Discuss Pellegrini (Pt 3)

[Anonymous]

Now Im not sure Im taking you seriously ;-) arf I dont get how anyone given our squad can be happy with the fact were 6 points off the pace to a squad so patently inferior to ours, yes possibly six of those points are howlers attributed to what we've just been discussing but were reliant on them and the other teams to start dropping a bollock or two and that doesnt sit well with me. For me given our squad we should be at least level with arse, not we need them to start dropping bollocks. They will but will we improve enough to capitalise?

:) I needed to remind you why you disagree with me so much! Seriously though we could and should be much better off points wise. But I seriously doubt that Pellegrini is under pressure and I seriously doubt that the powers that be are sat around complaining about how terrible things are going.

There's a place somewhere in the middle where both the powers that be and our more sane supporters currently reside. Pellegrini is a top manager and the team are improving with each passing game. However it's also fair to say that if the individual errors aren't sorted tout suite it will certainly come back and land at the manager's door because ultimately, that's the job. You take the plaudits for success and the criticisms for failure.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

I can see what you mean but the pivotal point appears to be that Pants needs to make mistakes so that Hart comes back a better keeper. It's all a bit too deep for me. I just thought he'd been dropped until further notice and was extrapolating from that basic fact.

Ultimately, if the manager still believes hart is the better keeper, then when Hart's form and confidence recovers I expect him to come back in the side. It's as simple as that.

The other thing here is that Pellegrini also has to manage Pantillimon. He has been so patient for so long that he will believe he deserves his chance.

Seems a fair summary if a little risky, dependent on how Hart reacts, which we cannot fully know, or how long Pants gets a chance for. However, I am comforted by your words and will now be content warming my hands at your campfire of the wait and see.

There's a risk in dropping hart and a risk in playing him. That's football and that's football management. If Hart played tomorrow you can guarantee that every camera in the stadium would be focused on his every move and the pressure on him increased hugely. If he made another howler then the situation is infinitely worse and Pellegrini would have made the wrong call very publicly.

I think this is the least-risk option. As long as Hart is managed properly behind the scenes, and I hope and believe he is being. I am sure this management team wouldn't be so stupid as to just stick up the team of the wall and leave it at that. Those days are surely behind us now.

 

[George Hannah]

He's next in the parasites' firing line...

Apparant zenophobia from the english Der Stürmer, surely not

Was Zeno's paradox that he was xenophobic?

 

[bobmcfc]

I don't agree with you on the joe hart situation or that our performances have been excellent, that simply isn't true at all. I can't talk anymore about this because you will turn it into a debate about the manager and his job and how we hate him. If you agree with him dropping joe then fine , I don't because joe is better than pantilimon. We have a home game tomorrow that would have been a way for joe to ease back into the fold.

Haha. Not nice when the shoe is on the other foot ... ;)

So really all you want is to feel smug about winning an argument ? I always thought above all else that the team and club were what was important to you but I feel it's more about point scoring. I am a big joe hart fan and feel he is being totally hung out to dry for a problem that lies with every player and coach that has participated in the games this season. I don't think this decision is correct and I don't think there would have been any glaring issues in the game tomorrow and I expect we would have seen a response after Chelsea and a big win anyway.

Im not sure the debate is worth the bother though because it's not about the love of the team and all pulling together is it . Anyway I will turn up, cheer on the team whoever starts

 

[supercity88]

How is Joe Hart being hung out to dry bob? He has made several high profile errors, he looks short of confidence and he glared down at his gloves as if he was Jimmy Grimble questioning their magic ability. He is shot of confidence. He looked to have responded well in the England games but then costs City a point and more importantly gifts Chelsea three. He has had the benefit of the doubt. It is time to drop him, nurture him, support him and get him back in confidence. It isn't a "that is it Hart, fuck off to another club". It will be about building him back up. Didsbury Dave is on the right lines, however I do not think it has to be a case of Pantilimon making a mistake to be dropped. If he performs well he will be hard to drop but should Hart recover form and show determination in training, as our no.1 goalkeeper he will be back in. Harsh on Pantilimon yes, but he is well aware that Hart is regarded as our best keeper. This is the best way to play it. Hart needs to rediscover his form and get back to basics. He is fumbling shots, and making poor decisions. Pellegrini will not drop him and have done with it, he will put an arm around him and build him back up. He will come back a better player.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

How is Joe Hart being hung out to dry bob? He has made several high profile errors, he looks short of confidence and he glared down at his gloves as if he was Jimmy Grimble questioning their magic ability. He is shot of confidence. He looked to have responded well in the England games but then costs City a point and more importantly gifts Chelsea three. He has had the benefit of the doubt. It is time to drop him, nurture him, support him and get him back in confidence. It isn't a "that is it Hart, fuck off to another club". It will be about building him back up. Didsbury Dave is on the right lines, however I do not think it has to be a case of Pantilimon making a mistake to be dropped. If he performs well he will be hard to drop but should Hart recover form and show determination in training, as our no.1 goalkeeper he will be back in. Harsh on Pantilimon yes, but he is well aware that Hart is regarded as our best keeper. This is the best way to play it. Hart needs to rediscover his form and get back to basics. He is fumbling shots, and making poor decisions. Pellegrini will not drop him and have done with it, he will put an arm around him and build him back up. He will come back a better player.

