Daily Express: Mancini to have contract extended

[SWP's back]

So you'd sack Bob if we win the Prem this season, as long as Jose was available?

As I have previously stated, finishing 1st or 2nd, where you could be within a point of each other or both end on 95 pts should not matter. Someone shouldn't be sacked "just for finishing 2nd" if they get a points total that would win the league 9 times out of ten. I find that rationale to be moronic.

The owners should have the man at the helm that they want and that they think is the long term future of the club. If that man is Mancini then it shouldn't matter whether we finish 1st or 2nd this year (and next year and the following year), if they think he is the man, then stick with him. Conversely, if we win the league this year but Mancini is seen as being 2nd choice to Jose and he's who the owners want as the considet him the best, then I believe they should make the move.

Over the course of a 38 season, the winners may finish 1 or 2 points ahead of their rivals. It would be far too fickle to sack a manager solely on the basis that he finished 2 points behind another club when you consider how easily a match can swing in the final minutes. That's why I believe it wrong to sack a manager based on winning the league or not. It has to be about more than that. The owners either have faith in the guy in charge or they don't.

You'll have splinters in your arse if you keep sitting on the fence.....

Only being facetious mate but you've done a lot of "Bob defending" in threads since the game on Sat yet choose to post today that if Jose was available you'd happily see Bob moved on regardless of whether we finish 1st or 2nd - my point really is that is exactly how a fair number of us feel.

I think a lot of it stems from the fact that if we don't win the title, imo, it will be an unmitigated disaster considering our early season form in getting to 14-1-0.

People can bang on all they like about how well the scum have done however as I've said in the other thread there are lots of faults that can be laid at Bob's door since our downturn in form - unbalanced squad with no pace or width, poor rotation of players resulting in loss of form and confidence, no plan B for teams that park the bus, shocking away form that doesn't look like changing, poor formations and systems that he changes after first half etc etc.

Anyway, I suppose what I'm saying is that even if we lose the title by 1 or 2 points I'll consider it as an abject failure - I'll hold my hands up and say I'm wrong if suddenly we click into gear and play well in the next 7 games but I've seen fuck all over the last few weeks to make me believe that will be the case.

And yet you will see it as a success if we win it by a point.

So a 2 point swing is all it takes for you to sack or stick with a manager. I think that to be a little bit silly given how quickly one game can turn on its head (see Giggs goal at Norwich, Ji's goal against us etc).

You also forget that Utd had an amazing start to the season also and that we were level on points at the half way stage.

If they win all their remaining games before the derby, it will be something like 16 wins in 17. No one will be able to say we blew anything if they finish like thaty and on 95 points. They will have just been a better team and have a record number of points. As I say, even if we finish as Champoions, if Jose is available and the owner thinks that he is a better option then I'd get him in. No room for sentiment where domination is concerned.

As for me back/defending our manager, I don't see any problem with that, I don't think all of the ills are squarely on his shoulders. I also think some of the criticsm of him to have been unfair. It doesn't mean I don't think we can't improve though.

 

[Rammy Blue]

And yet you will see it as a success if we win it by a point.

So a 2 point swing is all it takes for you to sack or stick with a manager. I think that to be a little bit silly given how quickly one game can turn on its head (see Giggs goal at Norwich, Ji's goal against us etc).

You also forget that Utd had an amazing start to the season also and that we were level on points at the half way stage.

If they win all their remaining games before the derby, it will be something like 16 wins in 17. No one will be able to say we blew anything if they finish like thaty and on 95 points. They will have just been a better team and have a record number of points. As I say, even if we finish as Champoions, if Jose is available and the owner thinks that he is a better option then I'd get him in. No room for sentiment where domination is concerned.

As for me back/defending our manager, I don't see any problem with that, I don't think all of the ills are squarely on his shoulders. I also think some of the criticsm of him to have been unfair. It doesn't mean I don't think we can't improve though.

You don't take into account the cup failures though, I'm sure a close second place finish wouldn't be so bad if we'd picked up some silverware however to end up with fuck all will be a disaster - that's why imo it doesn't matter one jot whether it's by 1 point or 10.

That's why I don't see this season as progress unless we win the Prem, I don't give a flying fuck how many more points we've got than last year.

We shouldn't have been falling away so badly with the talent at our disposal, maybe we'll click into gear and I'll eat some humble pie but as I say I've seen nothing over the last few weeks that makes me feel that will be the case.

If we lose the Prem by 6 points or so then I don't see how anyone can classify this season as having been progression in which case Bob will be on distinctly shaky ground.

 

[ballymunblue]

we have also went out of four cup competions without a real fight
after spending hundreds of millions on ready made players and paying them such crazy wages that we cant even sell the ones that dont work out
we surely should expect more from five competitions than complete failure

though the league is not over yet, miracles do happen, we have near enough thrown that away too

 

[SWP's back]

And yet you will see it as a success if we win it by a point.

So a 2 point swing is all it takes for you to sack or stick with a manager. I think that to be a little bit silly given how quickly one game can turn on its head (see Giggs goal at Norwich, Ji's goal against us etc).

You also forget that Utd had an amazing start to the season also and that we were level on points at the half way stage.

If they win all their remaining games before the derby, it will be something like 16 wins in 17. No one will be able to say we blew anything if they finish like thaty and on 95 points. They will have just been a better team and have a record number of points. As I say, even if we finish as Champoions, if Jose is available and the owner thinks that he is a better option then I'd get him in. No room for sentiment where domination is concerned.

