EU referendum

[bluethrunthru]

We are having a referendum now. If the situation has been changed completely in 5/10 years (just as we're now in a European Union rather than a Common Market) then why would another referendum be a bad thing? As I've said, if the EU continues with the UK on its current status quo, I am happy to be a part of it if that is the will of the UK people. If the status quo changes then is it wrong to assume the feelings of the UK people may have changed?

Yes, a majority of people voted either Tory, UKIP or Green - all of whom were offering a referendum.

Back on the scaremongering G20, has anyone actually said why there would be a shock to the global economy in the event of an out vote? The BBC article I've read doesn't mention it and it's a crucial difference between scaremongering and genuine concern.

Because the idea of a referendum now is to decide whether to stay or go - if that decision is to stay we then elect and trust politicians to negotiate and establish our place in the EU going forward - exactly in the same was that if we came out we would elect and trust politicians to negotiate our place in the wider world. You can't be having a referendum every 5 years or nothing will ever be resolved and there will be continual mistrust of the UK economy in the world.

 

[EalingBlue2]

I explained why they have a vested interest. Argue the point.

I believe that the vast majority campaigning in or out are doing it out of personal interest.

I am still yet to see any In campaigner give a list of benefits of being in the EU that would not be possible with us outside the EU.

I am yet to meet a human being who doesn't act in self interest, though often they act in a believed self interest and not a real self interest

You haven't seen it because you honestly believe and say in your comments that everything could be fine outside the EU as you believe in it like a religion. Talk to a Devout Christian and everything is possible in heaven .

 

[EalingBlue2]

Because the idea of a referendum now is to decide whether to stay or go - if that decision is to stay we then elect and trust politicians to negotiate and establish our place in the EU going forward - exactly in the same was that if we came out we would elect and trust politicians to negotiate our place in the wider world. You can't be having a referendum every 5 years or nothing will ever be resolved and there will be continual mistrust of the UK economy in the world.

This is why this whole thing will harm Britain so much win or lose. A bitter bunch of losers will talk down the Uk and play the blame game for a decade to come and will try to exploit it. Hedge funds etc will fund uncertainty and more talent will probably leave (either way than stay) markets hate uncertainty and will have it for ten years.

Britain has fucked itself and I am not sure a vote either way can now change that fact.

 

[EalingBlue2]

The readers of this forum in no way reflect the general public, unless the public are now 95% male

The readers of this forum reflect a very very biased demographic , in age , geography, etc this forum in no way reflects the overall population. Not only 95% male but also 99% City fans

 

[EalingBlue2]

To take you up on your point about Rolls Royce. Surely it's all down to individual Businesses to asses their position. Take for example Aston Martin; why would they choose, at this moment of great uncertainty and huge risk (as the inner would have us believe) to invest so heavily if there was even a small chance it would fail? These people are paid a hell of a lot of money to make decisions, the right decisions. 750 jobs are to be created directly as a result of this investment - it kind of punches a hole in the speculative argument that it is a risk does it not?

750 jobs in a 70m person economy and one CEO is like pissing off the Pembrokeshire coast and wondering if it will effect a cod fisherman in Newfoundland (probably a very poor underworked one)

 

[Tim of the Oak]

I think they would come here if there wasn't work though. By the end of this parliament our minimum wage will be £7.20 per hour which works out at just under €1,500 a month at full time. You would assume that cost of living would rise with that and thus the amount of benefits paid would also increase. Amongst current EU countries, that's a better wage than the average wage in Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary, Lithuania, Latvia, Slovakia, Poland, Croatia, Czech Republic, Estonia, Portugal, Malta, Greece and Slovenia. In short, they could work an average amount in their home country or sit in their pants in the UK and get 'paid' the same. They may well take a few years of hardship (sharing a room and having very low living costs) to reap those rewards.

I do agree that most benefit bums are UK citizens, but I don't see why we should keep the possibility open for EU residents to make the most of our very generous welfare system.

Fair points CityStu and yes the living wage could well be a powerful carrot! Leading on from this, I would really like to see this Country commit to developing the skills of our people. We need to be filling skills gaps.

I spend a lot of my working life helping organisations to grow their own work forces from the local community (as far as possible).

In some Sectors, we have a behavioural problem where recruiters enjoy the perks of travellibg throughout Europe and across the globe to recruit. If the same effort went in to identifying and developing local talented people then I still think fewer (low / semi-skilled) people would come here here because of reduced job prospects.

 

[BigJoe#1]

750 jobs in a 70m person economy and one CEO is like pissing off the Pembrokeshire coast and wondering if it will effect a cod fisherman in Newfoundland (probably a very poor underworked one)

Just one example to show the fear and scaremongering is not totally justified. perhaps the EU supporters can provide similar examples of firms closingup sand moving out? If and when theydo iI'm sure your analogy will lend equal weight to the argument, somewhere between very little and none!

 

[hgblue]

The readers of this forum reflect a very very biased demographic , in age , geography, etc this forum in no way reflects the overall population. Not only 95% male but also 99% City fans

I don't understand this argument. Are City fans more Eurosceptic than the general population?

 

[EalingBlue2]

I don't understand this argument. Are City fans more Eurosceptic than the general population?

No idea, it's a fairy simple and obvious statistical fact that this board doesn't fairly represent the UK population

 

[hgblue]

No idea, it's a fairy simple and obvious statistical fact that this board doesn't fairly represent the UK population

Fair enough.