Empty seats.. worsening trend?

[moomba]

Your talking absolute crap by denying the basic laws of supply and demand.

For a start, the number of people who would have their cards taken away under your plan is minimal. You've said yourself that you wouldn't include people that have a valid reason such as sickness, work etc. So to suggest that this would have any sort of significant influence on pricing is simply dishonest.

Secondly, if say 500 people had their cards taken away, they would be bought by someone else as a season ticket. This person may or may not currently go to games. But the person who had their season card taken off them may or may not still go to games on a match by match basis. There is no way of knowing the impact this would have on demand for matches. You've presumed that taking 500 season cards away reduces demand for games on a match by match basis by 500. Simply not the case.

Thirdly, if we start taking peoples cards away from them the club may decide that we don't have enough people willing to commit £600+ on seaosn tickets to make the redevelopment of the North Stand worthwhile. More seats increases supply which can have a positive result on pricing.

You only want to look at the laws of supply and demand that suit your argument.

 

[moomba]

Games sold out but lots of empty seats.

These are the reasons why.

Problem 1: Club staff and certain youth players/families get complimentary tickets. These tickets are mostly based in tier one of the family stand and often aren't used since the beneficiaries are not all City fans. This means lots of empty seats behind the goal.

Fix 1: Put all complimentary tickets in the new third tiers. Have staff/youth/families have to apply for the tickets, so that they are only activated if they will make the game.

Problem 2: Viagogo get a batch of tickets to go with their ticket exchange deal. These tickets don't get sold as many fans refuse to pay the extra costs unless it is a big game.

Fix 2: End the Viagogo deal and have an in house ticket exchange site. More fans will use it to buy and sell. The batch originally given to viagogo can then be sold through the club.

Problem 3: Many complimentary tickets are given to our large number (& growing) of sponsors. These often don't get used unless the games are big.

Fix 3: Similar to fix 1, put these tickets in the new third tiers. This is what they do at Utd. Nobody notices if they don't get used.

Problem 4: Some season ticket holders can't/dont attend every game.

Fix 4: That's life. Make it easier for them to sell their ticket for the day with an official easy to use ticket exchange.

Good sensible solutions.

 

[pardoeofftomexico]

In fact as others have pointed out, the minority of season ticket holders who don't go on a regular basis may well be inflating ticket prices for everyone else.

Absolute crap, there is no justification for saying that.

And pricing does have an impact. Transport to games even if you've paid for your ticket, food/drink, parking etc

Your talking absolute crap by denying the basic laws of supply and demand.

This debate is going around in circles. Where I sit everybody nearby turns up most every game. If the very few who have season tickets and don't go very often gave them up they would simply have been sold at the same price to people on the waiting list. This may have slightly reduced the demand for one off tickets but I cannot seriously believe it would have had any reflection whatsoever on price. As mentioned previously the clubs only objective has to be to find the optimum ticket price that maximises income.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Your talking absolute crap by denying the basic laws of supply and demand.

For a start, the number of people who would have their cards taken away under your plan is minimal. You've said yourself that you wouldn't include people that have a valid reason such as sickness, work etc. So to suggest that this would have any sort of significant influence on pricing is simply dishonest.

Secondly, if say 500 people had their cards taken away, they would be bought by someone else as a season ticket. This person may or may not currently go to games. But the person who had their season card taken off them may or may not still go to games on a match by match basis. There is no way of knowing the impact this would have on demand for matches. You've presumed that taking 500 season cards away reduces demand for games on a match by match basis by 500. Simply not the case.

Thirdly, if we start taking peoples cards away from them the club may decide that we don't have enough people willing to commit £600+ on seaosn tickets to make the redevelopment of the North Stand worthwhile. More seats increases supply which can have a positive result on pricing.

You only want to look at the laws of supply and demand that suit your argument.

My preference would be for nobody to lose their season card. After all, the people who say they miss a few games usually ensure that friends or family use the tickets whenever they can.

If a couple of hundred people re-evaluate how they buy their season cards and go down the Citizen Card - rather than choosing to renew season cards, that would be a win win IMHO!

To me these are pretty minor issues (and things like the atmospheres are bigger priorities as other poster have said). However, it is the Bluemooner who try to shout down others who wish to raise these issues who have pushed this thread towards the 50 page Mark. Otherwise it would have run out of steam long ago!

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Games sold out but lots of empty seats.

These are the reasons why.

Problem 1: Club staff and certain youth players/families get complimentary tickets. These tickets are mostly based in tier one of the family stand and often aren't used since the beneficiaries are not all City fans. This means lots of empty seats behind the goal.

Fix 1: Put all complimentary tickets in the new third tiers. Have staff/youth/families have to apply for the tickets, so that they are only activated if they will make the game.

Problem 2: Viagogo get a batch of tickets to go with their ticket exchange deal. These tickets don't get sold as many fans refuse to pay the extra costs unless it is a big game.

Fix 2: End the Viagogo deal and have an in house ticket exchange site. More fans will use it to buy and sell. The batch originally given to viagogo can then be sold through the club.

