into deep water to finish him off IMO.

Watch the Holyfield fights with Tyson if you have time, he pretty much showed Tyson couldn't handle it against the very best and the very toughest. Holyfield doesn't get enough credit for his career imo the man was an absolute warrior he was the older man and Tyson was in shape for their fight and I dont buy the excuses by Tyson fans there I say Holyfield had the beating of Tyson no matter what variables you change.

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

By modern standards both Haye and Ali were blown up cruiserweights. Ali in his day was actually thought of as a pretty big heavyweight being just over 15 stone. A lot of Ali's opponents weren't heavyweights at all by today's standards being below 200 lbs.Tyson was also a similar weight to Ali but coming later often fought guys heavier than himself. Modern day standards haven't dropped massively, it's just that the Klitschko brothers have dominated the division for so long. Wladimar Klitschko has beaten far more guys who were undefeated than Ali ever did.The truth is modern day heavyweights are about 2-3 stone heavier than they were in Ali's day. Tyson fought at the start of this era. His peak didn't last long but at that time he was the best we'd seen. You can argue about whether the young Tyson was better than the old Lewis as they came from the same era but peaked at different times but the young Tyson would have beaten Ali.

And yet you managed to argue earlier that Marciano, giving away nearly 3 stone, would have beaten Ali! Heftiness is not the be all end all. The young 16 stone Lennox Lewis was a top quality boxer. The 18 stone musclebound lummox that he became was not. As to whether Klitschko would have beaten Ali (which he so wouldn't have done), like Tyson, who has either of the Klitschkos ever beaten that was even remotely in the same class as Foreman, Frazier, Shavers and the other fighters Ali saw off?

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

Your argument falls down when you consider Foreman, one of the hardest punchers the sport has known, a 31 year old Ali beat him, like he would have Tyson. Ali was also robbed of his peak years and was undefeated before it, Tyson wasnt the mighty Buster Douglas saw to that. Tyson was also beaten by Holyfield a blown up crusierweight himself. If Tyson was so good, why did he duck Lewis for over 10 years, paying money not to fight him? They sparred when they were younger, when Tyson was so called amazing, Tyson knew exactly what he would have faced with Lewis, and wanted none of it, the so called baddest man on the planet. Lennox was far bigger, had a great jab, a concussive right, his main problem was a perception that he was a cautious fighter and not explosive like Tyson. Tyson being the best ever really is a myth, he is nowhere near, his only win against a top fighter was Larry Holmes who had been retired for 3 years and was nearly 40, anyone can look spectacular beating up bums, look at Anthony Joshua.

Amen. Someone talking sense on this thread!

 

[Never Mind The Pollocks]

Some interesting posts, enjoyed reading the responses here. Too young to have seen Ali but from what I have watched and read I'm going to say I'd fancy him over Tyson. Unless Tyson were to KO Ali in the first couple of rounds he'd have no chance. Question is whether Ali's jab would have been enough to keep a bobbing, weaving, counterpunching Mike Tyson at bay for the first few rounds. Giving it to Ali on the basis that it seems no one KO's Ali.

 

[Yaya_Tony]

Your argument falls down when you consider Foreman, one of the hardest punchers the sport has known, a 31 year old Ali beat him, like he would have Tyson. Ali was also robbed of his peak years and was undefeated before it, Tyson wasnt the mighty Buster Douglas saw to that. Tyson was also beaten by Holyfield a blown up crusierweight himself. If Tyson was so good, why did he duck Lewis for over 10 years, paying money not to fight him? They sparred when they were younger, when Tyson was so called amazing, Tyson knew exactly what he would have faced with Lewis, and wanted none of it, the so called baddest man on the planet. Lennox was far bigger, had a great jab, a concussive right, his main problem was a perception that he was a cautious fighter and not explosive like Tyson. Tyson being the best ever really is a myth, he is nowhere near, his only win against a top fighter was Larry Holmes who had been retired for 3 years and was nearly 40, anyone can look spectacular beating up bums, look at Anthony Joshua.

All Lewis had was his jab. All Ali had was his footwork but yeah he could hit hard too. I've seen most of the fights. Tyson had it all. Aggression, intensity, skills. He was a pleasure to watch and would have beaten the crap out of Ali.

 

[harry the plumber]

So when was Tysons prime? 1985 when he was knocking out any bum who would get in the ring,1 year later he was getting taken the distance by fighters like James Tillis and Mitch Geeen 2 years later by Smith and Tucker, He would not have laid a glove on Ali in his prime and would have been given a boxing lesson.

 

[The Batman]

We only saw a glimpse of tysons prime because cus died so early in his career, It's a shame really because don king ruined him after. But that short span at the beginning , that was boxing for me , unbelievable head movement couple with explosive powerful combo's put to devastating effect.
A 20 year old ali vs a 20 year old tyson , I would back tyson every time.

 

[Paul Lake's Left Knee]

All Lewis had was his jab. All Ali had was his footwork but yeah he could hit hard too. I've seen most of the fights. Tyson had it all. Aggression, intensity, skills. He was a pleasure to watch and would have beaten the crap out of Ali.

Lewis had a lot more than just a jab, look at his dismantling of Razor Ruddock as an example of that, Tyson struggled with Ruddock, which was before he went to jail, Lewis knocked him into next week. Lewis' main problem was didnt use all his skills and won behind his jab too much, he was too cautious. If Tyson was so good why did he duck Lewis for over 10 years a fact that Tyson fan boys totally ignore? He actually paid money not to fight him. Explain that. Tyson struggled with anyone who could keep him at range, Lewis and Ali were both great exponents of that.

All Ali had was footwork is utter rubbish, watch him in some of his fights he was a hurtful puncher, he could hit almost as hard going backwards as forwards, a very rare quality. Watch his fight against Ernie Terrell to see how nasty and hurtful he could be. He also had a good jab and devastating hand speed, as the old adage goes, speed kills, it why Floyd Mayweather has ruled the roost for so long. Ali also had a very good defense, his ring craft put Tyson to shame, as proven by taking on really big punchers and beating them, as he often pointed out, he was still pretty because not many got close to him to lay a glove on him.

Tyson didnt have it all, nowhere near. He was short, so didnt have reach, didnt have a jab, his defense relied totally on head movement and a high guard, the longer his fights went, the easier he was to hit. He was a concussive puncher and could put combos together, if he could get close to his opponent. He was taken apart by lesser fighters than Ali. Who did Tyson beat? Not one name on his record is of any real quality. Why do boxing experts, not rate Tyson in the top 10 greatest heavyweights if he was so good? Not just blokes who saw Tyson demolish bum after bum and make excuses for him for not having a decent career, he was good but over hyped and knocked out by Buster Douglas...

 

[Yaya_Tony]

All Lewis did vs Bruno for example was jab the fuck out of him. All Ali did was dance around and avoid getting hit until he suckerpunched him. Iron mike would murder him. Them both.