Ched Evans - serious injury

[DelToro]

Does he have a Spanish passport?

He could get a game for their national side.

 

[Davs 19]

Whether the case against him was right or wrong, he has served his time.

Some of his time, he will be out on licence.

He can get on with his life but I'd be very surprised if any football club that has anything about them will sign him up.

Of course football clubs will sign him.

Football people know that chances are he has been stitched up, red top readers will be outraged.

Embarrassing. Truly embarrassing.

Still , I suppose we should be grateful that you didn't claim 'she was asking for it'.

 

[argyle]

Of course he should.

If he was a plumber would he be stopped from plumbing?


The lad did wrong, he served his time, im sure he has learnt dont do it again. The girl who he raped so him do punishment for his crime.


I find it fucking mindless that people judge others so harshly usually with little knowledge and often with no concept of the action they take. But thats the modern way.

Yes he would. There will be a number of jobs he wouldn't be able to do. A job going into other peoples houses where lone women might be would be one of them.

Oh? Under what legislation? A plumbing contractor may not wish to employ somebody with this sort of conviction, but there's nothing to say they could not do the job if their employer did not know, did not care, or if he was self employed.

Are you bringing up the plumber because Chris Coleman said it?

Would you be ok with a convicted rapist coming into your home?

If the employer doesn't know, then he's committed a crime of not disclosing it to them. If they did not care I'd question the type of people that they are.

 

[M18CTID]

Am I the only person who feels a bit uncomfortable about the Ched Evans conviction? I know I wasn't in court and didn't hear every scrap of evidence so I'm not making any assertions as such but from the things I read it really did seem like there was at the very least reasonable doubt and I was genuinely shocked when he was found guilty. Do I need to get my tin hat?

difficult for me to comment as I don't have all the facts.

Was the case not that she was in effect comatose (assume drink/drugs) so was in no condition to consent to sex by the time ched took his turn, whereas she had agreed to sleep with his mate? (or am I making that up?)

Certainly he was found guilty on the grounds that she was deemed too drunk to consent. Just lots of the evidence surrounding it seemed to suggest an element of doubt and in a case like this where there are effectively no independent witnesses to the crime, I find it difficult to just assume it is a safe conviction. I remember some of the victim's tweets didn't sit well with me either. Who knows?

This was discussed at length on here at the time and there were plenty of posters who it didn't sit well with. I for one was surprised that he was convicted because it certainly didn't look to me that it was beyond reasonable doubt. I think I read that CCTV footage showed she could well have been drunk but how can it have been proved that she was too drunk to consent? I'm not saying he definitely isn't a rapist but it doesn't look cut and dried from here.

 

[Rascal]

Of course he should be allowed to play again

Of course he should.

If he was a plumber would he be stopped from plumbing?


The lad did wrong, he served his time, im sure he has learnt dont do it again. The girl who he raped so him do punishment for his crime.


I find it fucking mindless that people judge others so harshly usually with little knowledge and often with no concept of the action they take. But thats the modern way.

He's a convicted rapist Russ, what's to judge ?

The 3rd sentence of your post makes me uncomfortable. He didn't steal a loaf from Tesco's, he raped someone.

If a football club employ him, I'll be disappointed and surprised but that's up to them.[/qu

My last sentence was crass pal. im sorry, i was not trying to make light of rape.


But the question remains. If you are a criminal and have done your time should you be a criminal for life? My criminal record has been expunged years ago but who says whats crimes remain "more" criminal and that denies you the right to earn a living.



I Think Ched Evans was an obnoxious **** and a wrong bastard who was horrible to a women. but in what he did but having served his sentence he should be allowed the rights we all have as free citizen

 

[Mustard Dave]

Yes he would. There will be a number of jobs he wouldn't be able to do. A job going into other peoples houses where lone women might be would be one of them.

Oh? Under what legislation? A plumbing contractor may not wish to employ somebody with this sort of conviction, but there's nothing to say they could not do the job if their employer did not know, did not care, or if he was self employed.

Are you bringing up the plumber because Chris Coleman said it?

Would you be ok with a convicted rapist coming into your home?

If the employer doesn't know, then he's committed a crime of not disclosing it to them. If they did not care I'd question the type of people that they are.

I didn't bring up a plumber - Rascal did. You then made the incorrect statement that a plumber would not be allowed to do his job. I probably wouldn't be happy with a convicted rapist in my home, but generally I tend not to ask tradesmen if they have done much raping recently.

If the employer asks about any convictions, the employee has to answer truthfully, over than in the case of spent convictions under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act. The employee does not have to disclose any convictions if they are not asked and if this was the case, they would be free to work wherever the employer sends him. If the employer knows about the conviction, he has the choice of whether or not he employs him.

There may be situations where a particular customer requires a CRB check. If this is the case, it is down to the customer to make the choice whether to allow them on the premises.

A conviction may make it difficult to obtain work but it doesn't mean offenders cannot gain employment, which is what is being debated here. I am of the opinion that Evans should be allowed to play, but given the nature of his conviction many clubs will not want him to join them and that is their prerogative.

 

[Balti]

no

 

[Lucky Toma]

Yup without a doubt.

He committed a crime and was duly punished for it.

Placing restrictions on him making a living once he has served his sentence only punishes him twice.

 

[argyle]

Yup without a doubt.

He committed a crime and was duly punished for it.

Placing restrictions on him making a living once he has served his sentence only punishes him twice.

Go cheer him on and chant his name at what club he signs for then.

 

[Kippax Street 1880]

Am I the only person who feels a bit uncomfortable about the Ched Evans conviction? I know I wasn't in court and didn't hear every scrap of evidence so I'm not making any assertions as such but from the things I read it really did seem like there was at the very least reasonable doubt and I was genuinely shocked when he was found guilty. Do I need to get my tin hat?

I agree.

Seems strange that 5 minutes after Clayton Macdonald left, she suddenly became too drunk to consent despite having no more alcohol. Maybe strange isn't the word - more like inconceivable. The very idea of someone losing their memory after spending one night drinking alcopops is fucking insane to me. And if she couldn't remember anything, it can't have been traumatic enough to warrant 5 years in prison - much longer than the time you'd serve for beating someone's skull so hard that they'd lose their memory of the night before and longer than killing someone in most instances of manslaughter or death by dangerous driving. In fact, despite getting absolutely hammered every weekend since I was about 15 years old, I have never been in a position where I have had zero recollection of the night before. I have had my stomach pumped, I have been throwing up till about 10 o clock the night after, but never have I lost my memory as soon as I enter the house of a person from the opposite sex which I have agreed to go back to. Even more inexplicable are the cases where the woman loses her memory but for a short period, wakes up during the 'assault', being able to recall what went on for that split second, before once again losing consciousness.

Also, there's no doubt when she got back to that hotel room, the pizza that she had would have been her favourite one with all her favourite toppings, having been to all of her favourite clubs and drank all her favourite drinks, but as soon as she walks into the room, her capacity to choose will have suddenly disappeared. But not for Ched Evans and Clayton Macdonald because men are supposed to be able to handle alcohol...

The fact is - no one knows what went on in that room apart from those involved. But 12 people have thought that they know enough to lock up him up for 5 years for doing something that would have been legal had he done it 5 minutes earlier. If he had sex with her when she was unconscious then he should be locked up (but nothing close to 5 years), but I just cannot get close to understanding how the jury could be certain that she had lost consciousness to such an extent that they were prepared to ruin a 22 year old man's life for it.

One million % this