Altercation at Terminal 2

[bert38]

I'm not sure that's true. Doesn't sound like it is, and I'm pretty sure there are numerous cases of people getting done for assault and manslaughter in such circumstances.

Either way, not particularly relevant here. Other than, you are right it will hinge on whether the situation was under control and whether he was still a threat. From what I have seen, I don't think it was, and I think he was still a threat, even some time after the kick.

You can argue to that the second male was still a threat at that point-in the mind of the officer, so, in his mind his colleagues were struggling, he needed to ensure the first male was sufficiently subdued in order to tackle the second male.

 

[bert38]

I do think that as many people on here are able to articulate a defence that ignores the urge for mere retribution as a reason, suggests that he too will have a defence.

 

[i kne albert davy]

Its hard to legislate for this kind of thing, when does a defence stop being so. No peril is very much open to conjecture. The only way you can completely know the peril is over is if the attacker is dead and he is on his/her own.

If this can be argued in a court of law then that gives a police officer or anyone else free rein to do some serious damage.

The way I look at it is if cctv showed me arguing in a car park with someone and he throws a punch and i throw a few back and he goes down I'm walking away and not going to court. Even if he vangs his head and dies im still not going to prison However if whilst he's down I give him a kick in the head and a stamp I'm in big trouble.

I don't think my defence of he started it would save me.

What if there’s two of them ones already laid your wife out there’s blood everywhere they then both start on you giving you a proper good hiding you manage to get one down then kick him to make sure he stays down. Hows your chances then ?

 

[feedthegoat27]

I think that’s why this is a complex matter-self defence if that’s what we are looking at is very difficult to be clear cut-all of it is mere conjecture though.

It will also have a significant impact on police use of force whichever way it ends.

You're obviously, with your background, someone who knows more than most about situations of this kind.

Does the fact that the officer doesn't go to cuff the prone suspect after the kick/stamp potentially work against him from a legal/criminal perspective?

I appreciate there is the other suspect on the scene too (sat on the chairs with hands on his head I think?), but would a defence of ''I was worried he might take my weapon'' possibly fall apart due to him abandoning the suspect who he had just kicked/stamped on?

It's naturally hard to position yourself in such a powder keg moment, but I'd imagine that if an officer was concerned that a suspect might take their weapon, and such had the suspect subdued/restrained on the ground, they would take the opportunity to get some cuffs on at the first opportunity?

 

[hilts]

I think that’s why this is a complex matter-self defence if that’s what we are looking at is very difficult to be clear cut-all of it is mere conjecture though.

It will also have a significant impact on police use of force whichever way it ends.

My guess would be a jury would never convict him by a majority of assault. I would find it difficult to do so and probably wouldnt even though I think that's what he did. In anger with adrenalin a bit of take that you fucking scumbag.
My only unease is that the stamping on someone's head is so abhorrent not many would even contemplate it as an action.

It would be interesting to see what his police record is, as for his job I would say it is touch and go.

 

[bert38]

My guess would be a jury would never convict him by a majority of assault. I would find it difficult to do so and probably wouldnt even though I think that's what he did. In anger with adrenalin a bit of take that you fucking scumbag.
My only unease is that the stamping on someone's head is so abhorrent not many would even contemplate it as an action.

It would be interesting to see what his police record is, as for his job I would say it is touch and go.

His police record will be faultless -he wouldn’t be on firearms otherwise

 

[hilts]

What if there’s two of them ones already laid your wife out there’s blood everywhere they then both start on you giving you a proper good hiding you manage to get one down then kick him to make sure he stays down. Hows your chances then ?

We playing different scenarios until I admit i would stamp on someone's head? There is a reason why I put it exactly the way I did. Unless another video emerges of his wife lying on the floor with blood everywhere you probably need to grow up.

Anyhow you are Liam Neeson and I claim your Taken 4 leading role.

 

[Coatigan]

You can argue to that the second male was still a threat at that point-in the mind of the officer, so, in his mind his colleagues were struggling, he needed to ensure the first male was sufficiently subdued in order to tackle the second male.

An angle I and probably most wouldn't have considered. There is a lot to it and all happens so fast. It is certainly not as simple as a basic loss of control or temper.

 

[hilts]

His police record will be faultless -he wouldn’t be on firearms otherwise

Excellent point

 

[bert38]

You're obviously, with your background, someone who knows more than most about situations of this kind.

Does the fact that the officer doesn't go to cuff the prone suspect after the kick/stamp potentially work against him from a legal/criminal perspective?

I appreciate there is the other suspect on the scene too (sat on the chairs with hands on his head I think?), but would a defence of ''I was worried he might take my weapon'' possibly fall apart due to him abandoning the suspect who he had just kicked/stamped on?

It's naturally hard to position yourself in such a powder keg moment, but I'd imagine that if an officer was concerned that a suspect might take their weapon, and such had the suspect subdued/restrained on the ground, they would take the opportunity to get some cuffs on at the first opportunity?

Yes, I’ve thought all along that had it kicked him and then jumped on him to cuff him it ‘looks’ much better-because he leaves him-now he could argue that he had to subdue him sufficiently before attending to the second male (who had already punched him numerous times) and left the first male to be cuffed by the blonde female-which happened.