Etihad Campus, Stadium and Collar Site Development Thread

[Saddleworth2]

TBH I’m more than a little frustrated that there hasn’t even been a proposal for the Collar site made public, let alone a planning application submitted, and a start on site, 14 years on Since Sheikh Mansour bought the club.

I’m with you on this. It would have been brilliant if they had pushed forward with development. Even a hotel and some descent bars on site would be good. Maybe the arena is what was needed to make them viable.

 

[Bluesince1979]

I think United’s singing section is for all ages, their only rules are that you have to sing and you can’t get your phone out.

I think people receive emails if they’ve been seen to be not contributing or seen with their phone out during the game in the singing section and if it continues they’d be asked to leave the area.

Yeah was 100% sure on the nitty gritty

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

I think United’s singing section is for all ages, their only rules are that you have to sing and you can’t get your phone out.

I think people receive emails if they’ve been seen to be not contributing or seen with their phone out during the game in the singing section and if it continues they’d be asked to leave the area.

So a bit like the Gestapo then?

 

[petrusha]

I and many other would agree on the benefits of timing.

However, others will have reams of trends data, demographic analysis, population forecasts, occupancy %, fiscal returns etc that will or has shaped their decisions.

Rich people remain rich by getting the key decisions right !!

It was 2008 when Manchester City Council first raised the prospect of redeveloping land around the stadium in conjunction with City's new owners. At that point, I had a couple of very good contacts who were well placed to provide information who are no longer in the same posts.

I believe the intention at that stage was for Abu Dhabi to give the project a helping hand by investing in it as a prestige project rather than on strictly commercial terms as well as to assist in other ways. One example of the latter was that state-owned Abu Dhabi companies were intended office space in a new development to house their European HQs and help kick-start the Etihad Campus development project.

I was told that, in 2012, things changed politically in Abu Dhabi. Projects overseas were now to pay their own way rather than receiving beneficial treatment for reasons of prestige. Unfortunately, in the age of austerity, CFG were unable to find partners willing to enter into a relationship on acceptable commercial terms. Forget ideas that the economy was still growing. Incomes for many people were falling in real terms, meaning that leisure operators saw such projects as a risk given that such a large proportion of the prospective punters were really having to tighten their belts.

The arena will hopefully be a game-changer in that respect, by drawing large numbers of people to the site and making other development viable. It will already be a game-changer in terms of the offer for fans attending the stadium: in an interview with Tim Leiweke of OVG (the entertainment giant behind the arena) in this week's Sunday Times, it was stated that the new venue will include "32 bars, restaurants and clubs" which will be open on matchday.

That interview with Leiweke also contained the following snippet of information regarding OVG's prospective construction of an arena in Cardiff:

The current economic environment does not make [building such venues] easy - as he has found out in Cardiff, where he is preparing to build a site. Soaring steel prices have put the economics of the project at risk; the initial quote was GBP 180 million but it rocketed to above GBP 300 million as iron ore prices jumped. They are slowly coming back down and now Leiweke is playing the waiting game.

He isn't playing a waiting game in Manchester because the construction of Co-op Live has never been put on hold, albeit that construction is behind schedule. So what's different in God's own city that doesn't apply in the Welsh capital? Could it be that, back in May 2021, CFG agreed to become a 50/50 joint venture partner, meaning that increased costs and future risks are shared.

CFG, then, evidently believe in this project. The next step is probably a hotel. It makes sense, as mooted in this thread, for the hotel to incorporate conferencing facilities and a casino - indeed, that may well be necessary to ensure the necessary occupancy rates for a build of the type that's envisaged. If developers/operators baulk at the expense in the current climate, then we now have a precedent for CFG itself stepping in to help drive a project forward in those circumstances.

Of course, we need to wait and see what happens. But I think there are grounds to at least have genuine hope that the arena might kick-start the Collar Site development for which, it seems, we've been waiting forever.

The RFL finally completing its move to Etihad Campus is good news, too. And we should remember that they're also building a training pitch with a small spectator stand at the Beswick Hub. Hopefully that, with other developments, might encourage more sports bodies to relocate to the Campus, as the Eastlands Regeneration Framework intends and tempt an education provider into a partnership for the Innovation Zone after MMU welched on its deal.

 

[StrutterBlue]

....our next kit will be GREEN.

It's the future doncha know

I wish my stock portfolio was green

 

[remember arthur mann]

And look what happened during the last financial crisis, the Sheik made a huge killing investing in Barclays Bank.

The rich and clever look forward to recessions!

It's all manufactured.

 

[Centurions]

It was 2008 when Manchester City Council first raised the prospect of redeveloping land around the stadium in conjunction with City's new owners. At that point, I had a couple of very good contacts who were well placed to provide information who are no longer in the same posts.

I believe the intention at that stage was for Abu Dhabi to give the project a helping hand by investing in it as a prestige project rather than on strictly commercial terms as well as to assist in other ways. One example of the latter was that state-owned Abu Dhabi companies were intended office space in a new development to house their European HQs and help kick-start the Etihad Campus development project.