I agree and I said that in the post after: if Hart is considered the better of the two keepers then as soon as his form improves he comes back in the side, like any other players. What I meant about the mistakes is that I think pants slight quality deficiency on Joe might well become apparent over time and give Joe the impetus to grab the shirt again.

The other point no one is addressing is that Pellegrini also manages pantimillion. How do you not give him a run in the team after all that's happened, and keep him motivated? Managing him has to be part of this equation too.

 

[bobmcfc]

How is Joe Hart being hung out to dry bob? He has made several high profile errors, he looks short of confidence and he glared down at his gloves as if he was Jimmy Grimble questioning their magic ability. He is shot of confidence. He looked to have responded well in the England games but then costs City a point and more importantly gifts Chelsea three. He has had the benefit of the doubt. It is time to drop him, nurture him, support him and get him back in confidence. It isn't a "that is it Hart, fuck off to another club". It will be about building him back up. Didsbury Dave is on the right lines, however I do not think it has to be a case of Pantilimon making a mistake to be dropped. If he performs well he will be hard to drop but should Hart recover form and show determination in training, as our no.1 goalkeeper he will be back in. Harsh on Pantilimon yes, but he is well aware that Hart is regarded as our best keeper. This is the best way to play it. Hart needs to rediscover his form and get back to basics. He is fumbling shots, and making poor decisions. Pellegrini will not drop him and have done with it, he will put an arm around him and build him back up. He will come back a better player.

Dropping joe hart is a major thing, it's never been done before so we wait to see if it's the correct decision or not.
We wait...

 

[George Hannah]

if Manuel throws Joe to the wolves tomorrow it'll be another big mistake

 

[bobmcfc]

if Manuel throws Joe to the wolves tomorrow it'll be another big mistake

I don't think joe would join wolves.

 

[supercity88]

How is Joe Hart being hung out to dry bob? He has made several high profile errors, he looks short of confidence and he glared down at his gloves as if he was Jimmy Grimble questioning their magic ability. He is shot of confidence. He looked to have responded well in the England games but then costs City a point and more importantly gifts Chelsea three. He has had the benefit of the doubt. It is time to drop him, nurture him, support him and get him back in confidence. It isn't a "that is it Hart, fuck off to another club". It will be about building him back up. Didsbury Dave is on the right lines, however I do not think it has to be a case of Pantilimon making a mistake to be dropped. If he performs well he will be hard to drop but should Hart recover form and show determination in training, as our no.1 goalkeeper he will be back in. Harsh on Pantilimon yes, but he is well aware that Hart is regarded as our best keeper. This is the best way to play it. Hart needs to rediscover his form and get back to basics. He is fumbling shots, and making poor decisions. Pellegrini will not drop him and have done with it, he will put an arm around him and build him back up. He will come back a better player.

I agree and I said that in the post after: if Hart is considered the better of the two keepers then as soon as his form improves he comes back in the side, like any other players. What I meant about the mistakes is that I think pants slight quality deficiency on Joe might well become apparent over time and give Joe the impetus to grab the shirt again.

The other point no one is addressing is that Pellegrini also manages pantimillion. How do you not give him a run in the team after all that's happened, and keep him motivated? Managing him has to be part of this equation too.

Exactly, he is there for this exact situation as well as injury cover and deserves an opportunity. If Hart was to make another poor decision or costly error then my goodness Pellegrini would be under fire. This is exactly how he has had to play the situation. His job is a tough one, but I actually think this is now quite simple. Hart will still gain support off the field and Pantilimon will grow in stature thanks to being rewarded with game time. Ideally Joe comes back an improved player and Pantilimon unfortunately is back on the bench. That will be difficult, but as I said and I am sure you will agree, that is his understanding as to his role for the club. This weekends side for me is likely to be Pantilimon, Zab, Demichelis, Nastasic, Kolorov, Fernandinho, Yaya, Silva, Nasri, Aguero and Negredo. Ideally that side will keep a clean sheet and play well and win so that we can get some optimism around the Pellegrini thread.