Dani Alves

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Marvin said:
Maicon was not a good signing as you well know. The difference is that Alves is still playing at a very high level
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Don't think Alves will be much better or worse tbh. Alves can't keep up with high intensity defending these days, watch him up against Marcelo in the CL final for evidence of this. Ran ragged.

Maicon wasn't the disaster people make out. Did quite well in most games he played, Madrid at the Bernabeu he pocketed Ronaldo until having to go off injured then we let in 3 goals down that side. Considering how much of a shambles we were in general that year I think he adapted reasonably well for a first season in a new league.

Pretty sure Alves will struggle with the pace. Be decent in some cup/CL games though.
 
conormcfc said:
Don't think Alves will be much better or worse tbh. Alves can't keep up with high intensity defending these days, watch him up against Marcelo in the CL final for evidence of this. Ran ragged.

Maicon wasn't the disaster people make out. Did quite well in most games he played, Madrid at the Bernabeu he pocketed Ronaldo until having to go off injured then we let in 3 goals down that side. Considering how much of a shambles we were in general that year I think he adapted reasonably well for a first season in a new league.

Pretty sure Alves will struggle with the pace. Be decent in some cup/CL games though.
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Well we certainly had Marcelo bottled up that day.

He only had about 47 shots on target.
 
conormcfc said:
Don't think Alves will be much better or worse tbh. Alves can't keep up with high intensity defending these days, watch him up against Marcelo in the CL final for evidence of this. Ran ragged.

Maicon wasn't the disaster people make out. Did quite well in most games he played, Madrid at the Bernabeu he pocketed Ronaldo until having to go off injured then we let in 3 goals down that side. Considering how much of a shambles we were in general that year I think he adapted reasonably well for a first season in a new league.

Pretty sure Alves will struggle with the pace. Be decent in some cup/CL games though.
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The entire Juventus team was ran ragged in that game.

I held your opinion a week ago. It's changed as I've looked at it more.

He played very well against Monaco in the CL semi-final. he was MoM and the one thing they have is pace. Had it not have been for leg fracture, he'd have played a lot more games. It is a short term solution, however I think he is at a higher level than Maicon was when maicon arrived. Maicon's career at that time was disrupted by injury.
 
domalino said:
He said Dybala *might* have to leave Juventus one day if he's going to be the very best.

IMO this ties in with his comments to Graham Hunter about Juve having a small club mentality, and his criticism of Juventus not handling the fine details in the build up to the CL final. He's a player they brought in to get them over the line and win a CL after 7 final losses, and he's turned around and said, basically "I did my bit, you've let things down on your end, so I'm off".

He's insanely driven, and demanding of success. If he gets here and we underwhelm him, if he doesn't think we've got what it takes to reach the top, if he thinks there's a small club mentality, then he'd probably say the same about G. Jesus because, unfortunately, it would be true. You can't become the best in the world at a club that isn't at the top.

Hopefully though, as Pep is a kindred spirit with equal desire for success, as is Sanchez, and Jesus by the sounds of it, they will drag us up with them to that level of constant winning, and insatiable appetite for the next goal, the next win, the next trophy. If that happens, he'll never say anything similar to the Dybala remark.
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So you are saying Juventus, a five-in-a-row Seria A champion and two-time UCL finalist in recent five years, is not a top club?

I certainly don't mind adding some winning spirit into the team, but I also don't like the idea of someone, when we are losing, says that"I've done my part, it's all your fault" and tell everyone in the dressing room " the club are losing, you might have to leave for your own good"
 
conormcfc said:
Don't think Alves will be much better or worse tbh. Alves can't keep up with high intensity defending these days, watch him up against Marcelo in the CL final for evidence of this. Ran ragged.

Maicon wasn't the disaster people make out. Did quite well in most games he played, Madrid at the Bernabeu he pocketed Ronaldo until having to go off injured then we let in 3 goals down that side. Considering how much of a shambles we were in general that year I think he adapted reasonably well for a first season in a new league.

Pretty sure Alves will struggle with the pace. Be decent in some cup/CL games though.
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Alves most definitely can compete with high intensity defending, as evidence by his mastery in the Monaco game - Monaco being probably the most intense side we played all season, to the point where they ran themselves into the ground in the first game.

What he couldn't deal with in the final was the fact Isco and Marcelo doubled up on him, and no player in the world is going to successfully defend against those two on their own.

He will be so much better than Maicon you'll laugh at yourself for comparing them by October, I promise you. He's a diffeent class of player all together, much smarter, much more positionally aware, and joining up with the manager who he was most successful with.
 
mvjason said:
So you are saying Juventus, a five-in-a-row Seria A champion and two-time UCL finalist in recent five years, is not a top club?

I certainly don't mind adding some winning spirit into the team, but I also don't like the idea of someone, when we are losing, says that"I've done my part, it's all your fault" and tell everyone in the dressing room " the club are losing, you might have to leave for your own good"
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No, that's not what I'm saying, it's what Dani Alves, the 3rd most successful player in history is saying. He seems to be saying that they don't have the mentality it takes to win everything, and that's why they've lost 7 CL finals.

It's also similar to what Conte said before he left Juventus, although he never expected them to get to finals.
 
conormcfc said:
How many of them before Maicon went off?

As I said, we were ok till he went off for Zaba. An excellent performance from an experienced CL operator.
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Real should have been 5 up at half time. We defended like Utd & hit them on the break & they kept missing chances.

