Donald Trump

Elbow beards said:
What is it with Americans and socialism, as if it's the worst thing in the world? Some of the best countries to live in are socialist ones, Scandinavians always seem to come out top on various poles about quality of life and happiness.
Click to expand...
The extreme aversion to socialism in a large portion of the America electorate is due to many factors, many of them deeply engrained cultural beliefs (many contradictory to reality) of self-reliance and the powers of the free market, but one of the most prominent outside of those is the legacy of the “Red Scare” and McCarthyism, even though communism is different to socialism.

And that is deeply ironic, given how MAGA, supposedly the “anti-Marxist, free market capitalist” side, has cosied up to dictatorships that are anything but those things.

It is also worth noting that Trump and co constantly referring to Harris as an “EXTREME MARXIST” is not because they actually believe that (they know she isn’t). It is a very intentional tactic to attempt to muddy the ideological waters and make it seem equally irrational (to ignorant, unsophisticated, or indifferent observers) to call him and MAGA fascist.

It is a very common tactic employed by fascists. And, although it is incredibly transparent to students of history, it unfortunately works for his fan base. And those backing him that are educated and sophisticated enough to know that is what he is doing (and why) are perfectly happy to parrot it for their own aims (primarily, and again ironically, to partake in the free for all of government money and favours that would flow to sycophants after Trump regains power).

It’s also worth nothing that many Americans don’t even know what socialism is, largely due to poor education (or miseducation). Many of them are the first to scream and shout about progressive policies that are “socialism run amok and will destroy America”, whilst in the very same breath threatening to rise up en mass and hang anyone trying to cut Social Security, Medicare, or Medicaid.
 
Last edited:
AliBobbyJ said:
Trump's disgusting and I'd not shed a tear if he dropped dead. But welcoming another assassination attempt (which would disgust many) is just plain daft and shows no understanding of U.S. politics. The reaction to his death from a bullet would guarantee the election of whichever Republican candidate took his place and unleash trouble in the streets that would make Jan 6th look like a tea-party.
Click to expand...
Would you lke putin shot in the head ? How about saddam hussain, if he hadnt been hanged ? really nasty, dangerous people need taking out
 
kaz7 said:
Would you lke putin shot in the head ? How about saddam hussain, if he hadnt been hanged ? really nasty, dangerous people need taking out
Click to expand...
No, I want Putin rotting in The Hague after a long and very public trial.

Assassinating people like Putin or Trump or Netanyahu only usually acts to make the movement behind them more extreme (and radicalise more people to their cause). Their replacement is most often even worse: just ask yourself who would replace Trump if he was assassinated; hint: their surname rhymes with lance, as in drain a very problematic boil).

See nearly every assassination of a dangerous populist political or terrorist leader that has ever taken place in modern history.

It may have worked in some cases before the era of mass communication, but it doesn’t work now, when people in areas that may not have any direct geopolitical involvement with a cause or conflict can be recruited and radicalised. And there is almost no way to slow or suppress information sharing within these groups.

Political violence almost never achieves its goals, and almost always makes a bad situation worse.

Assassinating Trump now would not only likely hand MAGA the election, it would throw the country in to absolute chaos, and that would be bad for everyone.

He needs to lose the election, be rightly found guilty for all of his criminal and treasonous acts, and put in prison.

Will that solve all of the issues America is currently facing or lead to the complete dissolution of MAGA as a movement? No.

But it is the only option that does not make things worse for everyone.
 
Last edited:
SebastianBlue said:
The extreme aversion to socialism in a large portion of the America electorate is due to many factors, many of them deeply engrained cultural beliefs (many contradictory to reality) of self-reliance and the powers of the free market, but one of the most prominent outside of those is the legacy of the “Red Scare” and McCarthyism, even though communism is different to socialism.

And that is deeply ironic, given how MAGA, supposedly the “anti-Marxist, free market capitalist” side, has cosied up to dictatorships that are anything both those things.

It is also worth noting that Trump and co constantly referring to Harris as an “EXTREME MARXIST” is not because they actually believe that (they know she isn’t). It is a very intentional tactic to attempt to muddy the ideological waters and make it seem equally irrational (to ignorant, unsophisticated, or indifferent observers) to call him and MAGA fascist.

It is a very common tactic by fascists. And, although it is incredibly transparent to students of history, it unfortunately works for his fan base. And those backing him that are educated and sophisticated enough to know that is what he is doing (and why) are perfectly happy to parrot it for their own aims (primarily, and again ironically, to partake in the free for all of government money and favours that would flow to sycophants after Trump regains power).

It’s also worth nothing that many Americans don’t even know what socialism is, largely due to poor education (or miseducation). Many of them are the first to scream and shout about progressive policies that are “socialism run amok and will destroy America”, whilst in the very same breath threatening to rise up en mass and hang anyone trying to cut Social Security, Medicare, or Medicaid.
Click to expand...
The centre of politics in the US is well to the right of our own position. Many Americans believe that anyone to the left of, say Boris, is a socialist.
The best recent example was the debate on Obama care in which it was claimed that the NHS in the UK ran ‘Death Panels’ to decide who lived and who died.
In 1947, the labour gov negotiated a large loan from the US partly to pay for the launch of the NHS. There was a fierce debate in Congress with many claiming: “We should not lend to the UK so it can turn itself into a socialist state.”
 
SebastianBlue said:
No, I want Putin rotting in The Hague after a long and very public trial.

Assassinating people like Putin or Trump or Netanyahu only usually acts to make the movement behind them more extreme (and radicalise more people to their cause). Their replacement is most often even worse: just ask yourself who would replace Trump if he was assassinated; hint: their surname rhymes with lance, as in drain a very problematic boil).

See nearly every assassination of a dangerous populist political or terrorist leader that has ever taken place in modern history.

It may have worked in some cases before the era of mass communication, but it doesn’t work now, when people in areas that may not have any direct geopolitical involvement with a cause or conflict can be recruited and radicalised. And there is almost no way to slow or suppress information sharing within these groups.

Political violence almost never achieves its goals, and almost always makes a bad situation worse.

Assassinating Trump now would not only likely hand MAGA the election, it would through the country in to absolute chaos, and that would be bad for everyone.

He needs to lose the election, be rightly found guilty for all of his criminal and treasonous acts, and put in prison.

Will that solve all of the issues America is currently facing or lead to the complete dissolution of MAGA as a movement? No.

But it is the only option that does not make things worse for everyone.
Click to expand...
Fair points as always , still i wouldnt cry over him
 
kaz7 said:
Would you lke putin shot in the head ? How about saddam hussain, if he hadnt been hanged ? really nasty, dangerous people need taking out
Click to expand...
what a stupid think to say.

You cant just decide who you don't like and take them out. I'm guessing if it was Trump saying this you would be outraged.
Who decides if you are a really nasty, dangerous person? Is there a test or just Kaz7 said so.

Trump will win the election and he will win because of people like you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top
✖
  AdBlock Detected
Bluemoon relies on advertising to pay our hosting fees. Please support the site by disabling your ad blocking software to help keep the forum sustainable. Thanks.