I was told that, in 2012, things changed politically in Abu Dhabi. Projects overseas were now to pay their own way rather than receiving beneficial treatment for reasons of prestige. Unfortunately, in the age of austerity, CFG were unable to find partners willing to enter into a relationship on acceptable commercial terms. Forget ideas that the economy was still growing. Incomes for many people were falling in real terms, meaning that leisure operators saw such projects as a risk given that such a large proportion of the prospective punters were really having to tighten their belts.

The arena will hopefully be a game-changer in that respect, by drawing large numbers of people to the site and making other development viable. It will already be a game-changer in terms of the offer for fans attending the stadium: in an interview with Tim Leiweke of OVG (the entertainment giant behind the arena) in this week's Sunday Times, it was stated that the new venue will include "32 bars, restaurants and clubs" which will be open on matchday.

That interview with Leiweke also contained the following snippet of information regarding OVG's prospective construction of an arena in Cardiff:



He isn't playing a waiting game in Manchester because the construction of Co-op Live has never been put on hold, albeit that construction is behind schedule. So what's different in God's own city that doesn't apply in the Welsh capital? Could it be that, back in May 2021, CFG agreed to become a 50/50 joint venture partner, meaning that increased costs and future risks are shared.

CFG, then, evidently believe in this project. The next step is probably a hotel. It makes sense, as mooted in this thread, for the hotel to incorporate conferencing facilities and a casino - indeed, that may well be necessary to ensure the necessary occupancy rates for a build of the type that's envisaged. If developers/operators baulk at the expense in the current climate, then we now have a precedent for CFG itself stepping in to help drive a project forward in those circumstances.

Of course, we need to wait and see what happens. But I think there are grounds to at least have genuine hope that the arena might kick-start the Collar Site development for which, it seems, we've been waiting forever.

The RFL finally completing its move to Etihad Campus is good news, too. And we should remember that they're also building a training pitch with a small spectator stand at the Beswick Hub. Hopefully that, with other developments, might encourage more sports bodies to relocate to the Campus, as the Eastlands Regeneration Framework intends and tempt an education provider into a partnership for the Innovation Zone after MMU welched on its deal.

If the CFG hadn't agreed to become a 50/50 joint venture partner in Co-op Live I suspect that we would have ended up with a big hole in the ground for the next 10 years, which is a disquieting thought. Can't disagree with the hotel going forward now either as a logical extension, although that's possibly a bit more fluid at the moment. Who knew we'd be where we are at this moment in time just 3 years ago.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

It was 2008 when Manchester City Council first raised the prospect of redeveloping land around the stadium in conjunction with City's new owners. At that point, I had a couple of very good contacts who were well placed to provide information who are no longer in the same posts.

I believe the intention at that stage was for Abu Dhabi to give the project a helping hand by investing in it as a prestige project rather than on strictly commercial terms as well as to assist in other ways. One example of the latter was that state-owned Abu Dhabi companies were intended office space in a new development to house their European HQs and help kick-start the Etihad Campus development project.

Great post and informative as always.

Just for some more context about 2008. On the day the takeover was announced Marty Edelman (New York attorney who had worked on a series of Abu Dhabi projects since 2002) was with Sheikh Mansour and was invited on to the board by Khaldoon the following day.

He describes in "Killing the Game" meeting Bernstein and Leese on his very first visit to Manchester and the land acquisition process started within months of the takeover. A direct quote from Edelman:
"It was clear we needed to buy a lot of land around the Stadium to make sure we could do things that we didn't know we wanted to yet. We wanted to keep it fairly secret because we didn't want the prices to skyrocket"

 

[Gone for a Burton]

Great post and informative as always.

Just for some more context about 2008. On the day the takeover was announced Marty Edelman (New York attorney who had worked on a series of Abu Dhabi projects since 2002) was with Sheikh Mansour and was invited on to the board by Khaldoon the following day.

He describes in "Killing the Game" meeting Bernstein and Leese on his very first visit to Manchester and the land acquisition process started within months of the takeover. A direct quote from Edelman:
"It was clear we needed to buy a lot of land around the Stadium to make sure we could do things that we didn't know we wanted to yet. We wanted to keep it fairly secret because we didn't want the prices to skyrocket"

Marty Edelman has just announced that NYC will start building a brand new 25000 seater stadium, hotel and 2500 home in Queens.....$780m !!

 

[bluesmith]

If the CFG hadn't agreed to become a 50/50 joint venture partner in Co-op Live I suspect that we would have ended up with a big hole in the ground for the next 10 years, which is a disquieting thought. Can't disagree with the hotel going forward now either as a logical extension, although that's possibly a bit more fluid at the moment. Who knew we'd be where we are at this moment in time just 3 years ago.

Contracts had long been signed before Citys involvement became official. I think it was early Feb 2020 Bam got the nod.