I haven't seen a City fullback of any age who would stop Marcelo without about 2 extra helpers, so using that against Alves is unfair imo.

Monaco tore us a new arsehole with pace out wide & Alves was better v them than our fullbacks, or Walker (or the wonderful Trippier).

He is what he is, an attacking fullback. If we want a defender there, we should sign one.
 
He should turn out to be better than Maicon, but as another poster stated Maicon wasn't quite the disaster that people think and he actually did ok in the main when called upon. I remember one particular game against Spurs at home where he came on in the 2nd half. The Spurs fans got all giddy, thinking Bale was going to tear him a new one as he did in the San Siro a couple of seasons earlier. As it happened, Maicon coped with Bale quite comfortably that day and if anything, looked the more attacking threat and pushed Bale back. We went on to win 2-1 with a late Dzeko winner and that was in no small part down to Maicon's contribution after he came on.
 
If you take all the negative things said against him and IF they are exactly what happens it means Walker will play far more games than was envisaged and in monetary terms it has only cost his wages. If not all the negative things are true but he has lost some of his edge he will still play in the relevant games to his ability and because we paid nothing except wages people might judge that as you get what you pay for. However if he turns in the kind of performances we known he is capable of it will be the bargain of the summer. I believe the risk is worth taking.
 
Marvin said:
The entire Juventus team was ran ragged in that game.

I held your opinion a week ago. It's changed as I've looked at it more.

He played very well against Monaco in the CL semi-final. he was MoM and the one thing they have is pace. Had it not have been for leg fracture, he'd have played a lot more games. It is a short term solution, however I think he is at a higher level than Maicon was when maicon arrived. Maicon's career at that time was disrupted by injury.
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I hope he proves me wrong, I really do. Just can't see a 34 year old having never played in the league being able to come here and keep up, he's ancient in footballing terms.

I dunno, Maicon left City and went back to the slower pace of Serie A and did really well at Roma for a while longer. Different pace of game over here. Remains to be seen if Alves can adapt but I have huge doubts.
 
What a signing, can't believe we're gonna get him on a free
He's a step up from both Sagna and (dare I say it) Zaba in terms of ability; not to mention he's likely going to be a deputy right back
 
Rammyblues said:
If you take all the negative things said against him and IF they are exactly what happens it means Walker will play far more games than was envisaged and in monetary terms it has only cost his wages. If not all the negative things are true but he has lost some of his edge he will still play in the relevant games to his ability and because we paid nothing except wages people might judge that as you get what you pay for. However if he turns in the kind of performances we known he is capable of it will be the bargain of the summer. I believe the risk is worth taking.
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He is not just cover for right back, he is also a tactical option.

Late in games Pep has tried to use people like Navas to try & stiffen up the right side (often with mixed results). Alves will be better than Navas at both ends of the pitch.

He could come on & play in front of Walker, for example & is smart enough to cause havoc on the counter attack.
 
conormcfc said:
Not controversial really is it?

Look at Evra. Blowing at of his arse for the last 2 seasons in the prem at United, goes to Juve and looks comfortable week in week out. It's a different pace of game (though probably less technical) and I'm not confident at all he'll adapt at his age.
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Any attacking full back can be exposed defensively by pace, Walker included. Alves played as an out and out wing back in the CL Final so his starting position was further forward and he had no cover in front of him, it was Barzagli's job to provide the cover behind Alves. Depending on the opposition I would expect Pep to use him mostly as a full back, so he should have cover in front to help him out in those situations.
 
domalino said:
Alves most definitely can compete with high intensity defending, as evidence by his mastery in the Monaco game - Monaco being probably the most intense side we played all season, to the point where they ran themselves into the ground in the first game.

What he couldn't deal with in the final was the fact Isco and Marcelo doubled up on him, and no player in the world is going to successfully defend against those two on their own.

He will be so much better than Maicon you'll laugh at yourself for comparing them by October, I promise you. He's a diffeent class of player all together, much smarter, much more positionally aware, and joining up with the manager who he was most successful with.
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Prime for prime Maicon was the one that got in the Brazil team.

I think they're almost replica players. Gung-ho attacking footballers that always have and always will be exposed from time to time.

I hope I do end up laughing at myself.

Neville Kneville said:
Real should have been 5 up at half time. We defended like Utd & hit them on the break & they kept missing chances.

I haven't seen a City fullback of any age who would stop Marcelo without about 2 extra helpers, so using that against Alves is unfair imo.

Monaco tore us a new arsehole with pace out wide & Alves was better v them than our fullbacks, or Walker (or the wonderful Trippier).

He is what he is, an attacking fullback. If we want a defender there, we should sign one.
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I disagree on the Madrid game. We did play on the counter but I think we were reasonably comfortable to Maicon went off then we just fell apart.

Alves was playing in a back 5 against Monaco, you'd expect him to look more solid than any of the other fullbacks mentioned.

He'll be a good option to rotate against certain teams definitely. Our first choice RB won't be him, or at least I'd hope not.
 
Neville Kneville said:
He is not just cover for right back, he is also a tactical option.

Late in games Pep has tried to use people like Navas to try & stiffen up the right side (often with mixed results). Alves will be better than Navas at both ends of the pitch.

He could come on & play in front of Walker, for example & is smart enough to cause havoc on the counter attack.
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Didn't think this until watching a couple of videos this morning but his passing and vision is good enough to play pivot on occasion too. I've been saying all summer we needed somebody to cover both positions. I didn't think Alves was that player , today I think I was wrong.
 
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