As for me back/defending our manager, I don't see any problem with that, I don't think all of the ills are squarely on his shoulders. I also think some of the criticsm of him to have been unfair. It doesn't mean I don't think we can't improve though.

You don't take into account the cup failures though, I'm sure a close second place finish wouldn't be so bad if we'd picked up some silverware however to end up with fuck all will be a disaster - that's why imo it doesn't matter one jot whether it's by 1 point or 10.

That's why I don't see this season as progress unless we win the Prem, I don't give a flying fuck how many more points we've got than last year.

We shouldn't have been falling away so badly with the talent at our disposal, maybe we'll click into gear and I'll eat some humble pie but as I say I've seen nothing over the last few weeks that makes me feel that will be the case.

If we lose the Prem by 6 points or so then I don't see how anyone can classify this season as having been progression in which case Bob will be on distinctly shaky ground.

That's because cup competitions, in all reality, mean fuck all in terms of how good a team is and/or its progression.

I would much rather have seen our improvement in the league than fluke a CC and now be in the FA cup semi (as would every Liverpool fan that is currently enjoying the reverse of this debate).

Cup competitions are a lottery, Kompany's sending off affecting us hugely in both of those (CC & FA Cup, with KT away and Savic being shite). The league is all I care about at the minute and seeing the team evolve, which it has done. Cups are a hugely distant 2nd place in terms of importance at present, for me.

 

[Blue Hefner]

Can't agree about cups being a 'lottery'. There is an element of luck as far as who a team gets but that is where the look ends. To be beaten/knocked out of the cups by Utd, L'pool and Sporting Lisbon is a bad sign.

To judge progress you surely have to look at if a team is learning from its mistakes and given our away performances in the league and cup displays in my opinion does not show that management and players are learning from mistakes. In fact I would say that we are not even acknowledging them never mind learning from them!

 

[SWP's back]

Can't agree about cups being a 'lottery'. There is an element of luck as far as who a team gets but that is where the look ends. To be beaten/knocked out of the cups by Utd, L'pool and Sporting Lisbon is a bad sign.

To judge progress you surely have to look at if a team is learning from its mistakes and given our away performances in the league and cup displays in my opinion does not show that management and players are learning from mistakes. In fact I would say that we are not even acknowledging them never mind learning from them!

Put it this way:

Liverpool won the CC & are still in the semi's of the FA Cup, their team however, are shite. Anything can happen in one off games.

Utd got knocked out by Palace, Liverpool & Bilbao, no one is saying that they are having a bad season.

As I say, anything can happen in cup games which is why using them as a barometer to our season's success is fruitless, in my opinion of course.

 

[shootmeifipost10k]

All the people saying finishing second is failure and swooning over the special one would they have the same opinion if Barcelona win la liga this year and retain the champions league.
This would result in Real winning one trophey in the 2 years Jose has been there bearing in mind on top of their already vast squad they spent 150 million the season before he was appointed which inlcuded the likes of Ronaldo,Kaka,Alonso,Benzema and and since then another 130 million spent.I'll coin a phrase I've read a few times,Allan ball could get that lot winning.

Or would they say he is building a side to dominate in the next few years and if here at city would they give hime a little more time before shouting for him to be axed.

Obviously Real will now go on to win La liga and the Champions league but as of yet it's one trophey

 

[Rammy Blue]

Can't agree about cups being a 'lottery'. There is an element of luck as far as who a team gets but that is where the look ends. To be beaten/knocked out of the cups by Utd, L'pool and Sporting Lisbon is a bad sign.

To judge progress you surely have to look at if a team is learning from its mistakes and given our away performances in the league and cup displays in my opinion does not show that management and players are learning from mistakes. In fact I would say that we are not even acknowledging them never mind learning from them!

Put it this way:

Liverpool won the CC & are still in the semi's of the FA Cup, their team however, are shite. Anything can happen in one off games.

Utd got knocked out by Palace, Liverpool & Bilbao, no one is saying that they are having a bad season.

As I say, anything can happen in cup games which is why using them as a barometer to our season's success is fruitless, in my opinion of course.

That's a really weird logic, imo.

Whichever Manchester club wins the Prem has had a good season, the one that doesn't has had a shocker.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

As I see it there are maybe four scenarios:

1) The board have faith in Mancini and will offer him a new contract come what may, even if Mourinho or Guardiola are pleading for the job.

2) The board even if they have faith in him, have one of the handful of managers lined up (like JM) who should, in theory, be able to take us to the top level.

3) The board don't have faith in him and are prepared to gamble on a relatively unproven coach like Bielsa or Klopp.

4) The board don't particularly have faith in Mancini but can't get anyone they feel will add value so will stick with him.

In my opinion, any of these could still come to pass but I feel the chances of each are something like:
1) 10%
2) 40%
3) 15%
4) 35%

 

[Matt the Giant]

Finishing 1st or 2nd ought not to be the decider on Mancini's future I think, a more overall evaluation is called for.
The way I see it, if we end up second, I will not feel better about if it is just one or a few points behind United. Te fact remains that we lost the title after being in control of the race for a very long time. How man points were we at one point in front of the lesser teams chasing us?

If we fail to win the title we have lost what was once ours.