'All Or Nothing' - discussion of documentary

Really enjoying it (thanks to my lad's login!). Just finished episode 4 and the cúnt Taylor has just made my blood boil again. Bent wanker.
 
Sky Blue said:
Really enjoying it (thanks to my lad's login!). Just finished episode 4 and the cúnt Taylor has just made my blood boil again. Bent wanker.
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It is crazy to think we only lost a handful of games all season and each time they were controversial to say the least.

What a team!
 
allweneedisjo said:
Delph shouting at Pep after the derby about the basics of football is a personal higlight
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You could see what he was getting at though. If they concede anything more than a consolation goal it does seem like they lose their heads a bit and forget how to do the basics. They start missing runs, misplacing passes, etc. and give the opposition more encouragement. Just calming things down a bit for a couple of minutes, keeping it simple and taking the sting out of it would make a big difference sometimes.
 
Irwell said:
You could see what he was getting at though. If they concede anything more than a consolation goal it does seem like they lose their heads a bit and forget how to do the basics. They start missing runs, misplacing passes, etc. and give the opposition more encouragement. Just calming things down a bit for a couple of minutes, keeping it simple and taking the sting out of it would make a big difference sometimes.
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Agree. It sounded like Pep was poo-pooing what he said, but I think all that missing was Delph saying "for 5 minutes". He didn't express his point too well, adrenaline and emotin can do that to you, but he meant well.
 
Just finished watching it thanks to my youngest lad. I take it the blocked out face at the back of the changing room when Peps giving his speech when we've won it in the last episode, has to be Zabba? There's one split second where you can make out his eye. Really enjoyed it, and as others have said some of the decisions we were on the wrong end of were unbelievable!!
 
SWP's back said:
I love Vinny but his knowledge of South African history isn’t what it could be
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I reckon his knowledge on it is probably quite good.

But I’m not sure a bunch of 6 year olds are quite ready for a debate on apartheid and the nuances of the difference between a freedom fighter and a terrorist though?
 
So, just home after work, the Monday after. One blue next to me, not watched it yet, and many once a season rags, who are SURE, it's all about parking the bus. ALL about them. IT'S ALL ABOUT US, they are saying, apparently a free trial won't convince them otherwise.
 
I enjoyed it and it was fantastic to see the behind the scenes stuff with the directors and the players.

The best bit was seeing Pep in action. The guy is absolutely off his head. And I mean that in the nicest possible way, he’s a mad genius. He’s far more animated and aggressive than his public persona, and it was great to see him at work.

On the downside, I have to agree with what some other posters have said, I thought some of the production decisions really let the series down. It was good, but it could have been so much better.

Firstly, the narration. I love Ben Kingsley as an actor, he has a superb speaking voice and clearly has some local affinity if he went to Manchester Grammar. But I felt it was very clear from his delivery that he had no affinity for football whatsoever. There was no passion in his delivery. I don’t think he was helped by a very mediocre script, but there were certain common football phrases that you could just tell in his delivery he had no affinity with the subject.

I think the score was also poor, it was too melodramatic and sounded like it was more suitable for a low budget heist movie set in Eastern Europe. It didn’t capture the emotion of the season at all, and the bits that made you feel the most were when there was no music at all.

I also think the narrative structure was extremely poor, and the thing that really let it down. Other than episode 7, there was no narrative, nothing distinctive from episode to episode. Really it was just a drawn out season review DVD.

It’s quite difficult with sport not to just have a chronological structure, but the best sports documentary I’ve ever seen narrative wise was the 24/7 on Mayweather vs De LaHoya and Mayweather vs Hatton. Each episode had a theme and was edited in such a way to stir emotion while getting you engaged in the story / theme of the episode.

This All or Nothing did a lousy job of that for me. Much more should have been made about the groundbreaking style of play we played. Much more tension should have been added about us getting the 18 straight wins. Much more tension and release about us getting to the 100 points. Much more build up to all of the records we broke. They kind of served as a footnote, but the whole series should have been based around them for me.

The quality of the filming, the access etc was superb. It’s fantastic we’ve got all of this footage from such a groundbreaking season. But as a standalone documentary, I think the production and editing really let it down.

Look at how the production and editing of Senna could engage non-F1 fans, or Amy engaged people who weren’t Amy Winehouse fans. The production crew had the same opportunity with All or Nothing to do the same with City, but even though they had the material to make a masterpiece, they ultimately fell short.

I’d love to see what an experienced documentary team like those that did Senna, Amy and Supersonic could do with all that footage. Maybe there’s a two hour long masterpiece in there somewhere.
 
Watched episode one tonight and will watch them all a couple of days apart just to savour each episode. Fuck me, for a Manc of 59 years of age I was close to blubbering over just the first episode, I'll be a delirious wreck cometh the eighth I suspect.
 
