Donald Trump

There's some very evil people behind him and these are people who want us dead if we do not subscribe to their view of the world.
He's got enough would-be Quislings and concentration camp guards all over Europe too.
You only have to look at the Conservative Party.
 
First of all, there’s not going to be a “revolution”. 98 percent of what you hear comes from keyboard warriors and those stupid enough to talk to reporters and cameras. So let’s calm down a little. There probably will be the odd Oklahoma City bombing redux by a nutter or two. But hundreds of thousands taking up arms and somehow unified under Donald Trump, a man who can’t fill a 6,000 person arena by more than a third deep in “Trump country”? With no lieutenants who can control and motivate the movement? Come on.

Second, here’s what’s actually happening: read this. I know a lot about Shasta County. I owned property there for 30 years. I don’t know Mary Rickert (referred to in the article) but I know her husband quite well as he was a limited partner in the property I owned. We are seeing backlash against the most rabid forms of MAGA when it comes to local government. This isn’t an isolated case either. Folks are getting tired of extremism — it’s not winning new converts and it’s not governing effectively. I’m not a Pollyanna — I know there are risks when you’re down to two candidates. But those of you not here can’t see the exhaustion. Regular people want regular, quiet lives. Many have had enough. I am growing more confident daily that Trump will lose, for now.

 
First of all, there’s not going to be a “revolution”. 98 percent of what you hear comes from keyboard warriors and those stupid enough to talk to reporters and cameras. So let’s calm down a little. There probably will be the odd Oklahoma City bombing redux by a nutter or two. But hundreds of thousands taking up arms and somehow unified under Donald Trump, a man who can’t fill a 6,000 person arena by more than a third deep in “Trump country”? With no lieutenants who can control and motivate the movement? Come on.

Second, here’s what’s actually happening: read this. I know a lot about Shasta County. I owned property there for 30 years. I don’t know Mary Rickert (referred to in the article) but I know her husband quite well as he was a limited partner in the property I owned. We are seeing backlash against the most rabid forms of MAGA when it comes to local government. This isn’t an isolated case either. Folks are getting tired of extremism — it’s not winning new converts and it’s not governing effectively. I’m not a Pollyanna — I know there are risks when you’re down to two candidates. But those of you not here can’t see the exhaustion. Regular people want regular, quiet lives. Many have had enough. I am growing more confident daily that Trump will lose, for now.

I appreciate the optimism.

Living in the US, seeing various things play out in my local community, and in the surrounding communities, I certainly see resistance but not the same type of exhaustion with—or level of effectiveness in combatting—the insidious nature of far-right machinations.

In fact, I see a lot of exhaustion and part-resignation from those attempting to combat it here. I know a number of people that have run for local city councils, school boards, and a few other government seats. Some have been elected, sat on the council or boards, become incredibly jaded and tired of the immense level of effort and abuse inherent with working to oppose the far-right influence and programs of nonsensical disruption and government dysfunction, and have then chosen not to stand for additional terms (or even quit outright after the abuse they and their loved ones received from far-right leaning constituents became too much).

Some weren’t successful in getting elected at all, instead being beat-out by far-right adjacent candidates even after those candidates were publicly found to have broken city and state campaign and finance rules (leading to public admonishment and fines from election officials, but not disqualification). It just happened to my next door neighbour who ran for city council and a friend who was running for the state legislature (I did what I could to help their campaign, mostly doing free election analytics and email canvassing work given my limited capacity now). The former (and her friend that was also running for a different district in our city) was beat out by a group of candidates that essentially represent local commercial and residential real estate development and brokerage companies. That group was running on a platform of “stop crime, get rid of the homeless, stand with Trump’s ‘America First’ policies”. Their solution to crime and homelessness was to bus unhoused people to larger cities to the south, including Boston, and to close (and/or relocate outside city limits) shelters and substance abuse treatment centres.

