England Thread - 2022/23

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Lovebitesandeveryfing said:
I thought about starting a new thread for this, but it doesn't quite seem to warrant its own one.

Here's my question.
When was the last time, in your opinion, that the England national team had a genuinely ‘big’ manager? I mean by this a manager of vision, of excellent tactical sense, and finely tuned man management skills. A manager equal to what is supposed to be the most prestigious appointment in the land?
N.b. this might includes managers who just didn't have a gifted generation of footballers to hand (which is emphaticaly not the present case, in my view). Their success might have been hamstrung by that.
My own view is that it probably goes back to Bobby Robson. Yes, as far back as that. He got us to a world cup semi-final, and we were desperately unlucky to lose it. I felt at the time, and I feel now, that that was a team that should have won the world cup. There was a good fit, for once, between manager and players. I honestly did not feel that about the team that Southgate got to the semi-final in Russia.
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History has been re-written about Robson. He did very well at Ipswich as a young manager. But the press who now speak of him like he was a Saint, were all over him after he announced he was leaving before the 1990 World Cup and it’s been well documented that it took virtually a mutiny by the senior players after the awful opening draw with Ireland to get him to change the formation. Even then it took a scrappy 1-0 win against Egypt to get out of the group. I’m not knocking him by the way. I had some great times watching England in those days. I’m just pointing out that the difference between being judged a huge success and an abstract failure at international level can be as little as a stroke of luck here or a bad referring decision there.
 
Lovebitesandeveryfing said:
I thought about starting a new thread for this, but it doesn't quite seem to warrant its own one.

Here's my question.
When was the last time, in your opinion, that the England national team had a genuinely ‘big’ manager? I mean by this a manager of vision, of excellent tactical sense, and finely tuned man management skills. A manager equal to what is supposed to be the most prestigious appointment in the land?
N.b. this might includes managers who just didn't have a gifted generation of footballers to hand (which is emphaticaly not the present case, in my view). Their success might have been hamstrung by that.
My own view is that it probably goes back to Bobby Robson. Yes, as far back as that. He got us to a world cup semi-final, and we were desperately unlucky to lose it. I felt at the time, and I feel now, that that was a team that should have won the world cup. There was a good fit, for once, between manager and players. I honestly did not feel that about the team that Southgate got to the semi-final in Russia.
Click to expand...

Capello. He had won countless trophies. And the CL. Sven had won a lot too. Capello had the issue of club rivalries causing disharmony and he just didn't grasp the English culture with strict rules that were unnecessary. He burnt out the players before 2010 but we also had significant injuries pre-tournament. Sven was balanced and unlucky with injuries, we should have won Euro 2004 but the Rooney injury put pay to that.

Venables got the culture but in Euro 96 he didn't make a sub in that semi and we had players like Les Ferdinand on the bench who could have kept Southgate away from the shootout. Southgate's style is a carbon copy of Venables. Squad unity over tactical nous. Venables had more of that though. He is cursed by his own nightmares with England hence his obsession with penalties. We have improved with him of course in that regard but his nervousness at losing games means he only makes changes when things are going wrong, not before they get to that situation. Reactive not proactive.
 
Is it really any wonder that so many fans prioritise following their club rather than the England mob?

Didn't we have a poll on here recently wher 98 or 99 per cent of Bluemooners put love of City above interest in the national side?

I know I do,and I'm sure fans of many other clubs do the same. Their teams may not win loads of trophies, but at least the fans usually get commitment - and entertainment.

As someone posted here earlier, we have been so spoiled by what we see at City that watching international football (and not just England) bears little resemblance to the modern game as we have got used to it with our great club.
 
Lovebitesandeveryfing said:
I thought about starting a new thread for this, but it doesn't quite seem to warrant its own one.

Here's my question.
When was the last time, in your opinion, that the England national team had a genuinely ‘big’ manager? I mean by this a manager of vision, of excellent tactical sense, and finely tuned man management skills. A manager equal to what is supposed to be the most prestigious appointment in the land?
N.b. this might includes managers who just didn't have a gifted generation of footballers to hand (which is emphaticaly not the present case, in my view). Their success might have been hamstrung by that.
My own view is that it probably goes back to Bobby Robson. Yes, as far back as that. He got us to a world cup semi-final, and we were desperately unlucky to lose it. I felt at the time, and I feel now, that that was a team that should have won the world cup. There was a good fit, for once, between manager and players. I honestly did not feel that about the team that Southgate got to the semi-final in Russia.
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Venables and Robson before him.
 
They'll need a political distraction to make us forget how shite they are.
 
supercity88 said:
Capello. He had won countless trophies. And the CL. Sven had won a lot too. Capello had the issue of club rivalries causing disharmony and he just didn't grasp the English culture with strict rules that were unnecessary. He burnt out the players before 2010 but we also had significant injuries pre-tournament. Sven was balanced and unlucky with injuries, we should have won Euro 2004 but the Rooney injury put pay to that.

Venables got the culture but in Euro 96 he didn't make a sub in that semi and we had players like Les Ferdinand on the bench who could have kept Southgate away from the shootout. Southgate's style is a carbon copy of Venables. Squad unity over tactical nous. Venables had more of that though. He is cursed by his own nightmares with England hence his obsession with penalties. We have improved with him of course in that regard but his nervousness at losing games means he only makes changes when things are going wrong, not before they get to that situation. Reactive not proactive.
Click to expand...

Venables played good football and had the nation behind him
Capello played shite football and was as dull as waistcoat
Sven was star struck by the players and refused to pick a team based on balance rather than names. He had the best squad for decades and was a complete failure with the resources he had. He actually destroyed my enjoyment in following England and it hasn’t returned since.

Any manager should be judged on what they achieved with the talent they possessed and the opposition they faced.
 
hilts said:
Venables played good football and had the nation behind him
Capello played shite football and was as dull as waistcoat
Sven was star struck by the players and refused to pick a team based on balance rather than names. He had the best squad for decades and was a complete failure with the resources he had. He actually destroyed my enjoyment in following England and it hasn’t returned since.

Any manager should be judged on what they achieved with the talent they possessed and the opposition they faced.
Click to expand...
That wasn’t the question though. Capello is probably the biggest and most successful manager England have ever hired.

Sadly, he was shit for us.
 
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