Problem 3: Many complimentary tickets are given to our large number (& growing) of sponsors. These often don't get used unless the games are big.

Fix 3: Similar to fix 1, put these tickets in the new third tiers. This is what they do at Utd. Nobody notices if they don't get used.

Problem 4: Some season ticket holders can't/dont attend every game.

Fix 4: That's life. Make it easier for them to sell their ticket for the day with an official easy to use ticket exchange.

Good solutions and you are right to raise non attendance in corporate seats!

 

[blueincy]

Games sold out but lots of empty seats.

These are the reasons why.

Problem 1: Club staff and certain youth players/families get complimentary tickets. These tickets are mostly based in tier one of the family stand and often aren't used since the beneficiaries are not all City fans. This means lots of empty seats behind the goal.

Fix 1: Put all complimentary tickets in the new third tiers. Have staff/youth/families have to apply for the tickets, so that they are only activated if they will make the game.

Problem 2: Viagogo get a batch of tickets to go with their ticket exchange deal. These tickets don't get sold as many fans refuse to pay the extra costs unless it is a big game.

Fix 2: End the Viagogo deal and have an in house ticket exchange site. More fans will use it to buy and sell. The batch originally given to viagogo can then be sold through the club.

Problem 3: Many complimentary tickets are given to our large number (& growing) of sponsors. These often don't get used unless the games are big.

Fix 3: Similar to fix 1, put these tickets in the new third tiers. This is what they do at Utd. Nobody notices if they don't get used.

Problem 4: Some season ticket holders can't/dont attend every game.

Fix 4: That's life. Make it easier for them to sell their ticket for the day with an official easy to use ticket exchange.

Problem 5: Give you a job at the club because it's blatantly obvious it's run by idiots.

Fix 5: Saving the club Thousands in wages getting rid of the clueless cunts.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Absolute crap, there is no justification for saying that.

And pricing does have an impact. Transport to games even if you've paid for your ticket, food/drink, parking etc

Your talking absolute crap by denying the basic laws of supply and demand.

This debate is going around in circles. Where I sit everybody nearby turns up most every game. If the very few who have season tickets and don't go very often gave them up they would simply have been sold at the same price to people on the waiting list. This may have slightly reduced the demand for one off tickets but I cannot seriously believe it would have had any reflection whatsoever on price. As mentioned previously the clubs only objective has to be to find the optimum ticket price that maximises income.

Yes the supply and demand issue in this case wouldn't make a huge difference. However, as you correctly point out, the club set out to maximise match day revenue with tickets being the main factor. The job descriptions of some staff include "monetising" fans so seeing seats empty that people have paid for could encourage the Club to increase prices. I hope that we have affordable pricing and continue to build our support!

 

[Indestructable]

As I live down south I have to travel to home games and I have become fed up with kick off times. There are too many that aren't practical for me and I am gradually getting out of the habit of going to games. I am guessing there must be others like me that have the same problem.
I know there are fans more dedicated than me, but driving 270 miles home on a Sunday evening and then getting up at 6 for work the next morning is rubbish.
In January I am skipping all 3 games as New years day and 2 Sunday games one of which is the Arsenal game. Also had to skip the Chelsea game for the same reason and Liverpool game was on a Monday night.

Still I have Hull City to look forward to...

 

[Damocles]

Point B is complete bullshit, as has been pointed out by several posters

Might as well tell the owner to sling his hook too as I'm sure I've only seen him take his seat once

The owner's seat is corporate / hospitality so would be exempt.

Yes some posters wouldn't like a requirement for their seat to be used for more games. We've also heard from families who couldn't get into games because of the "sold out" signs. Maybe the Bayern approach wouldn't work for us but I would like to see it tried out so we know!

Might I suggest you get a seasoncard there then, instead of trolling the posters of this forum

He's right in a roundabout way.

People buying season tickets DOES inflate the price for everybody else; it's a basic law of supply and demand. Whether they turn up or not is somewhat irrelevant to that but the theory is sound.

I also do think that anybody who buys a ticket and doesn't turn up for more than 4 games should then start to be given "negative points" where any future non-attendance will result in them losing loyalty points. Don't buy a season ticket if you're not going to turn up, pretty simple that

 

[Tim of the Oak]

The owner's seat is corporate / hospitality so would be exempt.

Yes some posters wouldn't like a requirement for their seat to be used for more games. We've also heard from families who couldn't get into games because of the "sold out" signs. Maybe the Bayern approach wouldn't work for us but I would like to see it tried out so we know!

Might I suggest you get a seasoncard there then, instead of trolling the posters of this forum

He's right in a roundabout way.

People buying season tickets DOES inflate the price for everybody else; it's a basic law of supply and demand. Whether they turn up or not is somewhat irrelevant to that but the theory is sound.

I also do think that anybody who buys a ticket and doesn't turn up for more than 4 games should then start to be given "negative points" where any future non-attendance will result in them losing loyalty points. Don't buy a season ticket if you're not going to turn up, pretty simple that

Spot on Damocles!