EU referendum

[BigJoe#1]

so who's arse are you up Johnsons or Farages - as you are just as one eyed in your comments and just as dismissive. Personally think you both have strong views and its nowt to do with being up anyone's arse but you raised it.

Thanks for that endorsement from someone sitting firmly on the fence PMSL!

 

[mcfc1632]

I'm really sympathetic to the "out" vote primarily over the sense that we don't get a fair deal compared to our contribution and fear over border security.. but I voted "in" Two principal reasons: 1. We can always vote out later. 2. The Italian proverb: If you aren't at the table, you are on the menu. I'd rather we were at the table.

As referenced/inferred in my post reminding people of Cameron's view on Juncker - the horrible position we are in now is (IMO) much worse - we are at the table and we have to pay an unfair share of the bill - but we are not able to select the courses ordered and we get simply ignored when we try to speak up and get our preferences into what is being ordered

 

[Tim of the Oak]

So Keiron Conway a self confessed IRA man knows who's responsible for the Birmingham bombings, acknowledges that the authorities in Ireland and the UK know who are responsible but he won't name names publicly (fair enough).

However these individuals who live in Ireland cannot be extradited. Please remind me of the benefits of being in the EU? Yet again we've been let down by the EU!

So this is the fault of the EU and not our Government who wrote to IRA terrorists giving them a clean slate. We have European arrest warrant agreements across the UK. Al Qaeda terrorists have been arrested in Italy and no end of Salford gangsters have been brought back from Spain.

Why don't we focus on the facts. Four times Gove (as Minister for Education) stopped schools from getting essential new buildings through sheer incompetence. Is this the sort of guy you want running the Country?

 

[mcfc1632]

Those people died fighting , racism, xenophobia, a nation attaching and murdering immigrants and basing its politics on division. Churchill their leader was one of the most pro europe leaders this country will ever have. He would be turning on his grave at the Mosely like rhetoric of the outers and the division they seek to sew as would many many who died .

As for sovereignty of that nature it has not existed for a century and William Blake style poetry calling for us to turn the world back a century to the Victorian days and believing it could happen is touchingly naiive and in a way quite sweet.

Wow - to blanket-infer that 'outers' should be considered to be like Mosely (IMO) at a stroke renders any of your posts to be mutterings of an extreme thinker that swings in the wind desperately seeking any point (fanciful and insulting or not) that (in your view) supports your argument.

At a different level of nonsense - seeking to infer Churchill would be someone pro-EU in its current form is also desperate

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Inners claiming high ground because of Churchill and the war are scraping the barrel.

Compared to Brexiters claiming the EU is responsible for the IRA. No comparison!!!

 

[EalingBlue2]

Pp

There is new evidence and these people are associated but they cannot and will not be. I genuinely thought the strength of the EU was to enable such extraditions to happen. Rather than blaming the EU I am asking why this is the case? It is within the remit and a major selling point of the EU that this extradition agreement is in place.

Anyway, listen to the UK news and you'll catch up, there's a good chap!

Because countries have far more influence about this that's you pretend and because basic rules of evidence and process apply and because if there is no hope of conviction the extradition will never be applied for. As it hasn't been formerly applied for how can the EU be blamed for something that hasn't been requested. One of thailands most wanted criminals and a terrorist wanted by the US remain in Ireland because they have control through their courts of extradition .
I have seen the news decisions are being made on whether to re-open inquests closed because the West Midlands police caught the perpetrators so quickly and easily , if they are then there may be a chance that new evidence will come to light, then there may be a chance that police will want to interview someone, then there may be a chance that extradition could be requested , then there may be a chance it will be reviewed by an Irish court etc etc.

In attempting to Demonise the EU and blame the EU for everything you are drawing many conclusions, drawing a long bow and blaming the EU for allowing too much sovereignty which is ironic since you usually argue they are taking sovereignty. Which means you will argue against yourself if it means you can blame it on the EU.

Let's wait and see what happens... I suspect the British and the police would love it all to be swept away as the evidence was so damning from the lasts require it has been locked away till 2069

 

[BigJoe#1]

So this is the fault of the EU and not our Government who wrote to IRA terrorists giving them a clean slate. We have European arrest warrant agreements across the UK. Al Qaeda terrorists have been arrested in Italy and no end of Salford gangsters have been brought back from Spain.

Why don't we focus on the facts. Four times Gove (as Minister for Education) stopped schools from getting essential new buildings through sheer incompetence. Is this the sort of guy you want running the Country?

Only thing I can say to this Tim is I agree wholeheartedly that Gove is a complete and utter tosspot and is not fit to run thus country, but no more a tosspot or less fit to run this country than Cameron and Osborne.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

One word Cibaman - STEALTH!

How on earth did we get from a common market where everyone could sell goods to each other to where we are today?

True some stealth was involved. That said, we would have protested more had we not been shifting from an economic basket case, where power cuts meant we used candles for lighting, to our current position of being the fifth biggest economy in the World!

 

[EalingBlue2]

Wow - to blanket-infer that 'outers' should be considered to be like Mosely (IMO) at a stroke renders any of your posts to be mutterings of an extreme thinker that swings in the wind desperately seeking any point (fanciful and insulting or not) that (in your view) supports your argument.

At a different level of nonsense - seeking to infer Churchill would be someone pro-EU in its current form is also desperate

He was in terms of his day about as pro European as you could get, in today's terms he made kinnock look like Farage.

No one should be claiming the millions who fought in WW2 as all fighting for one reason and it was people claiming that the military/ population fought to protect us from immigration and bodies like the EU is laughable.

Again the outers make an outrageous claim and when it is contradicted they get all indignant. In very few cases has it been an inner who has made the first assertion about these types of things.

Simple contradiction of misinformation is sadly all that is needed in a Brexit campaign which is surely coming off the rails?

 

[BigJoe#1]

Compared to Brexiters claiming the EU is responsible for the IRA. No comparison!!!

Jesus Navas Tim.... and EB2 accuses me of drawing long sighted conclusions....?