A week before the election, via a clandestinely created PAC, they had launched Facebook and Instagram ads specifically targeting my neighbour, her friend, and another candidate they deemed progressive. The ads claimed they were all for higher crime, more homeless in the streets, and the economic destruction of the city. These were Trump-style attack ads at the small city level, which was a first from what my neighbour said. None of the targeted candidates won a seat, and two of the four real estate tied conservative candidates behind the attack ads won their seats. The council, which had marginally flipped liberal in the last election, flipped back to firmly conservative, and the chair (which is functionally the mayor of the city) is now the most far-right leaning member. It was the third time my neighbour had run and she now doesn’t know if she’ll run again. Her efforts, and the ridiculousness of the process—including her kids getting abuse at school—has soured her on it. And it was worse for the person I know here that quit the school board of the neighbouring town. She actually received anonymous death threats at one point after she publicly defended the school library and curriculum including several LGBTQ+ books.

Their experience is, unfortunately, intentional and it isn’t unique to this area. Many other progressives are being (or have been) worn down and/or intimidated to the point of resignation by a movement that is becoming more extreme (and hostile) in their tactics, precisely because it has been largely reduced down to the most belligerent zealots. They may be fewer in number than in 2020 (or 2016), but what they lack in comparative numbers they more than make up for in sheer brazenness of their hostile tactics.

For every story like the one you shared (which is great, and I have seen others like it), I would wager there are two or three like the ones I have shared that aren’t written about at all, for various reason (some obvious).

So you can see why I am less positive.

And I think you and I saw the likelihood of a January 6th type event happening differently before it occurred. I know I tend to be seen as more pessimistic when it comes to these types of situations, but I genuinely believe pessimism is both more useful (and more accurate) in the current political climate.

All of that said, as I stated earlier in the thread,
I certainly hope I am wrong about what I believe is likely to happen later this year and next year (especially if Trump wins a second term). But I have been fairly spot on with my predictions since 2017 (I made the mistake of believing there was no way Trump could win in 2016).

If it helps, I am not predicting a “revolution”. But I do think there will be armed clashes involving various militant, hyper-loyalist (and/or opportunistic) groups partly incited by Trump and his cronies if he doesn’t win a second term.

And, if he does, I am very confident he will do his best to avoid accountability for everything he did during and after his first term and rip up the constitution to allow him to both strengthen his power and stay in office in order to avoid all accountability and personal ruin.
 
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I appreciate the optimism.

Living in the US, seeing various things play out in my local community, and in the surrounding communities, I certainly see resistance but not the same type of exhaustion with—or level of effectiveness in combatting—the insidious nature of far-right machinations.

In fact, I see a lot of exhaustion and part-resignation from those attempting to combat it here. I know a number of people that have run for local city councils, school boards, and a few other government seats. Some have been elected, sat on the council or boards, become incredibly jaded and tired of the immense level of effort and abuse inherent with working to oppose the far-right influence and programs of nonsensical disruption and government dysfunction, and have then chosen not to stand for additional terms (or even quit outright after the abuse they and their loved ones received from far-right leaning constituents became too much).

Some weren’t successful in getting elected at all, instead being beat-out by far-right adjacent candidates even after those candidates were publicly found to have broken city and state campaign and finance rules (leading to public admonishment and fines from election officials, but not disqualification). It just happened to my next door neighbour who ran for city council and a friend who was running for the state legislature (I did what I could to help their campaign, mostly doing free election analytics and email canvassing work given my limited capacity now). The former (and her friend that was also running for a different district in our city) was beat out by a group of candidates that essentially represent local commercial and residential real estate development and brokerage companies. That group was running on a platform of “stop crime, get rid of the homeless, stand with Trump’s ‘America First’ policies”. Their solution to crime and homelessness was to bus unhoused people to larger cities to the south, including Boston, and to close (and/or relocate outside city limits) shelters and substance abuse treatment centres.

