EU referendum

EU referendum

  • In

    Votes: 503 47.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 547 52.1%
  • Total voters
    1,050
Status
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blueonblue said:
Yet you contradict your very well made point by stating that their are "Millions of foreigners here doing those jobs", and thats the real bug bare for many people.

What are "Our" unskilled to do when cheap migrant labour is filling those jobs ?, not only are they not earning to contribute tax & ni, but are a further drain on the benefit system, you can not force them into work when there is none, without the flood of cheap migrant labour these jobs would be available, THEN the job centers could sent claimants to available jobs and if they did not want to take them cut the benefits.

Most people have had to do jobs they hated just to put food on the table, its a great motivator to improve your lot by learning or finding a better way to earn a living.

The idiots that cry "Racism and little Englander" are an affront to common sense, any finite resource is effected by the numbers.
Click to expand...

Seriously? If you just stop and go back to the beginning of your point, why did the migrants move here in the first place? Maybe I'm reading this wrong but are you really suggesting that English people are on benefits because foreigners are in their jobs? Why were the jobs available in the first place?! Or was the poor Englishman sacked so the job could be given to the migrant? And if that's what you believe then it would also be useful to look at the correlation between Englishman and women on befits with migration statistics because surely you'd see a correlation over the years of migrant spikes coupled with a spike in English folk claiming benefits? Unemployment has dropped, benefit claimants have dropped yet migration has increased so how do you explain that?
 
THE QUEEN BACKS BREXIT!

Is the headline in today's Sun.

It was always obvious but I'm glad she has come out and said it.

No knighthood for that turncoat Cameron and his ilk..hopefully.
 
Monkfish said:
Had a quick look back and it appears to be mostly the 'outers' accusing the 'inners' of being racist, especially left wing 'inners' but hey ho, maybe you see something I cant

As for uncontrolled mass immigration suppose the best argument is that the most successful countries in human history have been the ones with the most immigrants, and the insular countries have usually been poor relations/basket cases

Not sure if its chicken and egg, success leads to immigrants rather than immigrants lead to success, probably a bit of both, either way you should be pretty happy about being lucky enough to have been born in such a place that people will risk death trying to get to
Click to expand...
The real reasons for mass immigration are.

U.K. Economic growth in working age population and net contributing population comes mainly from inflation and immigration factors so to maintain growth, tax revenues, protect government spending and attack deficit mass immigration has been required .

This protects the UK also from the demographic time bomb, immigrants on average are early in their career so have tax paying wealth creating potential and that is used to fund the ageing UK population for health and retirement.

The FT had a great analysis from 1995 to 2011 showing Eu immigration added a net contribution of 8.8bn to UK coffers for example. The drain on the UK coffers from native Britains in that time was 604bn (obviously not like for like as one population was exponentially bigger than the other)

It was also demonstrated that those industries with a higher % of immigrant workers had higher productivity concluding each X 1% rise in immigration brought an incremental 0.07% productivity improvement .

Other arguments around diversity, skill based, demand, labour flexibility, lowering the age of population, specialist requirements in certain sectors etc can also be made.

There is also the reality that digital, globalisation and technology Have made competition , capitalism etc truly global and anyone who truly believes in capitalism and globalisation actually should support the free movement of capital and labour and therefore immigration for economic reasons. It is somewhat ironic that it is really the left that should oppose immigration and the right who should be supporting capitalism if true to principles

With digitisation , the taxation issues around transfer pricing , global freeing up of capital etc the March of history is towards greater movement of people and capital, bigger trading blocks , global rules etc and that is a tide that cannot be stopped.
 
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EalingBlue2 said:
The real reasons for mass immigration are.

U.K. Economic growth in working age population and net contributing population comes mainly from inflation and immigration factors so to maintain growth, tax revenues, protect government spending and attack deficit mass immigration has been required .

This protects the UK also from the demographic time bomb, immigrants on average are early in their career so have tax paying wealth creating potential and that is used to fund the ageing UK population for health and retirement.

The FT had a great analysis from 1995 to 2011 showing Eu immigration added a net contribution of 8.8bn to UK coffers for example. The drain on the UK coffers from native Britains in that time was 604bn (obviously not like for like as one population was exponentially bigger than the other)

It was also demonstrated that those industries with a higher % of immigrant workers had higher productivity concluding each X 1% rise in immigration brought an incremental 0.07% productivity improvement .

