EU referendum

[Tim of the Oak]

See it means you are not a racist...............................................................


Or are you?

I fell foul of Urmston's definition of a racist earlier in the thread.

Something about Gisela Stuart being a bit confused!

 

[Matty]

Why, we will still be in 'Europe' or is the uk moving to Africa, signing players is a geographical thing not a political thing.

Not really the most important part of the In/Out debate but you're wrong.

Signing players, in some circumstances, is directly affected by politics, or more importantly labour laws.

Take Kevin De Bruyne for example, he's Belgian, Belgium are part of the EU, so when we signed him he was free to move unencumbered to the UK to work. Now, if De Bruyne had been South American, or for that matter Serbian, he wouldn';t have been free to move to the UK, he have needed to meet certain criteria (relating to international appearances and the quality of his national side) before he was granted a work permit to play for Manchester City. Now, for De Bruyne, this work permit route wouldn't have been an issue as both he and his country meet the criteria. Nolito however may not, were we to sign him. Spain certainly meet the quality criteria, but Nolito will not have played often enough for Spain over the last 2 years to qualify. So it's entirely possible that Nolito could be refused a work permit (in reality that won't happen as there will no doubt be an interim period at first however, after a period of time, that would be the scenario).

All of that is before we consider the impact on the academy. The Garcias, Brahim, Angelino, Ambrose etc would all be unable to join our academy. They'd be too young to be allowed to work here if we were outside of the EU, and they'd certainly fail to meet any criteria set for gaining a work permit at such a young age.

As I said, this is a miniscule issue in the grand scheme of things, but the fact you think being "in Europe" is the same as being "in the EU" is a little frightening given there will likely be thousands who hold a similar view and will be voting based on this completely flawed "understanding".

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Maybe. Can we assume that the half who voted to leave the UK will be voting to stay in the EU, and vice versa?...it's a fucked up world1

Difficult, but Scotland is generally considered to be Euro-friendly.

 

[Blue Mooner]

Legislation requests almost inevitably and 100% until fairly recently coming from the democratically elected council of ministers

Think there was a typo in this but if I understood you correctly you are absolutely and unequivocally wrong to suggest the council has any influence on legislation. They only play a part in 'approving' legislation drafted by the completely unelected commission bureaucrats. http://ec.europa.eu/atwork/decision-making/index_en.htm

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Think there was a typo in this but if I understood you correctly you are absolutely and unequivocally wrong to suggest the council has any influence on legislation. They only play a part in 'approving' legislation drafted by the completely unelected commission bureaucrats. http://ec.europa.eu/atwork/decision-making/index_en.htm

In a previous working life, I provided the Commission with proposed legislative changes to the European Wirking Time Directive that they progressed. I was working for the UK Government (under Ministerial Cover).

 

[EalingBlue2]

So that negates Scotland?

Is that more than snp , plaid and lib Dems?

 

[Blue Mooner]

The way it works is that the European Commission (and the Council for that matter) think through what MEPS are likely to agree to before progressing legislation.

It's far from perfect but the Commission don't just make up legislation. They consult with the Council of Ministers and the Social Partners!

That's as maybe the case but none of the European electorate have been able to vote on a proposed legislation for government and choose which legislation and policies most closely suits their needs. No better example of this than Jean Claude Juncker's confidence of saying we have the best deal we can get.

If that's a mode of government you favour, fair enough, but I want the people to be able to kick out a government whos legislative programme they don't agree with.

Our grandfather's fought to keep us free from a dictatorship

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Think there was a typo in this but if I understood you correctly you are absolutely and unequivocally wrong to suggest the council has any influence on legislation. They only play a part in 'approving' legislation drafted by the completely unelected commission bureaucrats. http://ec.europa.eu/atwork/decision-making/index_en.htm

Eh? That site says

• proposals are written (usually by unelected civil servants at the instruction of the government)
• the nations Council (government ministers) and the Parliament decide whether to adopt them

That's not that different from the British system is it? Laws proposed, argued, and a final form created.

Having approval must surely be influence.

 

[EalingBlue2]

Think there was a typo in this but if I understood you correctly you are absolutely and unequivocally wrong to suggest the council has any influence on legislation. They only play a part in 'approving' legislation drafted by the completely unelected commission bureaucrats. http://ec.europa.eu/atwork/decision-making/index_en.htm

Approve and drive the focus

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Is that more than snp , plaid and lib Dems?

Dunno. Including the Scottish Labour vote though will help, and the Scottish Conservative leader came over very well.

I was merely pointing out that saying UKIP gives Leave a haadstart can be offset by Scotland probably being Remain.