A week before the election, via a clandestinely created PAC, they had launched Facebook and Instagram ads specifically targeting my neighbour, her friend, and another candidate they deemed progressive. The ads claimed they were all for higher crime, more homeless in the streets, and the economic destruction of the city. These were Trump-style attack ads at the small city level, which was a first from what my neighbour said. None of the targeted candidates won a seat, and two of the four real estate tied conservative candidates behind the attack ads won their seats. The council, which had marginally flipped liberal in the last election, flipped back to firmly conservative, and the chair (which is functionally the mayor of the city) is now the most far-right leaning member. It was the third time my neighbour had run and she now doesn’t know if she’ll run again. Her efforts, and the ridiculousness of the process—including her kids getting abuse at school—has soured her on it. And it was worse for the person I know here that quit the school board of the neighbouring town. She actually received anonymous death threats at one point after she publicly defended the school library and curriculum including several LGBTQ+ books.

Their experience is, unfortunately, intentional and it isn’t unique to this area. Many other progressives are being (or have been) worn down and/or intimidated to the point of resignation by a movement that is becoming more extreme (and hostile) in their tactics, precisely because it has been largely reduced down to the most belligerent zealots. They may be fewer in number than in 2020 (or 2016), but what they lack in comparative numbers they more than make up for in sheer brazenness of their hostile tactics.

For every story like the one you shared (which is great, and I have seen others like it), I would wager there are two or three like the ones I have shared that aren’t written about at all, for various reason (some obvious).

So you can see why I am less positive.

And I think you and I saw the likelihood of a January 6th type event happening differently before it occurred. I know I tend to be seen as more pessimistic when it comes to these types of situations, but I genuinely believe pessimism is both more useful (and more accurate) in the current political climate.

All of that said, as I stated earlier in the thread,
I certainly hope I am wrong about what I believe is likely to happen later this year and next year (especially if Trump wins a second term). But I have been fairly spot on with my predictions since 2017 (I made the mistake of believing there was no way Trump could win in 2016).

If it helps, I am not predicting a “revolution”. But I do think there will be armed clashes involving various militant, hyper-loyalist (and/or opportunistic) groups partly incited by Trump and his cronies if he doesn’t win a second term.

And, if he does, I am very confident he will do his best to avoid accountability for everything he did during and after his first term and rip up the constitution to allow him to both strengthen his power and stay in office in order to avoid all accountability and personal ruin.
I suppose it is all a matter of one’s point of view. You’re in Florida, yes, Seb? Those are sad tales and I have heard them too. I also concur that Trump will stop at nothing and his only true goals are to insulate himself from responsibility for his crimes and to enrich himself to a point where he can insure that insulation (the two ends work hand in hand). But I also think more and more folks are beginning to see through that as the noose slowly (frustratingly slowly many would say) tightens.

Right now extremists are emboldened by having to take little responsibility for their extremism when it’s talk — there are few consequences. And while you may see opposition as tired I also think there is an element of confidence since Jan 6 that the system has not broken down entirely because consequences were real for many of who participated.
 
First of all, there’s not going to be a “revolution”. 98 percent of what you hear comes from keyboard warriors and those stupid enough to talk to reporters and cameras. So let’s calm down a little. There probably will be the odd Oklahoma City bombing redux by a nutter or two. But hundreds of thousands taking up arms and somehow unified under Donald Trump, a man who can’t fill a 6,000 person arena by more than a third deep in “Trump country”? With no lieutenants who can control and motivate the movement? Come on.


I hope your confidence isn't misplaced, from over here in sunny England, it seemed you were a whisker away from Handmaids Tale just a few short years ago.

Hopefully America will see sense when the time comes and there will be measures in place to prevent any form of resistance to the electoral result
 
I appreciate the optimism.

Living in the US, seeing various things play out in my local community, and in the surrounding communities, I certainly see resistance but not the same type of exhaustion with—or level of effectiveness in combatting—the insidious nature of far-right machinations.