Other arguments around diversity, skill based, demand, labour flexibility, lowering the age of population, specialist requirements in certain sectors etc can also be made.

There is also the reality that digital, globalisation and technology Have made competition , capitalism etc truly global and anyone who truly believes in capitalism and globalisation actually should support the free movement of capital and labour and therefore immigration for economic reasons. It is somewhat ironic that it is really the left that should oppose immigration and the right who should be supporting capitalism if true to principles

With digitisation , the taxation issues around transfer pricing , global freeing up of capital etc the March of history is towards greater movement of people and capital, bigger trading blocks , global rules etc and that is a tide that cannot be stopped.
Click to expand...

Ahh so you're a Blairite. That was his reasoning to the letter. I don't think anybody is arguing that some immigration is not a good thing including UKIP but unfettered immigration just leads to overcrowding as people from the poorer states flock to the richer states for benefits of work and standard of living as well as the free loading. If the infrastructure can cope with it then fine but it's struggling at the moment and on its present course can only get worse. I'll leave out the problem of incompatible religion as that is a subject in itself.
 
balotelli's back pocket said:
WHO GIVES A FUCK would be my response
Click to expand...

Depends on your age and patriotism I suppose. Anyway I for one hope it has legs.


"Buckingham Palace last night moved to deny extraordinary claims that the Queen backs Brexit in the EU referendum.

She is said to have told former Lib Dem leader Nick Clegg during a lunch at Windsor Castle that she thought Europe was going in the wrong direction, according to The Sun.

A source told the paper the pro-EU then deputy PM was reprimanded by the Queen – who is politically neutral in public – for ‘quite a while’ over the issue of Europe.

Mr Clegg last night said he had ‘no recollection’ of such a conversation and branded the story ‘nonsense’ but did not offer an outright denial.

The paper does not specify exactly when the meeting took place, other than it was in 2011.

According to official Court Circular records, Mr Clegg was a guest at Windsor Castle for a Council with the Queen on April 7 that year.

Buckingham Palace said in a strongly-worded statement last night: ‘The Queen remains politically neutral, as she has for 63 years. We would never comment on spurious, anonymously-sourced claims.

‘The referendum will be a matter for the British people.’

However, the suggestion that the Queen is sympathetic to Euroscepticism will intrigue many people. Her intervention during the Scottish independence referendum in September 2014 proved explosive.

She warned well-wishers after a Sunday church service that voters should ‘think very carefully’ before making a decision on whether to become independent.


With the EU referendum taking place on June 23, her every word is likely to be pored over for clues about her feelings towards a possible split.

According to The Sun, the Queen told Mr Clegg she thought Europe was going the wrong way. However, from the report, it was not clear that the paper’s source actually heard the conversation.

‘People who heard their conversation were left in no doubt at all about the Queen’s views on European integration,’ the unnamed source told the newspaper. ‘It was really something, and it went on for quite a while. The EU is clearly something Her Majesty feels passionately about.’



On another occasion, according to the paper, a Parliamentarian asked the Queen what her thoughts on Brussels, to which she replied: ‘I don’t understand Europe.’

A parliamentary source said: ‘It was said with quite some venom and emotion. I shall never forget it.’

Last night Mr Clegg told The Sun: ‘I have absolutely no recollection of it. I don’t have a photographic memory. But I would have remembered something as stark or significant as you have made it out to be.

‘No doubt you’ll speak to someone else and they’ll say, “I was there, I heard it”. Fine. But I really can’t remember it at all.

‘Anyway, without sounding pompous, I find it rather distasteful to reveal conversations with the Queen.’


Last night Mr Clegg tweeted: ‘As I told the journalist this is nonsense. I’ve no recollection of this happening and it’s not the sort of thing I would forget.’

Tory MP Jacob Rees-Mogg told the paper: ‘I’d be delighted if this was true and Her Majesty is a Brexiter. The reason we all sing God Save The Queen so heartily is we believe she is there to protect us from European encroachment.’

The Palace had no choice but to stop short of an outright public denial that the Queen was in favour of Brexit because of her constitutional political neutrality.

Whoever reported her alleged comments will be deemed to have broken the convention that private conversations with the Queen are not publicly reported."

Jacob Rees-Mogg...... LMFAO
 
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Well, apparently, the racist, fascist EU is starting to remove all these valuable immigrants from Western Europe, so they've obviously
not read of the untold benefits that mass immigration brings on here.
 
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