Shaelumstash said:
I enjoyed it and it was fantastic to see the behind the scenes stuff with the directors and the players.

The best bit was seeing Pep in action. The guy is absolutely off his head. And I mean that in the nicest possible way, he’s a mad genius. He’s far more animated and aggressive than his public persona, and it was great to see him at work.

On the downside, I have to agree with what some other posters have said, I thought some of the production decisions really let the series down. It was good, but it could have been so much better.

Firstly, the narration. I love Ben Kingsley as an actor, he has a superb speaking voice and clearly has some local affinity if he went to Manchester Grammar. But I felt it was very clear from his delivery that he had no affinity for football whatsoever. There was no passion in his delivery. I don’t think he was helped by a very mediocre script, but there were certain common football phrases that you could just tell in his delivery he had no affinity with the subject.

I think the score was also poor, it was too melodramatic and sounded like it was more suitable for a low budget heist movie set in Eastern Europe. It didn’t capture the emotion of the season at all, and the bits that made you feel the most were when there was no music at all.

I also think the narrative structure was extremely poor, and the thing that really let it down. Other than episode 7, there was no narrative, nothing distinctive from episode to episode. Really it was just a drawn out season review DVD.

It’s quite difficult with sport not to just have a chronological structure, but the best sports documentary I’ve ever seen narrative wise was the 24/7 on Mayweather vs De LaHoya and Mayweather vs Hatton. Each episode had a theme and was edited in such a way to stir emotion while getting you engaged in the story / theme of the episode.

This All or Nothing did a lousy job of that for me. Much more should have been made about the groundbreaking style of play we played. Much more tension should have been added about us getting the 18 straight wins. Much more tension and release about us getting to the 100 points. Much more build up to all of the records we broke. They kind of served as a footnote, but the whole series should have been based around them for me.

The quality of the filming, the access etc was superb. It’s fantastic we’ve got all of this footage from such a groundbreaking season. But as a standalone documentary, I think the production and editing really let it down.

Look at how the production and editing of Senna could engage non-F1 fans, or Amy engaged people who weren’t Amy Winehouse fans. The production crew had the same opportunity with All or Nothing to do the same with City, but even though they had the material to make a masterpiece, they ultimately fell short.

I’d love to see what an experienced documentary team like those that did Senna, Amy and Supersonic could do with all that footage. Maybe there’s a two hour long masterpiece in there somewhere.
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I think the City documentary magnum opus will be on the 2011/12 season, if it’s done right.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
I think the City documentary magnum opus will be on the 2011/12 season, if it’s done right.
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I’d pay to see it!

I can’t think of a brilliant football documentary. The ones that stick out are the 1986 World Cup one is good, One Night in Turin is ok and The Two Escobars is good. But I can’t think of a great one.

There are plenty of brilliant boxing and music ones. I think they are more cinematic subjects by nature and the reality can be sensationalised more easily.

But with football, it’s next to impossible to recreate the tension, emotion and drama of it on film or documentary.

As you say, it’s certainly possible for it to be done with 2012. Good footage is helpful, but the trick is to tell the story well.
 
Thoughts as I'm halfway through the 7th episode:

- If Pep ran for president of the world I'd vote for him
- Pep telling Wenger to shut up because he always complains about the refs is one of the greatest things I've seen
- Pep firing them up to win for Merlin was a thing of beauty
- Merlin dancing on the trainer's table after a win shows the heart this team has as well as the joy they have in playing the game.
 
buckshot said:
Thoughts as I'm halfway through the 7th episode:

- If Pep ran for president of the world I'd vote for him
- Pep telling Wenger to shut up because he always complains about the refs is one of the greatest things I've seen
- Pep firing them up to win for Merlin was a thing of beauty
- Merlin dancing on the trainer's table after a win shows the heart this team has as well as the joy they have in playing the game.
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Think that’s Brandon the kit man dancing on the table, mate.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
It’s a truly great story to begin with, which must help in that regard.
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Absolutely. But I think the 100 points, the best league campaign ever, overseen by a man who’s methods they said couldn’t work in England, while his sworn nemesis who nearly pipped him to his first job as a professional coach is across town managing the sworn enemy of his current team, is an incredible story too.

But having a great story and telling a great story are two very different things ;-)
 
Shaelumstash said:
Think that’s Brandon the kit man dancing on the table, mate.
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I'll rewatch but I could have sworn it was Spanish Dave.

BTW, as I'm watching the 7th episode I'm reminded that if City ever got a fair shake from the refs they might have won the CL three or four times. Penalties are never given, goals are never allowed.

Fuck UEFA
 
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