In fact, I see a lot of exhaustion and part-resignation from those attempting to combat it here. I know a number of people that have run for local city councils, school boards, and a few other government seats. Some have been elected, sat on the council or boards, become incredibly jaded and tired of the immense level of effort and abuse inherent with working to oppose the far-right influence and programs of nonsensical disruption and government dysfunction, and have then chosen not to stand for additional terms (or even quit outright after the abuse they and their loved ones received from far-right leaning constituents became too much).

Some weren’t successful in getting elected at all, instead being beat-out by far-right adjacent candidates even after those candidates were publicly found to have broken city and state campaign and finance rules (leading to public admonishment and fines from election officials, but not disqualification). It just happened to my next door neighbour who ran for city council and a friend who was running for the state legislature (I did what I could to help their campaign, mostly doing free election analytics and email canvassing work given my limited capacity now). The former (and her friend that was also running for a different district in our city) was beat out by a group of candidates that essentially represent local commercial and residential real estate development and brokerage companies. That group was running on a platform of “stop crime, get rid of the homeless, stand with Trump’s ‘America First’ policies”. Their solution to crime and homelessness was to bus unhoused people to larger cities to the south, including Boston, and to close (and/or relocate outside city limits) shelters and substance abuse treatment centres.

A week before the election, via a clandestinely created PAC, they had launched Facebook and Instagram ads specifically targeting my neighbour, her friend, and another candidate they deemed progressive. The ads claimed they were all for higher crime, more homeless in the streets, and the economic destruction of the city. These were Trump-style attack ads at the small city level, which was a first from what my neighbour said. None of the targeted candidates won a seat, and two of the four real estate tied conservative candidates behind the attack ads won their seats. The council, which had marginally flipped liberal in the last election, flipped back to firmly conservative, and the chair (which is functionally the mayor of the city) is now the most far-right leaning member. It was the third time my neighbour had run and she now doesn’t know if she’ll run again. Her efforts, and the ridiculousness of the process—including her kids getting abuse at school—has soured her on it. And it was worse for the person I know here that quit the school board of the neighbouring town. She actually received anonymous death threats at one point after she publicly defended the school library and curriculum including several LGBTQ+ books.

Their experience is, unfortunately, intentional and it isn’t unique to this area. Many other progressives are being (or have been) worn down and/or intimidated to the point of resignation by a movement that is becoming more extreme (and hostile) in their tactics, precisely because it has been largely reduced down to the most belligerent zealots. They may be fewer in number than in 2020 (or 2016), but what they lack in comparative numbers they more than make up for in sheer brazenness of their hostile tactics.

For every story like the one you shared (which is great, and I have seen others like it), I would wager there are two or three like the ones I have shared that aren’t written about at all, for various reason (some obvious).

So you can see why I am less positive.

And I think you and I saw the likelihood of a January 6th type event happening differently before it occurred. I know I tend to be seen as more pessimistic when it comes to these types of situations, but I genuinely believe pessimism is both more useful (and more accurate) in the current political climate.

All of that said, as I stated earlier in the thread,
I certainly hope I am wrong about what I believe is likely to happen later this year and next year (especially if Trump wins a second term). But I have been fairly spot on with my predictions since 2017 (I made the mistake of believing there was no way Trump could win in 2016).

If it helps, I am not predicting a “revolution”. But I do think there will be armed clashes involving various militant, hyper-loyalist (and/or opportunistic) groups partly incited by Trump and his cronies if he doesn’t win a second term.

And, if he does, I am very confident he will do his best to avoid accountability for everything he did during and after his first term and rip up the constitution to allow him to both strengthen his power and stay in office in order to avoid all accountability and personal ruin.
I doubt it's as bad or overt as that but, in the UK, online abuse is dissuading many people from standing as local government candidates (or standing again).
 

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